thats why I dont like doubles (have one)

[Scott CWO]

I have shot only three elephants and two buffalo with a double in the last three years, so not a prolific user of a double. All the rest have been with bolt rifles in the past.

That being said, I prefer the double rifle for DG. I find having two fast shots better than having 3 (my big bores hold 3) slower shots. Others, of course, might have other preferences. And if one has to reload from empty it is faster to reload a double than a magazine rifle.

My next hunt of lion, hippo, buffalo will all be with a Rigby double.

As for bolt rifle versus a double rifle, I think it all depends on what role you play, the situation and if hunting plains game in addition to dangerous game.

For a client hunting only DG or at least concentrating on DG, a DR can definitely make sense, as in your case. Mounting a red dot on your DR and practicing a lot also helps and can extend the effective range. However, some people would never mount a red dot on a DR. To each, his own.

Most PHs prefer that a client use a scoped bolt rifle due to the lack of experience of most clients and the fact that a scope makes the rifle more versatile when also hunting PG. For me, I wouldn’t take a bolt rifle that only holds three shots and I guarantee you that I can shoot my six shots faster and more accurately than any client can shoot six shots from a DR.

As for a PH, many prefer a bolt rifle for everything for the additional firepower of five or six shots, while some use a bolt rifle but will switch to a DR if following up a wounded animal into thick cover. If a PH switches to a DR for following up a wounded animal, some will only shoot one shot and will save the second shot for when the wounded animal is VERY close. If the animal is very close already, the two quick shots from a DR are an advantage.

 

[Oldnerd]

The bull rider received his eight seconds from the PH wearing the blue jacket, at which point the PH killed the animal. This demonstrates how much we depend on a PH in stressful situations.

 

[IvW]

Not his first rodeo.....

 

[Bert the Turtle]

Regards bolt vs double, if there were a clear and universal superiority of one, there would be no debate. They have different attributes that may make one or the other better or worse at any very specific thing, but taken as a whole, it comes down to how someone cares to value those attributes. Essentially it is a matter of taste. De gustibus non est disputandum

Further, this is a sport. In sports, people voluntarily place limits on themselves. If quick follow-up shots, plenty of ammo in the magazine, and quick reloading were the only considerations, we’d use a semi-automatic rifle with a detachable box magazine. If safety were the only concern, we'd shoot them with a 50BMG at 300 yards.

The hunting community has generally converged around bolt rifles or double rifles in a relatively narrow power range, taking buffalo on foot, from about 50 yards. If someone asks about taking a buffalo with archery equipment, many of us condemn him as reckless and disrespectful to the animal. if someone suggests using a 375RUM because of its flat trajectory, it will be quickly pointed out that dangerous game "should" be taken at close range.

To the average non-hunter, we are all a bit insane for choosing to expose ourselves to the (perceived) danger of hunting these animals. Who's to say they are wrong? There's a lot more people who think its too dangerous than those of us who think it's a good time.

I'm confident the PH is proficient with a bolt rifle and aware of its advantages and
disadvantages vis à vis a double rifle. He made his choice from a position of knowledge, not ignorance. He is the only person who can decide if it remains his choice.

 

[Franco]

Regards bolt vs double, if there were a clear and universal superiority of one, there would be no debate. They have different attributes that may make one or the other better or worse at any very specific thing, but taken as a whole, it comes down to how someone cares to value those attributes. Essentially it is a matter of taste. De gustibus non est disputandum

Further, this is a sport. In sports, people voluntarily place limits on themselves. If quick follow-up shots, plenty of ammo in the magazine, and quick reloading were the only considerations, we’d use a semi-automatic rifle with a detachable box magazine. If safety were the only concern, we'd shoot them with a 50BMG at 300 yards.

The hunting community has generally converged around bolt rifles or double rifles in a relatively narrow power range, taking buffalo on foot, from about 50 yards. If someone asks about taking a buffalo with archery equipment, many of us condemn him as reckless and disrespectful to the animal. if someone suggests using a 375RUM because of its flat trajectory, it will be quickly pointed out that dangerous game "should" be taken at close range.

To the average non-hunter, we are all a bit insane for choosing to expose ourselves to the (perceived) danger of hunting these animals. Who's to say they are wrong? There's a lot more people who think its too dangerous than those of us who think it's a good time.

I'm confident the PH is proficient with a bolt rifle and aware of its advantages and
disadvantages vis à vis a double rifle. He made his choice from a position of knowledge, not ignorance. He is the only person who can decide if it remains his choice.

Well stated, but something tells me the debate will continue.

 

[freefall]

Well stated, but something tells me the debate will continue.

People have a pathological need to voice their opinion, even though 8 other people have stated/refuted it in the preceding page or two.

 

[hoytcanon]

No we are pretty much implements of death with firearms in hand , live fire practice is conducted by a hole in the fence which feral hogs are trying desperately to escape back into the brush and we are in their way, it’s pretty sporty practice , milk jugs are just a compromise if hogs don’t cooperate

We have done the bouncing tire down the hill drill many times... you can't mount and shoot until it crosses the red line...

 

[hoytcanon]

People have a pathological need to voice their opinion, even though 8 other people have stated/refuted it in the preceding page or two.

That is kinda what forums are all about... with this entire world going up in flames, what with money laundering wars and men having babies and Gates wanting us to eat bugs, we all need a place to "howl at the ceiling!" Just remember at the end of the day we are friends and comrades in arms.

 

[Daniel Cary]

Can we just see more photos of Doubles vs. Bolts ..

 

[Rare Breed]

Regards bolt vs double, if there were a clear and universal superiority of one, there would be no debate. They have different attributes that may make one or the other better or worse at any very specific thing, but taken as a whole, it comes down to how someone cares to value those attributes. Essentially it is a matter of taste. De gustibus non est disputandum

Further, this is a sport. In sports, people voluntarily place limits on themselves. If quick follow-up shots, plenty of ammo in the magazine, and quick reloading were the only considerations, we’d use a semi-automatic rifle with a detachable box magazine. If safety were the only concern, we'd shoot them with a 50BMG at 300 yards.

The hunting community has generally converged around bolt rifles or double rifles in a relatively narrow power range, taking buffalo on foot, from about 50 yards. If someone asks about taking a buffalo with archery equipment, many of us condemn him as reckless and disrespectful to the animal. if someone suggests using a 375RUM because of its flat trajectory, it will be quickly pointed out that dangerous game "should" be taken at close range.

To the average non-hunter, we are all a bit insane for choosing to expose ourselves to the (perceived) danger of hunting these animals. Who's to say they are wrong? There's a lot more people who think its too dangerous than those of us who think it's a good time.

I'm confident the PH is proficient with a bolt rifle and aware of its advantages and
disadvantages vis à vis a double rifle. He made his choice from a position of knowledge, not ignorance. He is the only person who can decide if it remains his choice.

As Dean exhibited…I have the utmost confidence in my PH backing me up. I always want my PH to be confident in me knowing whatever I choose either DR of Bolt Action I am competent and have practiced until I know I can consistently place my first shot in the kill zone

 

[TOBY458]

Can we just see more photos of Doubles vs. Bolts ..

View attachment 587392

What kind of rifle is this? I love the looks of it.

 

[Datchew]

know what i learned from this thread?
Never have video taken of my hunt.

If nothing more obvious went wrong, I'd still probably hear about how my outfit doesn't match my sling or something.

 

[pigsticker]

I can say from experience that a TSX can pass through on a broadside shot.

With a proper 1x scope, the only advantage to switching to iron sights would be the minimal sight offset with the irons. Which doesn’t much matter if you don’t properly operate your bolt.

I still trying to figure out why nobody shot the buffalo while it was on its knees facing away. PH reloading and client shot over it perhaps?

Client jammed his bolt and couldn't cycle a shell into the chamber. You can see him try several times and even drops the rifle to look at what was going on.

 

[Tokoloshe Safaris]

One point that seems to be overlooked in this thread is the fact that a double rifle is actually 2 rifles with one stock. As unlikely as it may be what if the double that Dean was using broke a stryker or had a trigger malfunction, he would still have a working rifle. With a bolt gun broken firing pin or trigger malfunction you now have a 5kg. club.

As I mentioned earlier I pick my rifle based on where I think we will be when the crap hits the fan.

Lon

 

[hoytcanon]

If I had to gamble my life on a bet... my money would be on two quick shots, rather than my ability to cycle a bolt twice and getting back on target "before" I'm playing a harp.

 

[Challer]

Good advertising video for the PH school.

As far as the charging bull target is concerned, I also had the opportunity to once practice with it and an old bolt action rifle caliber 505 Gibbs. Unfortunately, in the reality a buffalo does not approach you so rigidly, but reloading and shooting quickly with a big bore rifle can be practiced well.

I’m having visions of IPSC class for DG hunters!

 

[LEFOL SAFARIS]

There so much factor can lead to a charge like that...
Shot place a couple of inches forward will probably just drop the buffalo. I always say the first shot count the most!

I know a lot of PH want their client to use a solide for bufflo, I can understand that I sow all kind of bullets failed, Barnes, swift A Frame, oryx and many more.

I'm bolt action fans I have always been using one for driven hunt, big game in Africa at a young age I stated shoting guinea fawl, rabbit, francolin. My dad who have guided for over 40 years ate double for different reason.
Mainly due to people don't practice enough with their double and also think don't use to open sight and think where ever they will shot the game will drop.

Like everything there good and bad side for double same for bolt action it's a big topic where we can write a pages.

The other thing is many time we go to quick after a buffalo wounded, it's not rare for me to wait several hours before start tracking. One of client told me last year I was the first PH to make him wait so long and he shot over 50 buffalos and the 5 one before that ended up by a charge.

The emotional side it's hard to handle specially in that kind of situation.

Choose a set up you comfortable with and train with it and use it before on non dangerous game.

 

[Philip Glass]

Phillip, when I shot my Buffalo - and we couldn’t determine the results due to tall grass and the resort of the herd stampeding off, my PH immediately told me to reload with “solids” before we approached the area and looked for the buff. I assumed it was because he wanted me to take any shot — at any angle — if needed? He carried a Remington .416 bolt action and I think it was push feed.

Living in the past. I do not know what else to say. Solids will penetrate very little more than a TSX. Sorry to all the PH's who disagree.

 

[Philip Glass]

So what you are saying is that it is entirely the clients fault for not thoroughly testing his rifle before going on a DG hunt. Who else would be at fault in this case?

Fortunately it was of little consequence as the PH was able to sort it out.

Like I said a lot went wrong here as will happen in a situation like this. Glad it all turned out ok.

 

[HankBuck]

Living in the past. I do not know what else to say. Solids will penetrate very little more than a TSX. Sorry to all the PH's who disagree.

Phillip - I actually used a 500 gr TSX for my 1st shot - a frontal hit in the chest as Buff was facing me at 75 yrds and standing in middle of a herd - but clear from other buff. Herd ran off, i reloaded w/solids, removed scope from my .470NE double, we walked up in the chest high grass to the spot - No Buff, THEN he stood up 20 feet behind me…PH yelled “don’t shoot” (I had a clear standing shot @ 20 feet) then buff ran off and presented No Shot. We tracked blood for 4 hours, jumped him twice in thick bush within 50 feet - but couldn’t even see his outline. One of the staff waiting in the truck later told us he saw buff walk by, head down and badly hurt…but we Never recovered, looked for vultures for two days and No luck. PH told me later reason he yelled “don’t shoot” was he wasn’t certain it was same buff - didn’t want 2 wounded buff in the tall grass cover?? I should’ve made a better 1st shot anyway but I always thought that I had a chance to put “2 more in him” and that would’ve helped recover him.