Would you hunt with a operator hunting illegaly?

[grand veneur]

I guess you miss the point. It not about the client, but who was doing a illegal hunt in a country he was not licensed for. Sorry you can not see that.

I already understood that, but the report talked for too long about the consequences for the victim, consequences that were certainly to be expected.

So let's talk about how it can be possible for someone to organize hunts illegally in the neighboring country and only mention in passing the victims which are not the topic but who allow themselves to be deceived in their ignorance.

 

[geoff rath]

Only if I were hunting dodgy politicians, or bent lawyers

 

[Dewald]

Longtime permanent resident

Thank you for clarifying Lon.

Dewald, I speak under correction, but think one of Zim's most famous PH's, John Sharp is a South African. Born in Cape Town if I have it correct.

You are correct Marius. I think born in Kroonstad, and grew up in Cape Town. I know he was in the Rhodesian military as well when he arrived there. Read his book earlier this year. GREAT READ!

 

[Tokoloshe Safaris]

No I do not think I want to waste my time trying to explain. My only thoughts were how to keep from members from being burned. Like a hunter who bought a hunt from a trolling agent agent paid 20k client paid him 60k plus accompanying agent expenses.

No some people are blind to the facts.

 

[Tokoloshe Safaris]

Since there are comments about John Sharp. You would have to look hard to find a better gentleman and hunter than John.

 

[WAB]

I ran into some RSA PH’s scoping out a Zim PH’s concession in Zim. Very shady, they were not licensed to hunt in Zim and actually did buy the Zim PH’s concession out from under him. I suspect that they hired Zim PH’s to make things legal for the hunts. Bottom line, I would ask a lot of questions if an RSA outfitter were trying to sell me a hunt in Zim. Some are legit, and some are definitely not.

 

[Tokoloshe Safaris]

As I wrote earlier I have no desire trying to explain.

Here are a few requirements for a zim operator:
1. Tourism license, which has many requirements. I will try to remember a few:

Letter from bank stating you have accounts and held in high esteem.
Copy of your hunting lease
National I D
Equipment list
PH license
Tax id number
Directors list
Bank account
Account with zim reserve bank
Tax clearance
And about 100 other things

We watched one fine european loose over 1/2 million US in trophy fees alone to a foreign operator, who later faked his death. I have the dead operators phone # & current address.

 

[BRICKBURN]

......
One good indicator that something is not as it seems your PH has removed his number plates!

..... and you're asked to wait in the car, with it running, as he strolls into the bank. He'll just be minute.

 

[BRICKBURN]

As I wrote earlier I have no desire trying to explain.

Here are a few requirements for a zim operator:
1. Tourism license, which has many requirements. I will try to remember a few:

Letter from bank stating you have accounts and held in high esteem.
Copy of your hunting lease
National I D
Equipment list
PH license
Tax id number
Directors list
Bank account
Account with zim reserve bank
Tax clearance
And about 100 other things

We watched one fine european loose over 1/2 million US in trophy fees alone to a foreign operator, who later faked his death. I have the dead operators phone # & current address.

So, what does a legitimate Zimbabwe Tourism License look like?

 

[Tokoloshe Safaris]

Brickburn , my wife and I are in RSA i am going thru advanced cancer treatment. Not sure when I will make it back to zim but I will try to send it to you as a PM. If i post it it will be copied, doctored and used illegaly.

 

[Mark A Ouellette]

i am going thru advanced cancer treatment

Lon, I and probably most of us did not know.
May you have a smooth recovery. I will be thinking of you.

Mark

 

[Tokoloshe Safaris]

Hi Brickburn,

Punch ZTA and you should see a blank copy. I guess all of the illegal operators already have it so no big deal

 

[Tokoloshe Safaris]

Lon, I and probably most of us did not know.
May you have a smooth recovery. I will be thinking of you.

Mark

Thank you Mark, one thing I can say this sure as hell is not sloan Kettering. What is left of my sense of humor is not going to be wasted on arrogant idiots.

 

[Ridge Runner]

Odd thread. Read it thru, but see no stories from the OP yet. I think a better question would be, would you hunt illegally knowingly.
To which I am certain would be a hard no from all here.

I would hope a hard and honest no reply from all. But, I can neither say yes or no. Because I have unwittingly and knew there was a slight possibility hunted on private property without permission.

In the case involving TWRA and TVA, for many years there has been a dispute over where the property lines were that separated public hunting land and a certain private property. Until TWRA (Tennessee Wildlife Resources Agency) and TVA (Tennessee Valley Authority) had finally reached a breaking point with the illegal acts of the private property leasee. At which point TWRA and TVA, acquired the property deed of the land owner. Then TWRA agents along with TVA representatives "strongly encouraged " the property leasee to "join them" in marking the complete legal boundary lines that separated the two properties.

The private property leasee was henceforth band from trespassing onto this area of TVA / TWRA-WMA land. As he would be arrested and charged with felony trespassing.

Like I stated earlier this situation had been going on for years and I am just giving a brief narrative of what the end result is and how it came about.

As for knowingly (and unwillfully) participating in a certain illegal hunting manner. That I can not (will not) confirm nor deny. Nor will I divulge the details nor area where it may or may not have taken place.

I knew the reputation of this area before I moved into it. The locals also ("thought they") knew my reputation, (they only knew a tiny amount of my background)

It was a "good choice" situation. As now I was accepted into the community. And the community protected its own.

Somewhat sadly and regrettably,I don't live there anymore. But still accepted as a good neighbor and friend.

This area because of the "locals" "game management program" has the healthiest deer herd, and bigger bucks than any county of the state!!!
Such fond memories that I can still recall.

 

[Wheels]

Brickburn , my wife and I are in RSA i am going thru advanced cancer treatment. Not sure when I will make it back to zim but I will try to send it to you as a PM. If i post it it will be copied, doctored and used illegaly.

Lon

Prayers for a full recovery.

 

[BRICKBURN]

Brickburn , my wife and I are in RSA i am going thru advanced cancer treatment. Not sure when I will make it back to zim but I will try to send it to you as a PM. If i post it it will be copied, doctored and used illegaly.

Spot on.
I'll send you my email.

Thanks for taking the time out during treatment to help out.
I am hoping for a quick remission for you.

 

[Ridge Runner]

You are known by the company you keep.

No.

Maybe Yes.
Maybe No.
It's all a facade! a persona!

If your best friend is a multi millionaire (and you are not) should people be duped into you also being a multi millionaire?

Or

Just the opposite: you are neither "rich" nor "poor", but you have acceptted friends that are both.

There are extreme and moral/ethical/minimal limits to everything and everyone!

My question to you; and really everyone that I meet or associate, intermingle with is:

Do you try to please or be accepted by everyone?

Or

Do you please yourself by being accepted by those that matter by your standards?
By your morals/ ethics?

(Rhetorical question) What are your standards? Are they preceived by others as weak, strong, immoral, etc,?

Where do people draw the "perverbial line in the sand".?

I'm not picking on you directly @baxterb, in fact you have asked/ given the almost perfect response by which I can quite possibly not open people's minds to.

Thus I commend for allowing/affording me the opportunity to vent my extremism against so called: "popular opinionism".

 

[mark-hunter]

No one would book a Wyoming elk hunt with a Texas whitetail outfitter so I’m not sure why this situation is so common in Southern Africa.

Good point.
I have seen a number of south African outfitters offering hunts in Zimbabwe and other countries.
I wonder how this works?!

 

[baxterb]

Maybe Yes.
Maybe No.
It's all a facade! a persona!

If your best friend is a multi millionaire (and you are not) should people be duped into you also being a multi millionaire?

Or

Just the opposite: you are neither "rich" nor "poor", but you have acceptted friends that are both.

There are extreme and moral/ethical/minimal limits to everything and everyone!

My question to you; and really everyone that I meet or associate, intermingle with is:

Do you try to please or be accepted by everyone?

Or

Do you please yourself by being accepted by those that matter by your standards?
By your morals/ ethics?

(Rhetorical question) What are your standards? Are they preceived by others as weak, strong, immoral, etc,?

Where do people draw the "perverbial line in the sand".?

I'm not picking on you directly @baxterb, in fact you have asked/ given the almost perfect response by which I can quite possibly not open people's minds to.

Thus I commend for allowing/affording me the opportunity to vent my extremism against so called: "popular opinionism".

I'm glad you vented!

And the 'Known by the company you keep' to me and everyone I know who uses it (including my mother who introduced me to it first) was that it largely referred to character - the 'type' of person you are.

I please myself and associate with those who have similar morals/character. There are many instances in my life where I simply picked up and left an association due to lack of character, etc. I have few, but very, very good friends.

 

[Tokoloshe Safaris]

Reading some of the previous I wonder if I have entered the twilight zone.

Mark you are on the right path.