Is Blaser Trying To Price Themselves Out Of The American Market???

[CoElkHunter]

I think Rex silentium is “king of silence” in latin.

Edit: I just think read Latin and think in Spanish and you’ll probably be pretty close.

I KNEW he was Greek! LOL

 

[Tra3]

Always someone who is apparently incapable of a rational contribution, so they decide to make it personal.

Of course the higher end UK houses make rifles that are compatible. They are, duh, UK based and suppressors are pretty much the norm when potting the local fanged deer. They are not the norm hoofing the hills of Scotland for a red stag.

It has nothing to do with class and everything to do with the environment in which the hunt takes place.

I concur that it has everything to do with the environment (and the tradition).
Over Christmas in England we used suppressors on all variety of rifles.

For a day of pheasant shooting, the rules of the hunt, spoken and unspoken, did not even contemplate a suppressed shotgun. In a place where each shooter could easily afford and acquire a suppressed shotgun, no one did. (Only double barrel shotguns were used)

While I own suppressors, I still haven’t used them in Montana for my yearly hunts. I think I will this year as I have a couple newer, smaller ones now.

 

[Red Leg]

I concur that it has everything to do with the environment (and the tradition).
Over Christmas in England we used suppressors on all variety of rifles.

For a day of pheasant shooting, the rules of the hunt, spoken and unspoken, did not even contemplate a suppressed shotgun. In a place where each shooter could easily afford and acquire a suppressed shotgun, no one did. (Only double barrel shotguns were used)

While I own suppressors, I still haven’t used them in Montana for my yearly hunts. I think I will this year as I have a couple newer, smaller ones now.

I agree, don't see a suppressed shotgun fitting into the domain of flat hats and breeks. Or anywhere I will ever hunt.

 

[CoElkHunter]

Is that the Kerch bridge in Russia? LOL

I meant Crimea? Wait a minute. If it's been built by Russia after illegally annexing Ukranian territory, why is it still standing? Why hasn't it been struck dozens of times and destroyed by Ukranian F16s? Then I woke up.

 

[CoElkHunter]

I agree, don't see a suppressed shotgun fitting into the domain of flat hats and breeks. Or anywhere I will ever hunt.

View attachment 587407
View attachment 587408

I'll bet those with manbun's have them on both their Creedmoor rifles and shotguns with a magazine drum attached? You can never count them out! LOL

 

[Wyfox]

You obviously think you are humorous. Care to explain that more fully?

I responded to someone who stated that he didn't "know any serious shooter" who didn't "run" a suppressor. I don't know any serious hunter or shooter that runs one for anything but pigs, predators, and self-defense.

I am sure you are a very funny person so why don't you clarify your crack about class.

You have touted in this thread about how you're a "Serious shooter" and "Serious hunter" and "No serious shooter or hunter" uses a suppressor. Then you state that you've traveled the world and make it sound that you know best and then berate a member for only hunting South Africa and that doesn't count because that is not your type of hunting... So what I'm saying is, you sound like a braggart. So I posted an example of a "Best Gun" that comes standard threaded for a can, because it sounds more like your "type of tea" per se.

You obviously don't run in the same circles I do because everyone I hunt with or shoot with uses suppressors and I live in a very hunting driven community and shooting is literally my day job. Suppressors have become mainstream in the last 5-8 years since becoming legal to hunt with in almost every state. Every rifle I have is equipped with a suppressor and I'm a "Serious Shooter" too.

 

[MTA]

And I will not buy a hunting rifle with a threaded muzzle. I breeze right over them.

yea thats the great part about the free market. You buy whatever you like and I will do the same

 

[Foxi]

Just to throw a little more cold water on the notion that almost everyone uses them in Europe, I have hunted fairly regularly in Spain and Austria over the last decade and a bit. I have hunted Germany extensively, but that is quite dated. Were I a typical small revier holder in Germany today where my principle hunting was from a high seat for roe deer, wild boar, and red fox, a suppressor would make a lot of sense. But there is a lot of Europe that has far more in common with the American West and Middle West, than a small revier in Germany.

For instance, I have hunted ibex, chamois, wild boar, red and roe deer fairly extensively in Spain and Austria. Traveling with firearms to Europe and playing tourist afterwards can be complicated so I almost always use a rented rifle. I have never been handed one with a suppressor. Three quarters of those rifles were R93's or R8's and I do not recall any with a threaded muzzle but it is possible a cap was in place that I missed. But like the American West, I can't imagine maneuvering a rifle all day in the terrain of the Gredos, Beceite, Pyrenees, or Alps with a suppressor on the end of it.

We and another couple will be back in Spain in a couple of months. I'll be using my host's rifle. It is a perfectly balanced R8 with professional success stock carrying Zeiss optics in .270 WSM and without a suppressor. My hunting companion will be using a R8 300 Win Mag also without a suppressor. Year after next I'll be in Hungary using a Mauser M12 also in .300 Win Mag. It too will have no suppressor.

Red Leg, the size of a hunting ground has nothing to do with the use of a silencer.
If I already had guns on loan for guests, I wouldn't retrofit a silencer either, why? It's enough so far.
And every gram counts on the mountain.
It took a lot of resistance for something like this to be allowed here at all; I always thought it was a matter of cancelling the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty
This is how the Federal Criminal Police Office approached us on this subject. It may not be allowed in every country and violating the gun laws in Europe is a serious offence with serious consequences

But a new generation has been growing up here for a long time that thinks differently to us older hunters.
When a NEW rifle is ordered today, at least it has a thread on it.
If only to increase the chances of a possible resale.
These are not my statements, but those of a friend who works as a salesman at the largest gun shop in Germany (Frankonia Jagd).
I personally resisted a silencer for a long time, I only bought one because I didn't want to expose my dogs to the raw sound of a shot.
It has taken our hunting rifle industry 100 years to finally build short, easy-to-handle rifles and now such an ugly oil cylinder should lengthen my beautiful rifle again........never.

But there are calibres that tolerate short barrels (308, 8x57, 9.3x62) and so these guns are hardly longer than a metre. I have enough guns in the cupboard for our conditions and I always find myself reaching for the silencer gun because it is simply more pleasant to shoot.
And its not so less in some years.

Sine ira et studio

Foxi

 

[Red Leg]

You have touted in this thread about how you're a "Serious shooter" and "Serious hunter" and "No serious shooter or hunter" uses a suppressor. Then you state that you've traveled the world and make it sound that you know best and then berate a member for only hunting South Africa and that doesn't count because that is not your type of hunting... So what I'm saying is, you sound like a braggart. So I posted an example of a "Best Gun" that comes standard threaded for a can, because it sounds more like your "type of tea" per se.

You obviously don't run in the same circles I do because everyone I hunt with or shoot with uses suppressors and I live in a very hunting driven community and shooting is literally my day job. Suppressors have become mainstream in the last 5-8 years since becoming legal to hunt with in almost every state. Every rifle I have is equipped with a suppressor and I'm a "Serious Shooter" too.

I genuinely appreciate the more complete response. As I noted above, I own suppressors. For shooting pigs mounted on an AR, I have found them very useful. I have one mounted on a .22 for abusing the squirrels working over our pecans. What I do not do is draw a conclusion from that they are universally appropriate.

Another member made the claim that “most“ PH’s in Africa use a suppressor and most client guns were equipped with them. That is simply incorrect. I suspect it will be for quite a while to come. If for no other reason, Africa is a pretty big place. I was then told my experience factor was quite small. I replied with examples that it was likely a lot larger than the person who made the claim.

i have no doubt that they are popular with your friends. As I noted, we use them a lot here. But I have yet to meet someone who uses them regularly on big game outside a deer stand, and even that is pretty rare in this part of the country. I am certainly not going to drag a rifle so equipped around the front face of the Rockies, British Columbia, or the examples I gave in Europe or Africa. That is not meant to sound elitist, but it was meant to remind there is a lot of game being hunted in a lot of different places by very dedicated “serious” hunters and shooters. The vast majority are not using suppressors where every ounce or bulk matter.

That is a great mule deer in your avatar. I am genuinely curious. Did your rifle have a suppressor? If it was suppressed, was it attached to the end of the barrel or was it a fully suppressed design (a concept that does make a lot of sense to me). How did you hunt him? How did it work out? You are from Wyoming. Would a rifle with a suppressor on the end of it be your choice for a mountain hunt for an elk or mountain mule deer? Why?

One of the great things about this site is we interact with a lot of other hunters with a lot of different experiences. Your experience with the mule deer would be a good one to add to this discussion. My personal experiences are indeed quite small compared to our collective knowledge. I genuinely try not to draw too many universal truths from them. But I will challenge someone else‘s assertions that do not fit my broader set of observations.

Again, that is one heck of a buck.

 

[Red Leg]

Red Leg, the size of a hunting ground has nothing to do with the use of a silencer.
If I already had guns on loan for guests, I wouldn't retrofit a silencer either, why? It's enough so far.
And every gram counts on the mountain.
It took a lot of resistance for something like this to be allowed here at all; I always thought it was a matter of cancelling the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty
This is how the Federal Criminal Police Office approached us on this subject. It may not be allowed in every country and violating the gun laws in Europe is a serious offence with serious consequences

But a new generation has been growing up here for a long time that thinks differently to us older hunters.
When a NEW rifle is ordered today, at least it has a thread on it.
If only to increase the chances of a possible resale.
These are not my statements, but those of a friend who works as a salesman at the largest gun shop in Germany (Frankonia Jagd).
I personally resisted a silencer for a long time, I only bought one because I didn't want to expose my dogs to the raw sound of a shot.
It has taken our hunting rifle industry 100 years to finally build short, easy-to-handle rifles and now such an ugly oil cylinder should lengthen my beautiful rifle again........never.

But there are calibres that tolerate short barrels (308, 8x57, 9.3x62) and so these guns are hardly longer than a metre. I have enough guns in the cupboard for our conditions and I always find myself reaching for the silencer gun because it is simply more pleasant to shoot.
And its not so less in some years.

Sine ira et studio

Foxi

Appreciate the response my friend.

I have no doubt that suppressors are very popular in Germany, and that most rifles are threaded. That is true here as well. I’ll even agree they make all sorts of sense on the typical German revier where shots are taken from high seats near farms and villages.

But I am genuinely curious. Are they also prevalent in Alpine hunting In Germany? I can not imagine a mountain rifle equipped with one. What about driven boar? Again, the rifles I use for that would not be nearly as effective with a suppressor on the end. As I noted, they have been far from universal where I have hunted in Spain, Austria, and Hungary.

What does seem to make a lot of sense to me are the full length silenced barrels like the Blaser R8 Silence. It has all the compact advantages, if not barrel change capability, of the R8 design that would work perfectly in almost any terrain. Unfortunately, they are not available in this country.

 

[Shako Badhan]

Personally I would consider getting a threaded barrel for my R8 but I’m in no rush. Another advantage to the R8, one can easily go that direction and hunt suppressed without making permanent modifications.

As for sound reduction unless your using subsonic ammunition suppressors are usually just under the hearing safe mark and not all the quiet. In the military we use them primarily to cut muzzle flash when hunting two legged animals.

 

[Wyfox]

We use them regularly in Wyoming on back country mountain game. Wyoming made suppressor use legal for big game around 2016 if I remember so many didn't own them prior. Since they were legalized for hunting they have flown off the shelves, I can't go to the range without seeing someone with a can.

A good titanium suppressor is only 6oz and 5" in length. Cut off 4" of barrel and weigh it, probably about the same or more.

https://thunderbeastarms.com/products/ultra-5

I have more short 5-6" suppressors than anything, they're not long and cumbersome like you imagine and I'm not looking for the quietest either. A 5" Thunderbeast is in the high 130 decibel range, very pleasant but not super quiet, but It's pleasant to shoot.

5" can on a 20" 6mm Creedmoor

I've done a lot of precision rifle shooting and have multiple rifles with quick change barrels, I've experimented with many barrel lengths and calibers and the velocity difference from a 24" barrel to a 20" barrel is on average less than 100fps on most calibers. I much prefer shorter barrels on my rifles now a days.

The Mule Deer in my avatar was shot with a 24" 6.5saum with a Surefire SOCOM suppressor attached, the hike in was approx 3 miles so nothing outrageous. It is quick detach so I would detach it and throw it in my pack until needed. The Surefire was one of my first cans, at 9" and 17oz is was a pig but I was happy to lug it around. Since then I've moved to the short light stuff, in the suppressor world they call them "K" cans for Kurz of course.

The deer below was shot 12 miles deep with a suppressed 300 Norma, I packed him out 12 miles in the dark getting to the trailhead in the morning, the suppressor was the least of my worries with an entire deer boned out in my pack and in Grizz country.

 

[Daisy]

Are you in the US? If so can you share model and brand. It’s probably 5 years ago that I purchased US suppressors, I revisited the market about 2 years ago but was unable to find an over the barrel type model, maybe someone is making them now, if so I would like to buy one. The model I use on my UK Blaser R8 is a Stalon x108 Scandinavian I believe.

ABsuppressor raptor. Absolutely fantastic can that has many length options.

There is a direct mount, 3”, and 5” reflex portion. Then you can choose actual extended can length. Have options up to 375, which is what I have.

Raptor — AB Suppressor

The Raptor uses spiral shaped baffles to keep the gasses moving while reducing back pressure. Utilizing the Reflex mounting systems greatly increases the suppressor volume without increasing the overall length of the firearm.

www.absuppressor.com

 

[Daisy]

We use them regularly in Wyoming on back country mountain game. Wyoming made suppressor use legal for big game around 2016 if I remember so many didn't own them prior. Since they were legalized for hunting they have flown off the shelves, I can't go to the range without seeing someone with a can.

A good titanium suppressor is only 6oz and 5" in length. Cut off 4" of barrel and weigh it, probably about the same or more.

https://thunderbeastarms.com/products/ultra-5

I have more short 5-6" suppressors than anything, they're not long and cumbersome like you imagine and I'm not looking for the quietest either. A 5" Thunderbeast is in the high 130 decibel range, very pleasant but not super quiet, but It's pleasant to shoot.

5" can on a 20" 6mm Creedmoor
View attachment 587433


I've done a lot of precision rifle shooting and have multiple rifles with quick change barrels, I've experimented with many barrel lengths and calibers and the velocity difference from a 24" barrel to a 20" barrel is on average less than 100fps on most calibers. I much prefer shorter barrels on my rifles now a days.

The Mule Deer in my avatar was shot with a 24" 6.5saum with a Surefire SOCOM suppressor attached, the hike in was approx 3 miles so nothing outrageous. It is quick detach so I would detach it and throw it in my pack until needed. The Surefire was one of my first cans, at 9" and 17oz is was a pig but I was happy to lug it around. Since then I've moved to the short light stuff, in the suppressor world they call them "K" cans for Kurz of course.

The deer below was shot 12 miles deep with a suppressed 300 Norma, I packed him out 12 miles in the dark getting to the trailhead in the morning, the suppressor was the least of my worries with an entire deer boned out in my pack and in Grizz country.
View attachment 587432

Your experience is very similar to mine.

 

[Daisy]

You obviously think you are humorous. Care to explain that more fully?

I responded to someone who stated that he didn't "know any serious shooter" who didn't "run" a suppressor. I don't know any serious hunter or shooter that runs one for anything but pigs, predators, and self-defense.

I am sure you are a very funny person so why don't you clarify your crack about class.

I thought there were enough replies showing how wrong you were to calm you down. Guess not.

The only reply in whole thread not polite was you telling me “I don’t think I will let you lecture me.”

It’s fine to lose an argument. Teaches character.

 

[Daisy]

You have touted in this thread about how you're a "Serious shooter" and "Serious hunter" and "No serious shooter or hunter" uses a suppressor. Then you state that you've traveled the world and make it sound that you know best and then berate a member for only hunting South Africa and that doesn't count because that is not your type of hunting... So what I'm saying is, you sound like a braggart. So I posted an example of a "Best Gun" that comes standard threaded for a can, because it sounds more like your "type of tea" per se.

You obviously don't run in the same circles I do because everyone I hunt with or shoot with uses suppressors and I live in a very hunting driven community and shooting is literally my day job. Suppressors have become mainstream in the last 5-8 years since becoming legal to hunt with in almost every state. Every rifle I have is equipped with a suppressor and I'm a "Serious Shooter" too.

Nailed it.

 

[Daisy]

Personally I would consider getting a threaded barrel for my R8 but I’m in no rush. Another advantage to the R8, one can easily go that direction and hunt suppressed without making permanent modifications.

As for sound reduction unless your using subsonic ammunition suppressors are usually just under the hearing safe mark and not all the quiet. In the military we use them primarily to cut muzzle flash when hunting two legged animals.

But see, just under the hearing safe mark is a huge accomplishment. That’s the whole goal.

 

[PARA45]

I think they ask for a lot of money for that much ugly.

If I were still in my "I must try every gun" years of my life, I could not live without one. I really admire the concept and "Lego" available options. However, I have never been able to bond with plastic and modular firearms, more so since leaving the military. My heart prefers classic, traditional firearms.

There are a lot of Blaser haters. I am not one of them and my offer still stands, if someone wants to give me a Blaser and a safari, I will go to Africa and shoot it like I stole it. I still regret walking away from a DSC show special years ago. An R8, brown stock in 375 H&H and 300 win mag with all accessories for just under $4K. I remember looking at it hard and thinking this is one heck of a deal when Mama walked up holding her Rigby anniversary gift and said "En serio?! Rifle tan feo." (Seriously? That is an ugly rifle. )

Safe hunting.

You sir are one lucky man, oh, and Sra @SFRanger7GP has very good taste in firearms.

 

[Altitude sickness]

Wyfox, I agree completely. if a rifle will be suppressed primarily. Then the barrel could and should be shortened as you said.
from what I’ve seen a suppressor changes your point of impact high and I’m sure it’s due to the extra barrel length and pressure but if you shorten the barrel and add a suppressor, it should equal out.

 

[Altitude sickness]

It’s a shame that in our country facts don’t matter in politics and laws.

I have used the SilenceCentral company to purchase, and an in complete amazement that a company that sells suppressors would call themselves “silencer”.

That is the stigma in Washington DC. They’ve watched too many hitman movies. It’s a safety tool that should be more widely used and we should not have to get a $200 stamp, and a ridiculous background check to buy the equivalent of a minibike muffler.

This one issue encapsulates the problems with politics. people get elected and suddenly think they’re the smartest people in the country. Instead educating themselves on the tool, but since it’s associated with a firearm, it must be bad.