45-70 for dangerous game?

[dogcat1]

No. The 45-70 or 45-90 or 50-110 are not dangerous game calibers. The bullets, the energy are all lacking. Can you kill a buff with one? Yes. But you are putting yourself and others are risk as this is not powerful enough to get the penetration and impact you need to kill dangerous game.

I get it that many do this. I have seen the videos. The latest I saw was a guy in Uganda shooting a buff at about 75 yards. After 6 shots, he used a bolt gun to finish the job.

Leave this caliber at home....

 

[Rafiki]

50-90 Sharps, 575gr Peregrine VRG-2, 2024fps, 5222ft/lbs. Experimental at this point but the math holds up. Although not a 45-70 the point I'm trying to make is that some of these old obsolete cartridges can achieve some incredible performance with modern components and rifle built to purpose. Even if you could find a lever gun that could fire such a round you wouldn't want to try with recoil energy around 80ft/lbs in a 10lb rifle.

BTW, don't get too fixated on the math. I witnessed a guy that put 12 LeverEvolution bullets in a bison, made me sick to watch (I was holding the horses). The guide finally polished it off, way too late in my opinion.

 

[1:66 twiste@d]

Nice!!

 

[mauserhunter]

View attachment 58844150-90 Sharps, 575gr Peregrine VRG-2, 2024fps, 5222ft/lbs. Experimental at this point but the math holds up. Although not a 45-70 the point I'm trying to make is that some of these old obsolete cartridges can achieve some incredible performance with modern components and rifle built to purpose. Even if you could find a lever gun that could fire such a round you wouldn't want to try with recoil energy around 80ft/lbs in a 10lb rifle.

BTW, don't get too fixated on the math. I witnessed a guy that put 12 LeverEvolution bullets in a bison, made me sick to watch (I was holding the horses). The guide finally polished it off, way too late in my opinion.

What's the SD on that bullet being over .300 seems more important then speed or energy.

 

[Rafiki]

What's the SD on that bullet being over .300 seems more important then speed or energy.

.316

 

[degoins]

No. The 45-70 or 45-90 or 50-110 are not dangerous game calibers. The bullets, the energy are all lacking. Can you kill a buff with one? Yes. But you are putting yourself and others are risk as this is not powerful enough to get the penetration and impact you need to kill dangerous game.

I get it that many do this. I have seen the videos. The latest I saw was a guy in Uganda shooting a buff at about 75 yards. After 6 shots, he used a bolt gun to finish the job.

Leave this caliber at home....

BLASPHEMER!!!

 

[Tundra Tiger]

"this is not powerful enough to get the penetration and impact you need to kill dangerous game."

I've got two mature buffalo that say otherwise.

"After 6 shots, he used a bolt gun to finish the job."

You know, it's just possible that particular hunter would have had the same result with a bolt action? Just sayin'...

 

[poco]

No. The 45-70 or 45-90 or 50-110 are not dangerous game calibers. The bullets, the energy are all lacking. Can you kill a buff with one? Yes. But you are putting yourself and others are risk as this is not powerful enough to get the penetration and impact you need to kill dangerous game.

I get it that many do this. I have seen the videos. The latest I saw was a guy in Uganda shooting a buff at about 75 yards. After 6 shots, he used a bolt gun to finish the job.

Leave this caliber at home....

100%
45-70 isn’t in the DG league ( maybe at point blank 0-5 yards emergency)
I saw a guy try to kill a wounded boar hog with one and it flat out chewed him up before we could get it off him , we got a 3rd round in the hog and killed it and took the hunter to the ER , when I skined the hog I found all three rounds inside the hog
so I’m very sceptical on thick hide and bone animals

 

[Tundra Tiger]

"45-70 isn’t in the DG league (maybe at point blank 0-5 yards emergency)"

My first buffalo was 40 yards, frontal shot. It entered under the chin and was found in a hindquarter.

My second buffalo was broadside at around the same range. It broke ribs on both sides, took out the heart, and was resting under the skin on the far side.

Penetration was just fine, according to my PH. I was happy as well.

 

[Rafiki]

"45-70 isn’t in the DG league (maybe at point blank 0-5 yards emergency)"

My first buffalo was 40 yards, frontal shot. It entered under the chin and was found in a hindquarter.

My second buffalo was broadside at around the same range. It broke ribs on both sides, took out the heart, and was resting under the skin on the far side.

Penetration was just fine, according to my PH. I was happy as well.

How were your 45-70's loaded? Were these Garetts?

 

[Tundra Tiger]

How were your 45-70's loaded? Were these Garetts?

Handloads... my own creations. Starline brass, Cutting Edge brass solids. I don't remember the powder and amount off the top of my head, but I had some guidance from Cutting Edge about what to use. I was getting something like 1850ish over my chronograph. Again, penetration was just dandy. Even at more than 0-5 yards.

The bottom one is the recovered bullet from the second buffalo, that went through rib bones on both sides.

 

[Rafiki]

Ah yes. I've had many PM discussions with a AH member about CEB's, solids and Raptors; everything that I've read and heard are that they are fantastic. If I wasn't so fixated on Peregrine's I would likely go CEB's, they certainly would be easier to get. Thanks for the info.

What's the traditional bullet in the picture and how does that fit in this story?

 

[Tundra Tiger]

Ah yes. I've had many PM discussions with a AH member about CEB's, solids and Raptors; everything that I've read and heard are that they are fantastic. If I wasn't so fixated on Peregrine's I would likely go CEB's, they certainly would be easier to get. Thanks for the info.

What's the traditional bullet in the picture and how does that fit in this story?

It doesn't, for this thread. But I took the photo of them together when I got back last June. It's a 180 grain Accubond. I used them out of my Savage 99 (.300 Savage) on plains game. That particular bullet was recovered from my kudu (220 yards).

 

[BeeMaa]

@Tundra Tiger loves him a lever gun. Well played sir.

 

[Tundra Tiger]

I do @BeeMaa , I certainly do... but the tag is the wrong 'tundra'. Maybe he likes lever guns too, I don't know...

 

[Tokoloshe Safaris]

I have only owned one .45-70 in my life an old 86 winchester. I would hate like hell having to reload with a charging anything.

 

[BeeMaa]

No. The 45-70 or 45-90 or 50-110 are not dangerous game calibers. The bullets, the energy are all lacking. Can you kill a buff with one? Yes. But you are putting yourself and others are risk as this is not powerful enough to get the penetration and impact you need to kill dangerous game.

I get it that many do this. I have seen the videos. The latest I saw was a guy in Uganda shooting a buff at about 75 yards. After 6 shots, he used a bolt gun to finish the job.

Leave this caliber at home....

Hunters have used archery tackle for buffalo and even elephant, so why not a 45-70?

Having a conversation with the PH and telling them that you are willing to accept the limitations of whatever you choose to hunt with...if the PH is OK with it and the hunter is a good marksman there is no reason they shouldn't go DG hunting.

Just because YOU don't approve of it will not deter those who seek to do so. Why would you even care anyway? It's not like you will be there.

@Tundra Tiger - I edited the post...thanks.

 

[dogcat1]

BeeMaa,
Not sure why you are upset over this. Ask any PH - do you support using a 45-70 on buffalo or dangerous game? 100% will say not no but heck no. Why persist in using a tool not suited.
The 45-70 is antiquated and under powered.

Further, most African countries will not allow this one as it does not have the power needed.

 

[TTundra]

I do @BeeMaa , I certainly do... but the tag is the wrong 'tundra'. Maybe he likes lever guns too, I don't know...

He does! Have a BLR being rechambered to a fun little 375wsm now. Cherish my 99 but also love my 1895s (marlin and win). Debating trying a new Ruger/Marlin....

 

[Tundra Tiger]

"Ask any PH - do you support using a 45-70 on buffalo or dangerous game? 100% will say not no but heck no."

100%? Really? I did ask mine (he is also the owner). He gave me his blessing, as I discussed loads with him. On my second trip, I hunted with a different PH; he also gave it his blessing. I have had conversations on here with other sponsor PHs, who have told me they are good with it on some species of DG. Sooo... not sure where you are getting that 100% from?