Politics

[BSO Dave]

 

[Scott CWO]

The truth hurts. Barr on Trump:

He provoked this whole problem himself," Barr said, adding that while he believed Trump had been subject to "witch hunts" before, that "doesn't obviate the fact that he's also a fundamentally flawed person who engages in reckless conduct, and that leads to situations — calamitous situations like this — which are very destructive and hurt any political cause he's associated with."

He will always put his own interests, and gratifying his own ego, ahead of everything else, including the country's interest, there's no question about it," Barr said. "This is a perfect example of that."

 

[Wathe208]

 

[steve white]

The truth hurts. Barr on Trump:

He provoked this whole problem himself," Barr said, adding that while he believed Trump had been subject to "witch hunts" before, that "doesn't obviate the fact that he's also a fundamentally flawed person who engages in reckless conduct, and that leads to situations — calamitous situations like this — which are very destructive and hurt any political cause he's associated with."

He will always put his own interests, and gratifying his own ego, ahead of everything else, including the country's interest, there's no question about it," Barr said. "This is a perfect example of that."

Tho I can't equate not taking a salary as serving his own self interests. I voted for SCOTUS picks--I got them.

 

[Scott CWO]

Tho I can't equate not taking a salary as serving his own self interests. I voted for SCOTUS picks--I got them.

I agree. Just wish he could control himself.

 

[Wathe208]

The truth hurts. Barr on Trump:

He provoked this whole problem himself," Barr said, adding that while he believed Trump had been subject to "witch hunts" before, that "doesn't obviate the fact that he's also a fundamentally flawed person who engages in reckless conduct, and that leads to situations — calamitous situations like this — which are very destructive and hurt any political cause he's associated with."

He will always put his own interests, and gratifying his own ego, ahead of everything else, including the country's interest, there's no question about it," Barr said. "This is a perfect example of that."

I'm not sure Barr is super clean here and I've never put a ton of stock in him personally. Wasn't he the AG who handed the Biden case to some left wingers where it was ignored, like in Delaware? And...yes, Trump was indicted, but as my attorney father says "you can indict a ham sandwich." Indictment by a grand jury means that all they heard was the prosecutions side to see if it has merit, none of the defenses arguments, AND, it was in NY. The same wackos that just indicted the marine Penny for murder while he was protecting innocent folks on a train. You wonder why the left is picking where they bring up these charges and now are furious the randomly selected judge is in Florida?

Bottom line, we can chat back and forth on this, that, and the other, but we are witnessing the fall of our constitution, and you better have your house in order cause the only sound some are going to listen to is measured in grains, not decibels.

 

[Ray B]

One of the benefits of living in a state farther down on the primary schedule is that the candidates are pretty much selected by the time it comes for my vote- So I ignore all the intraparty mud slinging and when it gets to the general I vote for the candidate of my choice who is generally ABAD- anyone but a demonrat.

 

[Scott CWO]

I

I'm not sure Barr is super clean here and I've never put a ton of stock in him personally. Wasn't he the AG who handed the Biden case to some left wingers where it was ignored, like in Delaware? And...yes, Trump was indicted, but as my attorney father says "you can indict a ham sandwich." Indictment by a grand jury means that all they heard was the prosecutions side to see if it has merit, none of the defenses arguments, AND, it was in NY. The same wackos that just indicted the marine Penny for murder while he was protecting innocent folks on a train. You wonder why the left is picking where they bring up these charges and now are furious the randomly selected judge is in Florida?

Bottom line, we can chat back and forth on this, that, and the other, but we are witnessing the fall of our constitution, and you better have your house in order cause the only sound some are going to listen to is measured in grains, not decibels.

I expected an attack on Barr. I guess that’s the usual response to any criticism of Trump. Trump is on tape admitting and showing military plans to a book writer. I voted for him but it’s time for someone else.

 

[Wathe208]

I

I expected an attack on Barr. I guess that’s the usual response to any criticism of Trump. Trump is on tape admitting and showing military plans to a book writer. I voted for him but it’s time for someone else.

A few thoughts if I may as its my day off:

First, if one is "expecting" an attack on Barr, doesn't it lead to reason that they're already on defense, and maybe FOR good reason? And if "questioning" is criticism and is a "trigger" or you don't agree with an opinion (including the following), I would suggest some Wheeties for breakfast.

Second, Barr was AG from what, 2019-2020? So at least 3-4 years ago, he knew about the 1023 and sent it to Deleware, the same state Biden comes from, and was the longest running Democratic senator in history there, if memory serves. I'm sure he had no political allies there, in fact, I hear it's full of Conservatives...lol. Mar-a-lago was raided 10 months ago, that's how long it took to conclude that investigation, yet here we are, 3 years at least and the Biden 1023 issue remains open. And, the FBI refused to acknowledge until a whistleblower came forward, and then refused a subpoena from congress. Not to even bring up Hilary's server or Hunter....OMG.

Third, if you've heard the Trump tape, please forward the link as I honestly would like to hear it for myself. On the flip side, if you'd like the link to Biden discussing withholding $1B from Ukraine until a certain prosecutor was fired and then laughing saying "and you know what, they fired that sumbitch," I can send that to you.

Fourth, Criticism of Trump..oh please. First it was Russia collusion, another fancy word for treason BTW. Treason remains a capital offense in the US. Now, there are enough current charges he would die in prison if convicted, so a life sentence. These two items are just a few of the many "investigations" he has and continues to endure. We past "criticism" long ago friend, this is someone's life.

Finally, I never said I was a Trump fan, I also wanted him to go quietly into retirement, well before Mar-a-lago for my own reasons. Nor did I say he hasn't done anything wrong. I'm saying we have no idea, and based on the "Russia Russia Russia" nerrative (and all other propaganda), I'll wait for ALL evidence as should any educated person. But, I'm an America fan, and our current legal system seems to me, to be as corrupt as any third world country I've ever been to. Places where a government agency can make millions of gun owners felons with the strike of a pen, AFTER that same agency ok'd them in the first place. Places where child indoctrination is a norm, because after all, your children belong to the state. Places where if you don't like someone's politics, you can target them and literally ruin or end their life. Places where the right "feelings" override my god given or constitutional rights.

Phew... that's a lot, apologies. Not trying to argue or pick a fight, really. But IMHO, we are in dangerous times and should take stock of that.

 

[Red Leg]

A few thoughts if I may as its my day off:

First, if one is "expecting" an attack on Barr, doesn't it lead to reason that they're already on defense, and maybe FOR good reason? And if "questioning" is criticism and is a "trigger" or you don't agree with an opinion (including the following), I would suggest some Wheeties for breakfast.

Second, Barr was AG from what, 2019-2020? So at least 3-4 years ago, he knew about the 1023 and sent it to Deleware, the same state Biden comes from, and was the longest running Democratic senator in history there, if memory serves. I'm sure he had no political allies there, in fact, I hear it's full of Conservatives...lol. Mar-a-lago was raided 10 months ago, that's how long it took to conclude that investigation, yet here we are, 3 years at least and the Biden 1023 issue remains open. And, the FBI refused to acknowledge until a whistleblower came forward, and then refused a subpoena from congress. Not to even bring up Hilary's server or Hunter....OMG.

Third, if you've heard the Trump tape, please forward the link as I honestly would like to hear it for myself. On the flip side, if you'd like the link to Biden discussing withholding $1B from Ukraine until a certain prosecutor was fired and then laughing saying "and you know what, they fired that sumbitch," I can send that to you.

Fourth, Criticism of Trump..oh please. First it was Russia collusion, another fancy word for treason BTW. Treason remains a capital offense in the US. Now, there are enough current charges he would die in prison if convicted, so a life sentence. These two items are just a few of the many "investigations" he has and continues to endure. We past "criticism" long ago friend, this is someone's life.

Finally, I never said I was a Trump fan, I also wanted him to go quietly into retirement, well before Mar-a-lago for my own reasons. Nor did I say he hasn't done anything wrong. I'm saying we have no idea, and based on the "Russia Russia Russia" nerrative (and all other propaganda), I'll wait for ALL evidence as should any educated person. But, I'm an America fan, and our current legal system seems to me, to be as corrupt as any third world country I've ever been to. Places where a government agency can make millions of gun owners felons with the strike of a pen, AFTER that same agency ok'd them in the first place. Places where child indoctrination is a norm, because after all, your children belong to the state. Places where if you don't like someone's politics, you can target them and literally ruin or end their life. Places where the right "feelings" override my god given or constitutional rights.

Phew... that's a lot, apologies. Not trying to argue or pick a fight, really. But IMHO, we are in dangerous times and should take stock of that.

To simply add some perspective. I am a registered republican.

I trust Barr infinitely more than I trust Donald Trump on any subject.

 

[Wathe208]

To simply add some perspective. I am a registered republican.

I trust Barr infinitely more than I trust Donald Trump on any subject.

And that's great and to each his own, truly. But to be clear, I'm not saying I trust Donald Trump. I'm saying a conservative is being targeted. I'm also questioning Barr. Why is he putting himself in the National media spotlight, opining on what he's reviewed from the prosecutor Jack Smith, who BTW, was appointed by Merrick Garland? Is Barr part of the prosecution as well, or just read the indictment? As I mentioned earlier, the Indictment is one sided-the prosecutorial side, and in 48 years, I've yet to eat a pancake so thin it had only has one side. If I'm wrong on the timeline with Barr, please correct me. But if not, and now him on the media making assumptions with no defensive arguments...? I trust him As much as I do myself not to eat a pastrami sandwich from Katz's Deli sitting in front of me (If ya' know, ya' know).

 

[Red Leg]

And that's great and to each his own, truly. But to be clear, I'm not saying I trust Donald Trump. I'm saying a conservative is being targeted. I'm also questioning Barr. Why is he putting himself in the National media spotlight, opining on what he's reviewed from the prosecutor Jack Smith, who BTW, was appointed by Merrick Garland? Is Barr part of the prosecution as well, or just read the indictment? As I mentioned earlier, the Indictment is one sided-the prosecutorial side, and in 48 years, I've yet to eat a pancake so thin it had only has one side. If I'm wrong on the timeline with Barr, please correct me. But if not, and now him on the media making assumptions with no defensive arguments...? I trust him As much as I do myself not to eat a pastrami sandwich from Katz's Deli sitting in front of me (If ya' know, ya' know).

Unlike you and I, Barr has had the "privilege" of observing Donald Trump up close and personal. He could not have been more supportive of his president during the whole Russian collusion nonsense. But I suspect the call for demonstrations on Jan 6, after his DOJ found no meaningful evidence of fraud, was a turning point for him. A conclusion I assume you know was reached by Trump's own investigative consultants.

With respect to the indictment, it is fairly obvious that Trump likely broke the law. Bragging to third parties about what you have is at best stupid - divulging it would be criminal. It is equally obvious that Biden, at least from a storage perspective, broke legal storage requirements as well - but far less flagrantly (just like Pence).

And just for arguments sake, what in Trump's screed is truly conservative? But I digress.

My only point is that Donald plays and manipulates his supporters as cynically as any Tammany Hall politician ever dreamed of doing.

What really irritates me is that this egocentric aged demagogue is going to open the door for an even more delusional senile old man to retain office when any other competent opponent could defeat him in a landside.

 

[Wathe208]

Unlike you and I, Barr has had the "privilege" of observing Donald Trump up close and personal. He could not have been more supportive of his president during the whole Russian collusion nonsense. But I suspect the call for demonstrations on Jan 6, after his DOJ found no meaningful evidence of fraud, was a turning point for him. A conclusion I assume you know was reached by Trump's own investigative consultants.

With respect to the indictment, it is fairly obvious that Trump likely broke the law. Bragging to third parties about what you have is at best stupid - divulging it would be criminal. It is equally obvious that Biden, at least from a storage perspective, broke legal storage requirements as well - but far less flagrantly (just like Pence).

And just for arguments sake, what in Trump's screed is truly conservative? But I digress.

My only point is that Donald plays and manipulates his supporters as cynically as any Tammany Hall politician ever dreamed of doing.

What really irritates me is that this egocentric aged demagogue is going to open the door for an even more delusional senile old man to retain office when any other competent opponent could defeat him in a landside.

LOL. I think, at least in appearance to me, we're likely in more agreement than not. However, I'll respond to your paragraphs in order below.

Maybe that WAS his "turning point." Funny how that comment in and of itself makes my argument. That he has turned and lost his unbiased objectivity, thank you. I won't offer up any more thoughts on the January 6th comment other than when you have thousands of instances of voter fraud, and numerous states involved, to have the Supreme Court say Texas lacked standing is a joke. The Presidential election is a Federal election, affecting every state. Another awful day in our history IMO. The Supreme Court is there to resolve issues amongst states, where else are we left to go...? Whole other topic though.

You state "it's fairly obvious trump LIKELY broke the law." I would respond it's equally fairly obvious to me that he just as likely didn't break the law. Time will tell when all evidence is presented and vetted. I personally think we're innocent until proven guilty in the US, but admittedly feel I'm in the minority of late. I don't argue the stupid factor, but not sure it was criminal. And I'm sorry, but in regards to Biden, ignorance of the law has NEVER been an excuse for breaking the law. Just because he was less flagrant, doesn't make the offense ok. Yet, HE and Pence remain unpunished. I would argue if Pence were still team Trump, he'd be up to his ears in indictments as well.

Now I'm just a small town kid, but if you mean by screed his articulation, then nothing, he bumbles along arrogantly. If you mean tenure, then where to start, the Economy, the Abraham Accords, border security, or the TCJA. I could go into detail, especially the TCJA as that's my area, but also digress.

With all due respect, that doesn't seem to be your only point. You are also making a point of Barr's integrity, to which we can and apparently do, respectfully disagree. Your point about Trump, I agree with, yet doesn't that strengthen my questioning the motives of Barr? Is he the "hell hath no wrath" type of individual like Mitt Romney turned out to be? Making decisions based on prior insults and personal offenses offered up from that big mouth of Trump? Not the first, and certainly won't be the last.

To your final thought, 1,000% in agreement.

Now, getting back to the point, then I'll retire for the evening. My first reply in this thread was questioning Barr's integrity, which I do and is my right to question and your right to disagree, which is frankly, pretty cool. I will close with this....Time will tell on the indictment and trial. Maybe next year at the SCI convention we'll know the turnout of these shenanigans. If there's an AH get together we're at, I'll gladly buy you a beer if you're right and hope you would accept. If I am, I would hope for the same. I like anything but Bud Light.

Cheers!

 

[Ray B]

I find it interesting that the prosecutor of President Trump is the name-sake of the TV show YOU ASKED FOR IT.

 

[Brent in Az]

Jack Smith is a political hitman, and has a vendetta against Trump.

 

[Brent in Az]

Among Trumps many mistakes, was appointing spineless Jeff Sessions, and Barr.
Trump doesnt seem to understand that you can't drain the swamp by putting the swamp creatures in charge of the ABC departments

 

[bowjijohn]

I watch, heart in mouth, the Ukrainian counter thrust

Hoping that they have some clever initiative up their sleeve

Some technological marvel that will address the established military doctrine that an attacking force requires air superiority and a 3 to 1 advantage

I just don’t see that they have the military mass to accomplish their aims

What then is NATO’s ambition for them?

A Russian defeat?

Or

Perpetual war, tying up Russia in an un-winnable local conflict- thus blunting them as a strategic threat?

 

[Ray B]

I watch the Ukrainian counter thrust

I don’t see that they have the military mass to accomplish their aims

What then is NATO’s ambition?

Perpetual war, an un-winnable local conflict-

Some think that is the goal of the Military Industrial Complex- based primarily in the US. Afterall, remember how their business valuations sank when the USSR dissolved and China had not yet shown it's imperialistic motivations.

 

[bowjijohn]

Some think that is the goal of the Military Industrial Complex- based primarily in the US. Afterall, remember how their business valuations sank when the USSR dissolved and China had not yet shown it's imperialistic motivations.

There was a time when I’d have scoffed at such a thought

Today, however, I fear that the individual and his freedoms are assaulted by both the left and global multinationals

Both represent a form of totalitarian control

 

[Scott CWO]

A few thoughts if I may as its my day off:

First, if one is "expecting" an attack on Barr, doesn't it lead to reason that they're already on defense, and maybe FOR good reason? And if "questioning" is criticism and is a "trigger" or you don't agree with an opinion (including the following), I would suggest some Wheeties for breakfast.

Second, Barr was AG from what, 2019-2020? So at least 3-4 years ago, he knew about the 1023 and sent it to Deleware, the same state Biden comes from, and was the longest running Democratic senator in history there, if memory serves. I'm sure he had no political allies there, in fact, I hear it's full of Conservatives...lol. Mar-a-lago was raided 10 months ago, that's how long it took to conclude that investigation, yet here we are, 3 years at least and the Biden 1023 issue remains open. And, the FBI refused to acknowledge until a whistleblower came forward, and then refused a subpoena from congress. Not to even bring up Hilary's server or Hunter....OMG.

Third, if you've heard the Trump tape, please forward the link as I honestly would like to hear it for myself. On the flip side, if you'd like the link to Biden discussing withholding $1B from Ukraine until a certain prosecutor was fired and then laughing saying "and you know what, they fired that sumbitch," I can send that to you.

Fourth, Criticism of Trump..oh please. First it was Russia collusion, another fancy word for treason BTW. Treason remains a capital offense in the US. Now, there are enough current charges he would die in prison if convicted, so a life sentence. These two items are just a few of the many "investigations" he has and continues to endure. We past "criticism" long ago friend, this is someone's life.

Finally, I never said I was a Trump fan, I also wanted him to go quietly into retirement, well before Mar-a-lago for my own reasons. Nor did I say he hasn't done anything wrong. I'm saying we have no idea, and based on the "Russia Russia Russia" nerrative (and all other propaganda), I'll wait for ALL evidence as should any educated person. But, I'm an America fan, and our current legal system seems to me, to be as corrupt as any third world country I've ever been to. Places where a government agency can make millions of gun owners felons with the strike of a pen, AFTER that same agency ok'd them in the first place. Places where child indoctrination is a norm, because after all, your children belong to the state. Places where if you don't like someone's politics, you can target them and literally ruin or end their life. Places where the right "feelings" override my god given or constitutional rights.

Phew... that's a lot, apologies. Not trying to argue or pick a fight, really. But IMHO, we are in dangerous times and should take stock of that.

Do your own research. The tape was played on Fox just after the indictment. It’s been widely reported as Trump’s biggest problem with this indictment.

As for Barr and your posts with @Red Leg, Barr is looking out for the country. No matter how badly Trump was treated in his first term, Trump is a lunatic and is a dangerous problem and not good for our country. If you can’t see that, you’re part of the cult of his personality. We need to support policies, not deeply flawed people, just because we agree with them about policies. I’m sure in life or business, you have came across people that could do part of a job, but couldn’t handle the whole job so, they weren’t promoted. That’s Trump. He’s a deeply flawed name-calling narcissist child who won’t even listen to his family or lawyers. He’s his own worst enemy yet people still want to elect him again when we have better choices. We are better than this!

Yes, I know Biden is also deeply flawed and we can’t endure another four years of him. He and his family need prosecuted for corruption. My Gawd, can’t we band together and elect Desantis or another sane Republican??? Instead of Trump or Biden?? Geez, wake up people! So frustrating!