Politics

[PARA45]

They're doing the debate in hopes that Trump says something they can use, twist, edit, etc. No matter what they'll say Biden did great. Trump needs to remain calm, not interrupt which should be impossible, get in a couple of shots, counter with hard facts and mainly be boring.

+1. Yes, and I hope he listens to his advisors, that is why they get paid the big bucks.

 

[CJW]

20 dead so far in Russia. I read a report that the priest was beheaded but don't know if it's true. Doesn't really matter.

Death Toll in Attacks in Southern Russia Rises to 20, Officials Say

Investigators called the assaults, which targeted synagogues and churches in the Dagestan region, an act of terrorism. It was not immediately clear who was responsible.

www.nytimes.com

 

[Brent in Az]

CNN has already declared Biden the winner of the debate

 

[BJH65]

Sincere question...

how does being in the top 10% income bracket (your position by your statement) differ from being in the top 5% income bracket (where you appear to believe people become no longer in touch with working class folks)? Neither are within the "working class" any longer at either of those income brackets..

and how does education level impact this? I get the argument that people with advanced degrees often believe themselves to be generally more "educated" than others (when the reality is they are only "educated" in a single subject matter).. but when you consider that 88% of millionaires have undergrad degrees, and only about half of the millionaires have advanced degrees (thereby half do not have advanced degrees, and many dont have a degree at all).. and that the overwhelming majority of billionaires DO NOT have advanced degrees.. what exactly is the correlation with education and being out of touch because of financial positioning?

I'd argue that people that are educated, whether we are talking formal education, or informal (voracious readers, people that highly value knowledge and go to great lengths to pursue it, etc) generally speaking THINK, and that their opinions are far more often than not based on facts.. whereas people that are not consumers of knowledge generally dont have much more than emotion to go on when developing opinions...

Truth be told, the most down to earth and in touch person I know is a guy worth a couple of hundred million here in TX.. he holds 2 advanced degrees and occasionally teaches business classes at a small Christian university.. if you didnt know any better you would have thought he spent his career in an oil patch as line level supervisor (made good money, but worked his entire life with his hands, and lived a middle class existence most of his years) rather than being an entrepreneur that made a ton of money wildcatting 40 years ago then turned that small fortune into a huge fortune by investing in land deals and mineral rights deals for the next 4 decades..

He is wicked smart.. incredibly quick witted.. and one of the hardest working people Ive ever known...

He also loves to eat KFC fried chicken, spends most of his evenings in the fall sipping cheap whiskey by a camp fire while hanging out with his family members.. he still employs dozens of people (hes largely retired these days.. he's in his late 70's.. but still keeps a number of people on payroll and always has projects being executed all over the state, as well as other locations).. almost everyone he employs is "working class" (the nature of the work he hires folks to do these days).. He is also an avid big game hunter that has made multiple trips all around the globe for decades..

Is he out of touch with the common man by virtue of the fact that he was born to a fairly significant amount of wealth, built a business empire worth hundreds of times more than what he was born to, earned a couple of advanced degrees, etc..etc..

Or does anyone really think he is a "common man" because he really likes fried chicken and cheap whiskey?

The truth is you can be all of those things... and MANY people are.. and still very much be in touch with "common" people... while you yourself are in no way a "common" man at all..

Considering I have met +/- 100 or more AH members personally.. had lunch at different times with probably a dozen or more.. had roughly 70-80 in my home on a couple of different occasions.. have hunted with a few.. etc..etc.. and know a significant number of these people to be high income earners, well educated, etc.. based on my interaction with these people... I'd say your assessment is about as far off the mark as you can get...

Certainly there are people in this world that are out of touch with common people (out of touch with reality in general for that matter), this however is not a place where a disproportionate number of them are located in my experience.. and the truth is.. I've found just as many people out of touch with "common" people in this world that are themselves "common".. as I have found upper middle class and upper class folks that are (until you get into the generational wealth families in the top 1%, I think you'll find most folks know what its like to stress over whether or not they can pay a bill one month.. or how theyre going to afford Christmas.. or having a kid that isnt fitting in or stays in trouble in school, etc..etc.. ).. they might not have those troubles today.. but they have had them at one time and have lived and learned from it...

FWIW in addition to all of the above.. I was a cop in one of the worst crime rate major metro cities in the US for the better part of a decade.. In addition to having quite a bit of exposure to the upper 5% income earner types.. I have had a substantial amount of exposure to significant numbers of people on the other end of that spectrum (no money, no education, etc)...

Wanna take a guess which group is the least in touch with the "middle" class and the wants/needs/desires of the largest population demographic groups in the US?

Just back from my trip and have a little time to respond. I think, at least for me it’s difficult to really convey all of one’s thoughts in writing without for me at least, writing an extensive amount which I try to avoid doing on this site. I try to keep it as short and concise as I can so nobody fall’s asleep reading! Of course a conversation over a beer would truly be better at conveying one’s points.

I do not mean this as criticism to those who’ve worked very hard to achieve a level of success that affords them the ability to enjoy the finer things in life and allows them to live at least from a financial perspective a worry free life. Yes, I would lump myself into this group although I don’t think I’m in Tank’s stratosphere!

What my theory was is in general, the more wealth one has, the more one becomes detached from those who are what I would describe as blue collar working class people ( Trump supporters) So say those in the top 1% may be the most detached, top 5% slightly less, top 10% a little more less detached (me) and so on. Well of course there will be exceptions, perhaps members on this forum, but we’re talking in general. I also spent a career interacting with the folks MDWest describes, so I know very well those types, but they are non taxpayers. Even in the ghetto however, are poor working class and those retired on fixed income who do pay some taxes. It is my contention that they and the blue collar working class do not contemplate much of what is being discussed on this political forum.

I have had some interaction in my career and in life over the years with some men of high rank both in the military and my career in law enforcement. Some were even mentors to me and a couple of legendary status, to me anyways. Great men, great leaders, climbing the ranks to the highest levels many from humble beginnings. Yet still, inevitably, even in them, I noticed a level of detachment. This isn’t a criticism which many here interpret as, it’s an observation. Yes, there are those of us who have lived in the shit, crawled around in the shit, and have excellent memories of the shit, but we are not in it now and some have been away from it for years.

 

[Altitude sickness]

Biden was of course given the questions weeks or months ago.
As Donna Brazil did for Hillary.

He has the questions and he still needs to be locked away for 2 weeks of prep work.

 

[Brent in Az]

Biden will receive his dosage of Adderall, along with whatever chemical cocktail they pump him full of

 

[Saul]

Violence breaks out after anti-Israel agitators surround LA synagogue, clash with Israel supporters | Fox News

Anti-Israel agitators reportedly clashed with supporters of Israel outside a Los Angeles synagogue Sunday morning.

www.foxnews.com

Protest violence outside L.A. synagogue spurs widespread condemnation. Bass vows quick action

Law enforcement sources said more than 150 people converged on the temple, and it took time for the Los Angeles Police Department to get enough personnel to the scene.

www.latimes.com

 

[PARA45]

I do not promote violence in any way. However, there is a limit to everything in life, and there is time when someone needs to hold their ground and fight back. I believe the Anti-Israel, Pro-Hamas, confused idiots, whatever you want to call them, need to get some of their own medicine, and have their asses severely kicked. Enough is enough, and that radical group has gotten away with enough. It's time to take the gloves off, fights on.

 

[Doug Hamilton]

I do not promote violence in any way. However, there is a limit to everything in life, and there is time when someone needs to hold their ground and fight back. I believe the Anti-Israel, Pro-Hamas, confused idiots, whatever you want to call them, need to get some of their own medicine, and have their asses severely kicked. Enough is enough, and that radical group has gotten away with enough. It's time to take the glove

 

[Doug Hamilton]

Violence breaks out after anti-Israel agitators surround LA synagogue, clash with Israel supporters | Fox News

Anti-Israel agitators reportedly clashed with supporters of Israel outside a Los Angeles synagogue Sunday morning.

www.foxnews.com

Protest violence outside L.A. synagogue spurs widespread condemnation. Bass vows quick action

Law enforcement sources said more than 150 people converged on the temple, and it took time for the Los Angeles Police Department to get enough personnel to the scene.

www.latimes.com

We must learn that we are the first line of defence, and we must fight back when we are attacked. When violent criminals are arrested and convicted they should receive the maximum penalty allowed by law. We need to insist that the death penalty be in place, and when appropriate, be used.

A young woman that I knew was murdered while working in a prison. The man that killed her was tried and convicted. He also confessed. He was sentenced to death. He had already been sentenced to life without parole for previous crimes. Now the politicians in Washington state have banned the death penalty. So now Byron Sherf is sentenced to life without parole, again, and we are back to where we were before he murdered Jayme Biendl. According to the Democrats view of justice, Jayme was a "freebie" and just a bonus kill.

 

[sgt_zim]

Just back from my trip and have a little time to respond. I think, at least for me it’s difficult to really convey all of one’s thoughts in writing without for me at least, writing an extensive amount which I try to avoid doing on this site. I try to keep it as short and concise as I can so nobody fall’s asleep reading! Of course a conversation over a beer would truly be better at conveying one’s points.

I do not mean this as criticism to those who’ve worked very hard to achieve a level of success that affords them the ability to enjoy the finer things in life and allows them to live at least from a financial perspective a worry free life. Yes, I would lump myself into this group although I don’t think I’m in Tank’s stratosphere!

What my theory was is in general, the more wealth one has, the more one becomes detached from those who are what I would describe as blue collar working class people ( Trump supporters) So say those in the top 1% may be the most detached, top 5% slightly less, top 10% a little more less detached (me) and so on. Well of course there will be exceptions, perhaps members on this forum, but we’re talking in general. I also spent a career interacting with the folks MDWest describes, so I know very well those types, but they are non taxpayers. Even in the ghetto however, are poor working class and those retired on fixed income who do pay some taxes. It is my contention that they and the blue collar working class do not contemplate much of what is being discussed on this political forum.

I have had some interaction in my career and in life over the years with some men of high rank both in the military and my career in law enforcement. Some were even mentors to me and a couple of legendary status, to me anyways. Great men, great leaders, climbing the ranks to the highest levels many from humble beginnings. Yet still, inevitably, even in them, I noticed a level of detachment. This isn’t a criticism which many here interpret as, it’s an observation. Yes, there are those of us who have lived in the shit, crawled around in the shit, and have excellent memories of the shit, but we are not in it now and some have been away from it for years.

Meh, I think you're underestimating the good men in this country who also happen to be high income earners. Most of us are where we are because we helped other people get what they want. I know more than a few people in the 300K+ income group, and with only 1 or 2 exceptions, they're all salt-of-the-earth people.

 

[Doug Hamilton]

Religion of peace again???

https://www.cnn.com/2024/06/23/europe/dagestan-synagogue-attack-russia-intl-latam/index.html

At least Russia is still holding on to the death penalty. Murder is not tolerated.

 

[Doug Hamilton]

Meh, I think you're underestimating the good men in this country who also happen to be high income earners. Most of us are where we are because we helped other people get what they want. I know more than a few people in the 300K+ income group, and with only 1 or 2 exceptions, they're all salt-of-the-earth people.

Maybe he has not noticed how many extremely wealthy liberal elites there are in this country. Politicians, actors, singers,etc. They all claim to identify with the poor while looking down their noses at those that have actually worked for what they have.

 

[Red Leg]

@Red Leg

I am curious as to your thoughts regarding the future of tanks. With what drones are doing in Ukraine to tanks, are tanks now obsolete on the modern battlefield?

Also regarding what drones are doing in the Black and Red Seas, is the modern navy in close support operations now a thing of the past?

Appreciate your opinions on these subjects.

That is the question of the day. I do not believe it is likely possible to achieve a rupture in a defensive belt of any type and then exploit it without armor. Otherwise, we are repeating the battles of Cold Harbor or perhaps the Somme. A breakthrough can only be as deep as the physical exhaustion of the attacking force.

Currently, both Ukraine and Russia have proven that command directed UAVs are capable of killing armor. Armor acting without integrated fire support against a prepared defense is clearly particularly vulnerable. One daily can pull up from the web a set of new videos showing the destruction of individual armor vehicles or platforms operating in small groups.

The US does not yet have an effective technical solution to this threat, but it is worth noting a US corps deployed in Ukraine would not be fighting anything like the Russians or Ukrainians. The US uses massive fire support. Where the Ukrainians fire one or two rounds or the Russians 6-12 in support of a platoon size assault, the US would be firing hundreds at both precisely identified and likely suppression targets throughout the depth of the battlefield using both artillery and ground attack assets as whole brigades moved forward in the attack.

Identifying reconnaissance assets (recon UAV launch points) would be particularly high value targets. A FPV (suicide drone) has a soda straw view of the battlefield, and are of little use without the ability of the operators to be directed to targets on the battlefield.

Once a breakthrough is achieved and the battle shifts from penetration to exploitation, piloted attack drones become much more difficult to employ because of the fluidity of the battlefield. Additionally, a truly modern integrated task force will employ extensive jamming technology to deny command directed FPVs the ability to close with their targets.

I would note Israeli forces in both Gaza and along the Lebanese border. There are virtually no videos of either Hamas or Hezbollah successfully attacking Israeli armor with these weapons. I think one can be assured it isn't for lack of trying. But, unlike Ukraine and clearly Russian forces, Israel utilizes a integrated surveillance, identification, disruption, and attack structure that is designed to kill the UAV threat at its source and thwart it in the target area.

Back to the Ukraine environment, once a rupture is achieved and the battle moves into the exploitation phase, it is very difficult to see how FPV's will be very effective on a truly mobile battlefield.

I am far more concerned about the next generation. Self-targeting swarms of loitering munitions are well into development. These require no comms link that can be jammed. The munition simply seeks and IDs a target from the catalog in its on board chip and attacks. These will be difficult to stop. Several NATO countries, including the US, are testing radar directed machine gun solutions for close defense of the task force. Lasers or microwave will eventually be more effective.

Unfortunately, I suspect the US will have to actually face the things before we fully deploy effective defensive systems. We will, however, like the Israelis, fight a fully integrated force.

I am far from a navel expert, but we already have fairly effective close defense weapons systems for cruise missiles and the like. I am told, that software tweaking would allow them to be pretty effective against unmanned surface naval drones. Perhaps, one of our naval alumni can chime in.

 

[Red Leg]

At least Russia is still holding on to the death penalty. Murder is not tolerated.

Or political dissent.

 

[Altitude sickness]

I don’t think modern Russian tanks armor has ever been as strong as US armor. They went with lightweight. We went with heavy and more armor. I don’t think a drone with 2lbs of explosives would harm a modern U.S. tank.

 

[CJW]

New WH staffer .

Antisemitism group calls on Biden to fire official who posted, deleted anti-Israel tweets: 'Just horrifying'

A group that tracks antisemitism is calling for the Biden administration to fire a White House official whose anti-Israel social media posts resurfaced this week.

www.foxnews.com

 

[sgt_zim]

New WH staffer .

Antisemitism group calls on Biden to fire official who posted, deleted anti-Israel tweets: 'Just horrifying'

A group that tracks antisemitism is calling for the Biden administration to fire a White House official whose anti-Israel social media posts resurfaced this week.

www.foxnews.com

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What in the AF.

 

[sgt_zim]

Maybe he has not noticed how many extremely wealthy liberal elites there are in this country. Politicians, actors, singers,etc. They all claim to identify with the poor while looking down their noses at those that have actually worked for what they have.

I'd completely agree that most actors are utterly out of touch. They mostly get where they are by being narcissistic and self-absorbed, shameless self-promoters, in the 1st place. They never were in touch with the common man.

 

[CJW]

What in the AF.

I figured you guys would appreciate that before going to bed.