Video of giraffe harvested with 6mm

[CBH Australia]

It seems to me that most Africans refer to any game meat as venison. Unless they prepare it for you and tell you what animal it came from you never really know. I always ask, not because I'm fussy, just curious. I haven't killed or eaten a giraffe though. I did ask my PH what he thought about it the last time I was in Zimbabwe. He said that the meat from cows and young bulls was "quite nice" but the "old, black bulls" was pretty much inedible due to their diet of acacia.

Interesting, we saw Giraffe on the property I hunted. Some were old and Black. I think that’s cool but then I hadn’t ever seen older black Giraffe in zoos.
The are the Giraffe were in certainly had Acacia. We have Acacia here.
My PH did say all the game meat is Venison but we were not actually talking about Giraffe at the time more the antelope species I was hunting.
When the skinners arrived to recover the Kudu they bought a bread bag to save some of the entrails and seemed pretty happy to get them. They were going to make a dish that they enjoy.
We ate blackstrap from a couple of species and the PH told us which each time.
I think I read that one species there is actually in the bovine family and is actually classed as beef.

 

[SaintPanzer]

You must have been there some time in the early 2000’s as all game meat was banned shortly after.

Why yes, you are correct. I was last there in '01. I had no idea they changed the law. Seems silly to me.

 

[CBH Australia]

You must have been there some time in the early 2000’s as all game meat was banned shortly after.

Interesting, in South Africa game meat was processed at the out fitters Butcher shop.

Even England allow hunters to qualify to sell meat to a game dealer for HC

 

[375Fox]

Why yes, you are correct. I was last there in '01. I had no idea they changed the law. Seems silly to me.

There is no legal big game hunting in Kenya. So if giraffe is on menu it’s either imported, poached, or mislabeled. It’s unlikely that it’s imported from South Africa or Namibia the only countries where game meat is commercially processed. It’s unfortunate there is no legal hunting there, but allowing giraffe or other wild game on the menu is just a different form of an unregulated bushmeat market that would encourage poaching.

 

[Daisy]

If you had just said that people shoot smaller calibers better than larger calibers you wouldn't have upset many people. My memory is still very good and my quote was very close to exactly what you said. I don't care enough to look it up, but you might want to. Let it go? I already have.

Pure gold

 

[Sideshow]

Interesting, in South Africa game meat was processed at the out fitters Butcher shop.

Even England allow hunters to qualify to sell meat to a game dealer for HC

So back when I was an overland driver we used to take the clients to Carnivors in Nairobi at the start of the trips.
You could get all the usual game meats, Impala, Zebra etc That was when I started. But then it all stopped and you could then only get ostrich and croc.
As Fox says no hunting so no game meat. I guess that who ever was in charge of it must have been paying a back hander and that stopped so the game meat did as well.
Was a bit of fun to see your clients over the next few weeks saying ohoo we just ate that... me I was like

 

[Tbitty]

Ha. Bringing other threads in. Might want to get your facts straight on quotations though.

I said people shoot smaller calibers better than larger calibers. That’s a lot different different than what you quoted.

Let it go my man. Your day will thank you.

Daisy, I appreciate your dedication to your cause, even if I don't fully agree.

Where I do agree with you is that smaller calibers are easier to shoot. And people who don't practice can more consistently hit the bullseye with smaller calibers in ideal conditions. When Shooting paper, excluding other factors, smaller calibers tend to be more accurate.

What I don't feel you consider at all in your push for small calibers is outside factors. Shot angle, shooter error, unexpected movement, shooting conditions, etc. An unseen twig or tuft of grass can deflect the bullet. Hitting bone can turn or stop the bullet. A tough angle can require "no doubt" deep penetration to reach the vitals. And just in general, a shooting error (calculation of drop or wind deflection, a wobble on the sticks or offhand, standard deviation in bullet/cartridge production, etc.) can push even the best shooters to be off the mark with their shot. There is simply less margin for error with a small caliber.

And that is where we disagree. You say, or at the very least imply, that a smaller caliber is better because it can be shot more accurately, but that seems to be your only consideration. In almost every other aspect, larger calibers are more effective upon their arrival. Both in overcoming shortcomings of the shot, and plainly in the damage done on even a perfect shot, the bigger bullet will out-perform the smaller one (assuming similar bullet construction and impact velocity). As an added bonus, bigger holes and pass throughs tend to aid in blood trail when the animal does not drop immediately.

This is a direct quote from you: "A millimeter more [in] diameter doesn’t kill any better. Often worse." ... that statement is flat out false, especially the add on at the end. Dead is dead, but there are levels to how efficiently a bullet can make that happen.

Again, I appreciate your enthusiasm for your stance. I won't roast you for your opinion or tell you not to use small calibers if that is what you choose to do. One of my favorite cartridges is the 25-06 for whitetail deer sized game or smaller. However, I do push back on your claims that you are in the middle and aren't promoting one side, because you clearly are. Stirring the pot is fine, just own it when you do.

 

[Daisy]

Daisy, I appreciate your dedication to your cause, even if I don't fully agree.

Where I do agree with you is that smaller calibers are easier to shoot. And people who don't practice can more consistently hit the bullseye with smaller calibers in ideal conditions. When Shooting paper, excluding other factors, smaller calibers tend to be more accurate.

What I don't feel you consider at all in your push for small calibers is outside factors. Shot angle, shooter error, unexpected movement, shooting conditions, etc. An unseen twig or tuft of grass can deflect the bullet. Hitting bone can turn or stop the bullet. A tough angle can require "no doubt" deep penetration to reach the vitals. And just in general, a shooting error (calculation of drop or wind deflection, a wobble on the sticks or offhand, standard deviation in bullet/cartridge production, etc.) can push even the best shooters to be off the mark with their shot. There is simply less margin for error with a small caliber.

And that is where we disagree. You say, or at the very least imply, that a smaller caliber is better because it can be shot more accurately, but that seems to be your only consideration. In almost every other aspect, larger calibers are more effective upon their arrival. Both in overcoming shortcomings of the shot, and plainly in the damage done on even a perfect shot, the bigger bullet will out-perform the smaller one (assuming similar bullet construction and impact velocity). As an added bonus, bigger holes and pass throughs tend to aid in blood trail when the animal does not drop immediately.

This is a direct quote from you: "A millimeter more [in] diameter doesn’t kill any better. Often worse." ... that statement is flat out false, especially the add on at the end. Dead is dead, but there are levels to how efficiently a bullet can make that happen.

Again, I appreciate your enthusiasm for your stance. I won't roast you for your opinion or tell you not to use small calibers if that is what you choose to do. One of my favorite cartridges is the 25-06 for whitetail deer sized game or smaller. However, I do push back on your claims that you are in the middle and aren't promoting one side, because you clearly are. Stirring the pot is fine, just own it when you do.

What an absolutely great post. Thanks my man for that. I agree with most if not all of it.

I’ve said and will continue to say I’m in the middle on all this. It feels like I am on one side because everyone here is so dang dug in on the opposite side! But I’m not in the small caliber all the time crowd. Among them they would say I’m a large caliber nut!

My first deer rifle was a 30-06. It kicked like a mule as a kid! But it never has affected my shot!

In Africa I shot a 308 and a 375hh. I fell in love with the bigger caliber. I had never really shot them before. It was weird though. The 7 animals I shot with the 308 from drt. The two with 375 both ran a distance. They were dead just didn’t know it yet.

I came home and immediately bought a 375 Ruger. 416 Ruger. And a 338 Lapua! And I plan to use them all. Still do. I did join a range and start shooting a lot. That’s where I learned a lot about ballistics and the idea that you don’t always need a larger caliber. Sometimes a smaller caliber with the right bullet works too, and it’s more fun to shoot.

I have gotten really into night and predator hunting over last two years. I bought a 6.5prc and just love it. It’s so flat shooting and with supressor has almost no recoil. I also have shot 223 for a long time, just never really considered it for hunting. A lot of info on another site has been eye opening. I also fell in love with modern projectiles, and use a lot of CEB ammo.

I truly just like the debate. I’m not trying to stir even if it looks like it. Talking about these issues is so dang fun. I’ll try not to step in it so much going forward!

Thanks again.

 

[CBH Australia]

@Tbitty, and others. I’m not sure I follow.

I don’t think he has a cause or supports the use of a small calibre on this application.

The opening post was

Not my video! Just interested in thoughts.

“Not my video! (using an exclamation mark)
Just interested in thoughts”

 

[Tbitty]

@Tbitty, and others. I’m not sure I follow.

I don’t think he has a cause or supports the use of a small calibre on this application.

The opening post was


“Not my video! (using an exclamation mark)
Just interested in thoughts”

Read post #6 and the rest of this thread and tell me he isn't advocating for small calibers. Or read his posts in other threads of similar discussion.

As I clearly stated in my last post, I do not have a problem with him taking such a stance, but it definitely does not come off as a middle position when using words like "data" and "proven" in the context he did, or the quote of his I included in my last post.

Perhaps he is not arguing for small calibers, but it is definitely arguing against big calibers being decidedly better.

 

[CBH Australia]

Read post #6 and the rest of this thread and tell me he isn't advocating for small calibers. Or read his posts in other threads of similar discussion.

As I clearly stated in my last post, I do not have a problem with him taking such a stance, but it definitely does not come off as a middle position when using words like "data" and "proven" in the context he did, or the quote of his I included in my last post.

Perhaps he is not arguing for small calibers, but it is definitely arguing against big calibers being decidedly better.

Fair enough, I’ve glazed over most of this thread anyway but I would not hunt a Giraffe with a 6mm.

My daughter asked me not to hunt a Giraffe on my safari and it wasn’t on the cards for me anyway. But it seems they taste good.

Actually, it was a crap video because if it was in the name of research and development or detailing the performance they could have acted professionally and also added more information to the video.

I guess it was taken as a trophy. 3k for a target seems excessive for bullet testing anyway.

 

[Daisy]

Read post #6 and the rest of this thread and tell me he isn't advocating for small calibers. Or read his posts in other threads of similar discussion.

As I clearly stated in my last post, I do not have a problem with him taking such a stance, but it definitely does not come off as a middle position when using words like "data" and "proven" in the context he did, or the quote of his I included in my last post.

Perhaps he is not arguing for small calibers, but it is definitely arguing against big calibers being decidedly better.

Now you’re stretching. I don’t think you could find one shooting instructor that would not agree with the statement
“People shoot smaller calibers better than larger ones.”

How is that so controversial?

 

[375Fox]

Now you’re stretching. I don’t think you could find one shooting instructor that would not agree with the statement
“People shoot smaller calibers better than larger ones.”

How is that so controversial?

When you’d disregard a PH’s advice for hunting calibers and bullets to take the advice of a shooting instructor I’d say it becomes controversial.

 

[CBH Australia]

When you’d disregard a PH’s advice for hunting calibers and bullets to take the advice of a shooting instructor I’d say it becomes controversial.

Like this thread

 

[Sideshow]

Ohoo look this is still going

 

[GuttormG]

 

[93marlin]

My thoughts are "use enough gun" to take an animal quickly and cleanly. If you cannot shoot a rifle that will do that, then don't hunt that animal!!!
If, hypothetically, you are chosing to use a very small bore just to prove that it can be done, is wrong on so many areas. The margin of error is exponentially increased.
An author once said "use enough gun" it made sense then and now.
My 2¢

 

[Tbitty]

Now you’re stretching. I don’t think you could find one shooting instructor that would not agree with the statement
“People shoot smaller calibers better than larger ones.”

How is that so controversial?

This sounds a lot like saying "first, let me say that I grew up in a middle class family..."

This thread is not about shooting instructors or their opinion of that statement. I think you're trying to move the goalpost.

You find me where I said a shooting instructor would say people shoot bigger calibers better than smaller ones. .. hint, you won't find it.

 

[Doug Hamilton]

This sounds a lot like saying "first, let me say that I grew up in a middle class family..."

This thread is not about shooting instructors or their opinion of that statement. I think you're trying to move the goalpost.

You find me where I said a shooting instructor would say people shoot bigger calibers better than smaller ones. .. hint, you won't find it.

Now all.we need to find is a Professional Hunter that says a smaller caliber is automatically more effective than a larger caliber to take larger animals...

 

[Daisy]

This sounds a lot like saying "first, let me say that I grew up in a middle class family..."

This thread is not about shooting instructors or their opinion of that statement. I think you're trying to move the goalpost.

You find me where I said a shooting instructor would say people shoot bigger calibers better than smaller ones. .. hint, you won't find it.

Weird reply here