My Take on Dangerous Game Scopes

[Philip Glass]

Philip are you sure it was the QD rings that were off not the scope? Some experiences have led me to believe Leopolds are not as bombproof as people claim.

Regardless I have been nervous about QD rings for a while. Suppose that little lever gets bumped a bit. At what point does it change the pressure hold the scope rings and change zero? I think for peace of mind I'd rather just carry a small screw driver.

It is a good point you bring up. I don't know for sure. I've just not had much trouble with the VX6's getting off except this one with the QD rings. My wife took a tumble with her new VX5 last year and dented the scope yet it was not off.
If a guy has QD rings that work then it's all good! The Alaskan seem to be the best but I think they are limited in what rifles they can be used on.

 

[Philip Glass]

I guess it’s all perspective. Seems to me to be a video about pg scopes suitable for dangerous game.
Certainly I love my z8 1.7-13.3 scope but I personally would find that scope far too big to place on my 416RM for dangerous game hunting, I would need a gun bearer to carry it. Generally if I have been hunting dg I haven’t been interested in hunting pg but if something popped up I would certainly feel comfortable taking it with a 1-6 or 1-8 power scope unless it was one of the tiny’s at extended range.
Having said that, if I was hunting leopard (which isn’t likely for me) that scope would be my first choice but my 416RM wouldn’t be.
Well presented video by the way.

Thanks!

 

[Philip Glass]

Couldn't agree more. What I've done is to remove the optics and stuff it in my carry-on to avoid the baggage gorillas; works for me.

You stated a couple things about QD's in your video that made me very curious. One is an incident where your scope was off by 8" to 10", Assuming one click = 1/4" that's 32 to 40 clicks! That's huge, way beyond anything I would expect. There must be a plausible reason for this; maybe your QD's were not setup or adjusted right.

The other thing is that QD's could inadvertently release. I have heard of that happening and I do agree that you really don't need QD's anyway. If you do use them you need to be sure that the release levers are adjusted properly. If they are tight enough not only is coming back to zero (more) assured but you can be (more) confident that the thing wont loosen up.

Lastly, I didn't "state that [what I bought] is the best even though it's never been beat around over seas", not sure where that came from.

My setup was working fine and had been on a few safaris. Then in Namibia one time I shot blue and black Wildebeest very badly. My PH looked at me on the second one and said "that gun is way off"! Indeed it was way off and the rings seemed to be fine. Who knows. A bad experience is hard to get over.

 

[Philip Glass]

Good video

Thanks

 

[Philip Glass]

@Philip Glass the video was certainly an undertaking which has merit and was informational based on a person with a lot of experience. Thanks for sharing your opinions with us.

This is definitely a solid statement. There are a lot of opinions out there of a product's durability that still have all the finish on them. Not nearly enough usage for such convicted testimony.

I was pleased to see mounting marks on the scopes in the video and a rifle that looked used. I enjoyed the old school mixed with new school in bigger powers and cautionary tales about QD mounts and turrets.

The Leupold VX-R 2-7x33 was a great offering that I wish I had bought a dozen of. Illuminated reticle and 30mm was just too many new things for me to embrace all at once. After the first few hunts with it I was missing it in the early and late moments if I didn't have it along.

I recently had a Leupold VX-3I 4.5-14x40 playing games with me on the range shifting impacts between powers. I confirmed this over two sessions with the 4.5x being the offender at both 50 and 100 yards as the rifle retained zero at 14x even after dismount/remount. I was thankful for the ability to change to another scope rapidly as this is the only rifle I own that has multiple optics set up for it. However, the other option was a VX-2 2.5x heavy duplex scope that had a wide field of view and I felt the capability of the rifle from a precision standpoint change. I also feel like if I had invested in a VX-6 2-12x42 that I would not be concerned about QD as much.

I have a few questions your scope preferences.
Are you doing everything with a .375 type caliber? Would you have a different opinion on something much larger outside of the .416-.404 power levels?
Do you find there is a maximum return at some point on objective size? You seem to stop in the 40's.
At what point in the power scale do you find the ability to instantly line up a shot no longer exists? I feel like it's somewhere between 2-4x.

I wonder why two scopes are not made at present: 1or2-8x56 illuminated reticle and 1-12x50. Why is the scope world acting like a true one power to something functional has to be a straight objective?

Thank you for your insights here. For me personally I do stop at .375 currently for a scoped rifle. I am now in love with my double with the little Kahles red dot that makes it a 100yd gun. Yes I think the objective at 42mm is big enough for what I am doing. As others have mentioned, you get into mounting issues with the larger ones.
I always say know your equipment. Your scope trouble can happen to any of us with any scope. Knowing issues ahead of time will save the hunt.,

 

[Philip Glass]

Uhhh .... mine?

I am sorry to hear that. It happens. Down to the wire on the big stuff and no extra days to chase others.

 

[Forrest Halley]

Thank you for your insights here. For me personally I do stop at .375 currently for a scoped rifle. I am now in love with my double with the little Kahles red dot that makes it a 100yd gun. Yes I think the objective at 42mm is big enough for what I am doing. As others have mentioned, you get into mounting issues with the larger ones.
I always say know your equipment. Your scope trouble can happen to any of us with any scope. Knowing issues ahead of time will save the hunt.,

Well Sir now that I understand where you are stopping for a caliber with a scope your choices make a lot of sense to be sitting on a do all rifle such as the .375. Perhaps on a heavier rifle so much magnification and the increased mount height requirement would not be of such use.

 

[cajunchefray]

I would go with the Exos. I love Swarovski scopes and have 5 or 6 Z6i and the only current model S&B scopes I have are the Exos. I see others posting about Swarovski issues, but I never have had any problems. Exos is proven.

View attachment 571936

That's an awesome buffalo!

 

[Puddle]

I am sorry to hear that. It happens. Down to the wire on the big stuff and no extra days to chase others.

Quite true, especially this last season. I still think about that one Sable...

However, there's one extra wrinkle that I didn't expect - turns out culling cape buffalo cows is a whole lotta fun!

 

[xausa]

I suppose I'm hopelessly old fashioned, but I look at any feature on a scope beyond focus as asking for trouble. Consequently, my DG rifles are equipped with low powered scopes (2 1/2X to 3X) and have no self centering reticles. To me, combining a heavy recoil rifle with a scope packed with "extras" is just asking for trouble. My scopes also feature long eye relief and very large fields of view, both pluses for a rifle producing heavy recoil. Among my favorites are Lyman Alaskans and Noske Field Scopes, both combining all the features I find to be essential. The last situation I don't intend to be in is one where I am facing a raging animal with a rifle equipped with a useless sighting system. By the way, my favorite DG rifle has no scope at all, has over 100 foot pounds of free recoil and has never failed me.

 

[Daisy]

I suppose I'm hopelessly old fashioned, but I look at any feature on a scope beyond focus as asking for trouble. Consequently, my DG rifles are equipped with low powered scopes (2 1/2X to 3X) and have no self centering reticles. To me, combining a heavy recoil rifle with a scope packed with "extras" is just asking for trouble. My scopes also feature long eye relief and very large fields of view, both pluses for a rifle producing heavy recoil. Among my favorites are Lyman Alaskans and Noske Field Scopes, both combining all the features I find to be essential. The last situation I don't intend to be in is one where I am facing a raging animal with a rifle equipped with a useless sighting system. By the way, my favorite DG rifle has no scope at all, has over 100 foot pounds of free recoil and has never failed me.

Serious question.

Why do the US special forces use these same optics Philip mentioned in CQCB? There is no greater dangerous game than that. Why don’t they use open sites only?

Because the “dangerous game scopes” have been proven over and over with people’s lives. They hold up on SCAR 17’s through thousands of rounds (way way harder on optics than 12 shots on sticks practicing for Africa hunt).

The things people use as reasons make no sense to me. The puddle jumper and truck on terrible roads is so so so so so much more dangerous than an optic failing you during a buffalo rush. The quick target acquisition of modern optics, proven with thousands of tests in military trials, shows the safety of these systems, and my hunch is actually much safer than trusting 1880’s era irons during a charge.

Carry on.

 

[Rare Breed]

Thank you for your insights here. For me personally I do stop at .375 currently for a scoped rifle. I am now in love with my double with the little Kahles red dot that makes it a 100yd gun. Yes I think the objective at 42mm is big enough for what I am doing. As others have mentioned, you get into mounting issues with the larger ones.
I always say know your equipment. Your scope trouble can happen to any of us with any scope. Knowing issues ahead of time will save the hunt.,

Ditto. i tube scope for my 375 but anything larger red dot. yes i have seen some using a tube scope for a 450-400 but i would not. in fact i will be hunting my elephant in March with iron sights yes at 65 years old

 

[bobdahunter84]

Good video, although in some respects it seemed to blend a little common sense and a bit of inconsistent in terms of arguments. I watched this thinking it was specific to DG given the title, but quickly the discussion turned to include PG. The bottom line, your setup should fit your intentions. If you're bringing multiple rifles, specifically one for closer range DG, a traditional quality 1-6 scope is fine. If you're bringing one rifle for DG and PG, you probably want something more versatile.

So in that regard, a quality scope with the widest range of magnification that starts at 1 or 2 is great, especially if it can reach to 10+ on the high side. Obviously, the wider the range of magnification (all else equal) the more it's going to cost.

Kind of the same thing on the objective size. Seems like common sense that wider objective lenses are going to grab more light and perform better in low light situations.

But those bigger objectives come with a tradeoff too, or everyone would only buy 50mm objectives. More weight, bulkier, affects balance, eye relief, etc.

If I was bringing 1 gun for an array of game (375 h&h) I'd have something like a 2-12 scope. If I was bringing multiple guns, I'd have no reservations about the big bore being 1-6.

And I agree 100% on the reticle. I only buy firedot leupold reticles for all my scopes. Just have extra batteries with you!

 

[Daisy]

Good video, although in some respects it seemed to blend a little common sense and a bit of inconsistent in terms of arguments. I watched this thinking it was specific to DG given the title, but quickly the discussion turned to include PG. The bottom line, your setup should fit your intentions. If you're bringing multiple rifles, specifically one for closer range DG, a traditional quality 1-6 scope is fine. If you're bringing one rifle for DG and PG, you probably want something more versatile.

So in that regard, a quality scope with the widest range of magnification that starts at 1 or 2 is great, especially if it can reach to 10+ on the high side. Obviously, the wider the range of magnification (all else equal) the more it's going to cost.

Kind of the same thing on the objective size. Seems like common sense that wider objective lenses are going to grab more light and perform better in low light situations.

But those bigger objectives come with a tradeoff too, or everyone would only buy 50mm objectives. More weight, bulkier, affects balance, eye relief, etc.

If I was bringing 1 gun for an array of game (375 h&h) I'd have something like a 2-12 scope. If I was bringing multiple guns, I'd have no reservations about the big bore being 1-6.

And I agree 100% on the reticle. I only buy firedot leupold reticles for all my scopes. Just have extra batteries with you!

I think what you just said is exactly what Philip just said!

 

[Aussie_Hunter]

Leupold VX-3 HD 1.5-5 is my favourite scope for DG and my favourite for hunting big boars at close to medium ranges, I love the field of view and qualify of glass, Leupolds are always built well they are a tough durable scope, seem to to do well in the wet, cold and heat. I have been using one alot at night this year on a 30-06 with an Olight torch mounted on the rifle , same with my 9.3X62 I have used that quite a bit this year at night as well, also used it for plenty of DG earlier in the year. I'm going to buy this scope over and over and over again.

 

[Forrest Halley]

Leupold VX-3 HD 1.5-5 is my favourite scope for DG and my favourite for hunting big boars at close to medium ranges, I love the field of view and qualify of glass, Leupolds are always built well they are a tough durable scope, seem to to do well in the wet, cold and heat. I have been using one alot at night this year on a 30-06 with an Olight torch mounted on the rifle , same with my 9.3X62 I have used that quite a bit this year at night as well, also used it for plenty of DG earlier in the year. I'm going to buy this scope over and over and over again.

Well funny thing about Leupold is that if you find something you like and it isn't the VX-5 or 6, you better buy it up before they discontinue it. VX-R was great, I fell in love and poof gone.

 

[PARA45]

Great video, and thanks for sharing. Not sure how I missed it.

I currently have two DG rifles, a 375 H&H that has a Trijicon 1-6x24, and a Win Mod 70, 416 Rem Mag. I took the 375 to S. Africa last year and worked great! However, this particular hunt was for plains game, mixed in with some DG hunt (Lioness & Cow Buffalo). Now, during this hunt, there were times I wished I had a bit more magnification, especially on the Nyala & Bush Buck hunts. So, after watching this video, I'm thinking of switching the 1-6 scope, with something with more magnification, and put the 1-6 on my Win Mod 70 416 Rem Mag. We shall see. Thanks Philip, now I need to buy a new scope!

 

[skydiver386]

Well funny thing about Leupold is that if you find something you like and it isn't the VX-5 or 6, you better buy it up before they discontinue it. VX-R was great, I fell in love and poof gone.

Exactly. I have 6 of the VXR 1.25X4's. I have one on my CZ .375 H&H, an AR-15, a Microtec AUG, a Scorpyd crossbow, a Savage muzzle loader, etc. I even have several new in the box stashed for my .450 Rigby build.

I think the VXR line was discontinued because the lighted reticle has become available on many other lines of Leupold scopes, and it wasn't worth carrying a separate model who's only distinguishing feature was that reticle.

 

[Art Lambart II]

Nice video Phil, even nicer trophy room. I agree with you 100% on using a high-power scope on a 375 H&H. It makes no sense to me whatsoever to limit the capabilities of the 375 H&H by using a low power scope.

 

[Beefeater]

I shoot a .416 rem mag wearing a leica 1-6.3 ×24 with illuminated reticle. This set up has functioned without fail for 5 years now and has been good from 20 m to 200 m. In my opinion Leica is right up there with the best. I grew up shooting open sights but do feel that a scoped rifle gives me as a visiting client a better chance of shooting a good shot 1st time round or making a shot possible with time running out that would not be so with irons.