Hunting On Fenced Farms Vs Wilderness Areas

[375Fox]

Plenty of videos out hunting wild Uganda for Lechwe, PH drives by many looking for the one, hunter shoots and pictures taken with Lechwe standing in the background. I have been on the King Ranch many times, well over 800,000 acres, it was there I figured out how deer were taken many years ago with primitive equipment, the whitetail are almost curious and very easy to approach. Yes, they are totally wild but does not necessarily mean they are harder to hunt.

There is no lechwe hunting in Uganda. I have photos from the Caprivi with lechwe in the far background of my trophy as you describe. I’ve seen it in other areas as well where animals have to coexist with people and livestock and poaching is minimal. The game will have a comfort zone of around 200 yards or so you can approach in. I’m much more willing to accept that knowing the animal was always wild and added conservation value compared to the signs of put and take hunting visible on some high fenced ranches for example a ranch in Limpopo with only sable bulls that have minimal fear of humans.

 

[Gemsbok45]

There is no lechwe hunting in Uganda. I have photos from the Caprivi with lechwe in the far background of my trophy as you describe. I’ve seen it in other areas as well where animals have to coexist with people and livestock and poaching is minimal. The game will have a comfort zone of around 200 yards or so you can approach in. I’m much more willing to accept that knowing the animal was always wild and added conservation value compared to the signs of put and take hunting visible on some high fenced ranches for example a ranch in Limpopo with only sable bulls that have minimal fear of humans.

Agreed that’s definitely not what I’m looking for!!

 

[Frederik]

Plenty of videos out hunting wild Uganda for Lechwe, PH drives by many looking for the one, hunter shoots and pictures taken with Lechwe standing in the background. I have been on the King Ranch many times, well over 800,000 acres, it was there I figured out how deer were taken many years ago with primitive equipment, the whitetail are almost curious and very easy to approach. Yes, they are totally wild but does not necessarily mean they are harder to hunt.

I think you re reffering to KOB not Lechwe.
Uganda also a great hunting success but there is people, cattle and goats all over while you hunt in certain areas

 

[FlyGuy]

I have only hunted SA once and it was fantastic. Did some free range around Craddock and then a 40K area around Kimberly. Love the great animals I took there.Lets take it a step further. When I lived in Zim,I did a lot of hunting on my own. Those trophies mean more to me than the ones where I was guided. Now there were some animals that I did not take but would like to now. Sable and Roan.I’m looking at the Limpopo and some of the outfitters there. Will it be different sure but I will be in an area that’s more affordable from a daily rate perspective as well as Trophy fee wise. I will let you know how it goes!!!

I don’t know if Howard Knott is still offering Safaris, but for Sable and Roan, Greater Kuduland Safari’s is very hard to beat.

The area is where both species naturally occur and it’s 65000+ acres of the most pristine bushveld with 4 of the Big 5.

 

[dhoover]

My first Safari was my first hunt behind a fence. The area was huge, and the fence rarely came into play. What I enjoyed about the fence was that there was no competition for animals we were hunting. The PH's were assigned to areas to hunt and so our area each day was our own.

In my decades of hunting the west many times we had to leave camp at 3 am to get to our spot before anyone else. You can pack in 27 miles in the Frank Church in Idaho and still have to compete for your spot. Just try to get your favorite Duck Hunting hole in Bayou Meto in Arkansas on a weekend during duck season. 2 am line ups are not uncommon. This all leads to a lot of stress and sleepless nights.

The fence was not an issue for me, and I expected it would be. The peace of mine it brought was priceless. Especially being so far from home.

 

[thi9elsp]

I've hunted Zambezi Valley (2011) and Niassa (2016). Probably around 400-750,000 acres each time. For my budget, the hunts were within reason yet needed to be justified. My choice, and no judgement on others, was to save up, go fewer times and experience the remote, wild Africa. In 2026, we will probably be traveling to Africa with friends (maybe as many as 6-10) who want to see animals. Afterwards, we'll go hunting for 7-10 days. Looks like they want to go to Tanzania (I'm trying to guide them to Kruger and Vic Falls so I can do a more affordable hunt). Either way, after that, I will have to wait 3 - 5 years before considering going again. But, that's the way I want to do it. Others that hunt the game farms and ranches are doing it their way. I'm ok with that for them.

 

[Hunter-Habib]

If the fencing does not impede the game’s behavior from acting in any other way than it’s natural wild self, then I see absolutely nothing immoral or wrong with hunting in fenced areas.

That said… If budget were no concern (and let’s be honest… it is to some degree or another for most of us), then I’d hunt purely in wilderness areas. There is something very appealing about (for instance) hunting Cape buffalo in elephant or lion country.

 

[Osama Mahdi]

Some hunters are known for shaming others and flaunting their wealth, as they can afford expensive hunt, possibly due to insecurities about their own skills. These individuals don’t bother me.

There are outfitters and PHs in RSA, Mozambique, Zimbabwe, and Namibia who can ruin a hunting trip or even land you in legal trouble. At the DSC, I nearly had an altercation with a disrespectful PH from RSA after just a two-minute conversation. However, a renowned outfitter from Tanzania approached me and, despite knowing I couldn't afford Tanzania, engaged in a highly professional and courteous conversation.

RSA has the highest number of outfitters, which inevitably includes some lower-quality operations.
When deciding between fenced and unfenced areas, it's crucial to choose wisely as it's a significant investment. Both fenced and unfenced areas can offer great experiences. I've seen videos of well-known PHs in wild areas taking young buffalo bulls or shooting before the hunter.
The image from a fenced area in RSA, a fence that have no negative effect on the hunting experience.

 

[375Fox]

Some hunters are known for shaming others and flaunting their wealth, as they can afford expensive hunt, possibly due to insecurities about their own skills. These individuals don’t bother me.

There are outfitters and PHs in RSA, Mozambique, Zimbabwe, and Namibia who can ruin a hunting trip or even land you in legal trouble. At the DSC, I nearly had an altercation with a disrespectful PH from RSA after just a two-minute conversation. However, a renowned outfitter from Tanzania approached me and, despite knowing I couldn't afford Tanzania, engaged in a highly professional and courteous conversation.

RSA has the highest number of outfitters, which inevitably includes some lower-quality operations.
When deciding between fenced and unfenced areas, it's crucial to choose wisely as it's a significant investment. Both fenced and unfenced areas can offer great experiences. I've seen videos of well-known PHs in wild areas taking young buffalo bulls or shooting before the hunter.
The image from a fenced area in RSA, a fence that have no negative effect on the hunting experience.View attachment 628790

Your first statements are about money rather the hunting. It says more than what you wrote to me. I’ve seen here too often a hunter whose top consideration is cost before the experience is willing to overlook a lot or see things they don’t to justify their opinion. I also watch a lot of videos but I can’t think of one instance where the PH shot prior to the hunter except in cases of an unprovoked charge. The taking of young bulls is less and less common everywhere because it’s no longer acceptable as buffalo hunting goals have changed. I can’t think of any well known outfitter or PH putting videos out of taking non-hard boss bulls because it’s damaging to their business. There is a lot of good hunting behind a fence but there is also a lot we shouldn’t be supporting because it isn’t conservation. $1000 or one less animal might make the difference of supporting an outfitter who actually hunts self sustaining animals on quality properties vs hunting with an outfitter who routinely brings in trophy bulls from farming operations to push more hunters through. The breeding operations you’ll see driving through Limpopo are difficult for me to ignore as are the videos of hunting areas with large herds of only sable bulls or buffalo bulls. Basing decisions on the lowest costs causes a lot of questions to not get asked or an eagerness to believe information that’s not logical given some thought. We are supposed to be conservationists first, but seems money gets used as an excuse to justify activities that aren’t supporting conservation. Not all fenced areas are the same. My views have hardened on the subject the more negatives I see that get supported as positives when they aren’t.

 

[spike.t]

Mmm....you missed zambia out in your saying only 3 countries allow ownership of animals......

 

[Hunt27]

My first and currently only Africa hunt was in RSA, Limpopo. Hunting a fence never seemed like something I would like. I live in the American Midwest and free-range whitetail deer is the only big game I have to hunt. The most hunting media I consumed was also deer related and a lot of that trashes high fence hunting and brags about hunting free range, so most Americans are against fence hunting right away.
I had a negative thought about hunting a fence but keep a open mind, and i was lucky to have great outfitter. We had big like really big areas, got winded animals ran away, few days finding the right animal i couldn't tell i was in a fence. But after seeing it, asking questions I can easily see how it could go bad, small areas, phs only after money ect.
This spring i hunted roe deer in Czech, hunted both free range and a 800ha fence. first evening shot a free range deer. 3rd day shot a fence deer. Worked harder to shoot the fence deer then the free range deer.
I'll never knock any legal way someone hunts, divided we fall/fail.

 

[Dirtdart]

I have hunted "fenced farms" and "safari areas". Either can be great, providing the experience is HONESTLY and ACCURATELY described as well as the client being HONEST with themselves as far as expectations.

Slightly off topic but one thing that pisses me off to no end about South Africa is their attempt to be the number one pain in the ass for the traveling hunter to bring his or her own firearm into the country.
A simple single page should be sufficient.

 

[Bandera]

Saswart thanks for the though provoking article.
Hunting has the same problem as many other shooting sports, shotgunning, target shooting, competitive shooting… the people. The people who believe that their way of thinking or what they prefer is the only way and the right way.
If shopping with a rifle from the back of a truck is your prefered way of hunting then great. Which in reality is not much different than going up to my deer stand and waiting till the deer come down from their bedding area.
On the other hand if hunting the Safari area is your style then great.
Some people love driven hunts.

Don’t bash another hunters preference in hunting styles and preference.
The important thing is that we are out supporting the industry.

 

[Neophyte]

A very well written and thought provoking piece.

Having worked on some larger ranches, cattle, there are fences and then there are fences. I’m going to ask y’all to do some math here so bear with me. Let’s say it takes 213.3 acres to support one cow and her calf, or one bull, per year. You run a 1500 head cow/calf operation. 213.3 X 1500 = 319,950 acres. That’s 500 square miles.

Now instead of cattle you stock it with impala, wildebeest, kudu, etc, etc. I’ve gathered cattle on operations like that. They can be just as wild as game animals and might only see a human being twice a year. Other ground might be better for running cattle. Take a farmer in Iowa for instance. He runs 4 head per acre. I’m not including the hay he puts up for winter feeding as I want to keep this simple. The Iowa farmer needs 375 acres to sustain 1500 head of cattle. The rancher puts up hay too for winter feeding of the bulls, sick/injured cattle, and supplement feeding during hard winters.

So fences aren’t a detriment as there are fences everywhere. I’d rather hunt a place bigger than 375 acres and please don’t try to sell me on 375 acres as being big or wild. I’ve seen big and wild without ever having to leave the U.S.. There are some really great deer on those 375 acre places though. Some are naturally reproducing and some are genetically engineered for raising big antlers. I’ll stick with the naturally reproducing.

I’ve never hunted in Africa, or been there, but I’m planning a trip for 2026. Maybe my view will change after I go there I don’t know.

 

[375 Ruger Fan]

I've hunted fenced properties and so-called open or low fenced areas. Only one I didn't like and that was because the property was about 2000 acres and it seemed we just drove from fence line to fence line. If the properties are large, say 5000 acres or larger, you don't get the feeling you are on a high fenced property. Game can readily escape from a hunter's stalk.

I hunted the 880,000 acre BVC and even though it is huge, it has a significant amount of roads and boreholes that were used back in the cattle ranching days.

Whenever I read a post like the OP's post, I go back to this well written article that captures the topic so well:

Thread 'The Third Way By Peter Ryan'

Sep 25, 2016

I was checking out some of the AH sponsor's websites this morning and came across this article from @hansv. It's well worth reading.

http://cvsafaris.co.za/the-third-way-by-peter-ryan/

Dave

• 375 Ruger Fan
• Replies: 14
• Forum: Articles

• 

 

[Deepfork]

Great insight from the OP, thank you!

The biggest take away from all of this is do the research and know what you are getting into no matter where in Africa you decide to hunt or what outfitter you decide to hunt with.

I will not get into another debate in this thread but some of you know I have defended one of the outfitters that is a favorite target of those who don't like the perceived model of the hunting industry in South Africa and Limpopo specifically.

What I am going to say here is my experience was unique and different from the perceptions some of you hold.

My group spent the first few days of our hunt in South Africa at a reserve in Free State. It was a large beautiful property and had a wild feel. Never saw a fence or another hunter once we were on the property, all of the animals were very wary. Mountain Zebra was at the top of my want list, we spent most of a day on foot on the rocky hillsides trying to get a shot at a small group my PH had spotted. I got on the sticks twice and was literally a heart beat away from a shot before they bolted. So the mountain Zebra is still on the top of my list for my next hunt. I took the water buck in my profile pic during a Zebra stalk in what I will admit was a chance encounter. Beautiful water buck, 31 inches on each side.

When we moved on to Limpopo the experiences varied greatly. We hunted a couple of relatively small properties that seemed to be managed for specific species. Also hunted large properties that were very diverse and had the feel of wild places. I enjoyed the small farms we visited. Usually the farm owner would jump in the vehicle with us, I enjoyed that interaction...just part of the overall experience.

I saw a huge Kudu clear a high fence with little perceived effort that was impressive to me! One of the guys in my group took a giant Kudu with his bow at a water hole on the lodge property, not in a high fenced area. He was there hoping to get a shot at a wart hog. One of my sons was hunting on the banks of the Limpopo river, it was private property but no fences and on the border. He shot a bush buck at about 150 yds, hyenas were on it by the time he and the PH got to it.

I could go on, my point is we had a great time. Looking back part of what was great about it was the diversity of the hunting experiences we had. I met great people and I'm bringing nine great trophies home (my crate shipped this week). I'll go back to Limpopo, I'll also hunt other parts of South Africa and other countries.

 

[Osama Mahdi]

One advantage of low-cost, fenced hunting is that it attracts "recruit" new hunters. This initial experience often breaks the ice, leading them to seek out more challenging and expensive, wild hunts in different countries.

 

[Hank2211]

It might be helpful if we could agree on the meaning of our terms.

Some use the term “wild areas” to mean areas which are devoid of people. Some suggested that by this definition, perhaps only some places in Alaska and Canada would qualify. I would suggest that people have been just about everywhere since time began, in much the same way that animals have. The only places - in my experience - you are likely to find no people are places which are fenced and patrolled. I have found people in the jungles of Liberia and Cameroon, or the Danakil desert in Ethiopia (lots of people), all of which I think are about as wild as it gets, and much wilder than you will find in North America (especially if a total lack of law and order is part of your definition).

I have also found some very large fenced areas in Zimbabwe and South Africa without any human habitation, some of which I would suggest are “wild” by any definition (BVC, for example), while others are decidedly not wild - luxury lodges, wi-fi, spas, etc. If people have been kicked out of the area to allow for hunting, is it really ‘wild’?

Others use the term “wild areas” to mean areas which are unfenced. First, I don’t think it’s helpful to say that ultimately, everywhere is fenced in one way or another. I’m not sure that’s true, but even if it is, I think we can agree that if the nearest fence is a hundred miles away, it’s pretty irrelevant to whatever you might be doing, and so should bear not part in deterring the nature of your hunt.

Secondly, I think you have to determine what purpose the fence serves. Many fences serve to keep people out, just as much, if not more so, than to keep animals in. Some fences - low fences - do keep animals in, most of the time, but if pressured, the animals will easily jump the fences and move on. Is the fact that the animals are content to respect the fences if not bothered the determinant? Or does it have to be a high fence, which does keep the animals (or most of them) in, no matter the pressure?

I’d suggest that fences only become relevant when they are an integral or important part of your hunting experience. If you can lose a wounded animal in a fenced area, it’s pretty wild by my definition (a hunter I know lost a wounded buffalo on a South African property, even after getting a helicopter and a couple of other teams on the ground to look for it). If the animals are born, live and die on the property in a natural manner, it’s pretty wild. If it’s a large fenced area but the game is put there for you (or someone else) to shoot, it’s not wild (‘put and take’ operations). If the animals in the area are specifically bred for whatever trait is desired, then it’s not wild. And example is an area with herds of sable, almost all male and all with horns of 45” or more. Or herds of buffalo bulls, with no cows or calves, and all with horns over 40”. That’s not natural, so it’s not wild.

So maybe, a good rule is to ask whether the area is “natural” in terms of how the ecosystem functions, and to use that as the goalpost for a wild area (recognizing that humans have interacted with ecosystems since time began, so what matters is degree)?

Either way, people should hunt in areas and in ways which they choose, and shouldn’t feel defensive about their choices. There isn’t a right or wrong answer to what’s the best area or way to hunt. I’ve enjoyed chasing one animal for 12 days in the jungle, and I’ve enjoyed culling dozens of animals on a South African farm.

Lastly, I see a complaint which rears its head in this forum from time to time. Some complain that wild places tend to be more expensive (which is likely true), and those who hunt “wild areas” are those who have more money than skill, and want to lord it over others. As has been said, those who hold this view may be the ones who have an issue with money. I have run into difficult hunters occupying just about the full range of economic brackets, and I can’t say I’ve ever noticed a relevant correlation between wealth and attitude towards hunting or other hunters.