Has your PH ever sent you out without him?

Does anyone know the exact wording on how it's defined? Direct control, under supervision, within sight, no more than 10ft away or what. Seems a like there must be definition.

This should lay it out clearly.

Eastern Cape Ordinance
53 A hunting contractor shall
(a) be able and equipped to provide and render the following facilities and services to his client:-
(i) the escorting services of a professional hunter

58 A professional hunter-
(c) shall at all times be present during the hunting of a wild animal by his client and shall supervise the hunting of such wild animal
 
I will report the next outfitter to Nature conservation that I hear is hunting illegally and I hope the next clients take notice. I find it totally mind boggling that some clients are trying to push the fact, people have said on this post how they have hunted illegally...................blows my mind!! We are here to protect our industry, not shame it. A few examples....shooting leopards at night when illegal in that country( the moon was high in the sky, on a report).......shooting female leopards(bragged about his hunt, but after female killed..silence).......Yes Africa is a small place, we hear the stories.

I have a passion for what I do.........getting sick of the bull!@#@ that is taking over our industry.

Thanks to @Leopards Valley Safaris for having the balls to also go against illegal hunting.

I'm taken aback by the tenor of your post. Illegal WHERE? The laws of RSA are not the same as the laws of every country in Africa. While there are many fine PHs in RSA, it is far and away the least demanding in qualifying PHs. 12 day course and little if any experience then viola ... PH license. Don't assume because you hunt with a licensed PH in RSA that somehow that person is an expert, or even knowledgeable. This is not intended to undermine the credibility and reputation of the many very fine PHs in RSA. Rather, it's simply a statement that holding a PH license in RSA is not indicative of much else, other than meeting a legal requirement, so do your homework as to true qualifications and experience. Likewise, calling something "illegal" universally is unfair and untrue, simply because it's not the law of the land in YOUR country.
 
Thanks Brickburn that certainly spells what is required in the EC.
 
It still amazes me that I can sit in a hide or stalk game with a camera but the moment I have a bow in my hand I need somebody to look after me.
 
Thanks Brickburn that certainly spells what is required in the EC.

The intent will be the same in all the provinces.

Mpumalanga
42. Hunting of wild animals or exotic animals by clients
(1) A client shall not hunt a wild animal or an exotic animal, unless-
(b) the client is escorted by a professional hunter.

KZN

6 A professsional hunter -
(a) shall at all times be present and supervise the hunting of game by his client,....

North West
Hunting of wild animals or exotic animals by clients
52. (1) A client shall not hunt a wild animal or an exotic animal,
unless-
(b) he is escorted by a professional hunter.

Western Cape
Hunting of wild animals or feral animals by client
72C. (1) A client shall not hunt a wild animal or a feral animal unless—
(b) the client is escorted by a professional hunter.

Gauteng

52 Hunting of wild animals or exotic animals by clients
(1) A client shall not hunt a wild animal or an exotic animal, unless-
(b) he or she is escorted by a professional hunter.

If I could read Afrikaans better I'd interpret the Free State, but alas.
 
The intent will be the same in all the provinces.

Mpumalanga
42. Hunting of wild animals or exotic animals by clients
(1) A client shall not hunt a wild animal or an exotic animal, unless-
(b) the client is escorted by a professional hunter.

KZN

6 A professsional hunter -
(a) shall at all times be present and supervise the hunting of game by his client,....

North West
Hunting of wild animals or exotic animals by clients
52. (1) A client shall not hunt a wild animal or an exotic animal,
unless-
(b) he is escorted by a professional hunter.

Western Cape
Hunting of wild animals or feral animals by client
72C. (1) A client shall not hunt a wild animal or a feral animal unless—
(b) the client is escorted by a professional hunter.

Gauteng

52 Hunting of wild animals or exotic animals by clients
(1) A client shall not hunt a wild animal or an exotic animal, unless-
(b) he or she is escorted by a professional hunter.

If I could read Afrikaans better I'd interpret the Free State, but alas.

This site is Africa Hunting, or Republic of South Africa Hunting? The law of RSA is NOT the law in all of Africa. Blanket, unqualified statements that hunting without a PH escort is "illegal," while true in RSA, is NOT universally true everywhere. Don't mislead readers into thinking a PH is a cure-all, or that being without a PH anywhere is "illegal." In Namibia, a hunting professional must be with you, and that can be a guide or master guide, both short of a PH. Please ... stop quoting RSA law as indicative of the continent as a whole. Similarly, educate readers about the "difficulties" in obtaining an RSA PH license, and how many African countries offer reciprocity with such a license. That would be equally if not more educational.
 
It still amazes me that I can sit in a hide or stalk game with a camera but the moment I have a bow in my hand I need somebody to look after me.

Changes your from a dumb ass tourist into a hunter.
Muppet tourists can do all kinds of dumb stuff.

hqdefault.jpg


elephant-car-scratch-2-2014-08-08.jpg


elephant-car-1353000927.jpg

"The elephant appeared to walk past the car but then turned back, pushing a tusk against the passenger door and rolling the car.
o_O No sh&t!

 
Similarly, educate readers about the "difficulties" in obtaining an RSA PH license, and how many African countries offer reciprocity with such a license.

That is interesting news. Which countries do offer that? It's progressive, in Canada you can't even go to another province with most professional licenses :rolleyes:
 
That is interesting news. Which countries do offer that? It's progressive, in Canada you can't even go to another province with most professional licenses :rolleyes:

Somebody can correct me if I'm wrong but I think it is same in SA, with a PH license required in each province. I think that's a large part of the reason you often see 2 PH on a DGS hunt. The booking one is often from a different province and not DGS licensed.

stop quoting RSA law as indicative of the continent as a whole

Interesting point. Where can you hunt in AFRICA without a PH or equivalent guide? Seems like there were self hunts in Cameroon or some such place? Point being, I do think having a licensed guide of some sort required for foreigners is fairly universal in Africa, not just SA.
 
It seems that only the Limpopo has wording that could be interpreted in more ways than one.
 
Please ... stop quoting RSA law as indicative of the continent as a whole.

Pedant! (That is you being called a name, by the way.)

I am under no illusions about the geography of the African continent, nor am I misleading anyone.


Don't mislead readers into thinking a PH is a cure-all, or that being without a PH anywhere is "illegal." .......

The RSA provinical laws are not indicative of a continent. However, they are most certainly indicative of the laws in destinations for the VAST MAJORITY of hunters who go to Africa. Namibia included. (You go look up the stats.)

If you want to hunt without a PH in any province in South Africa, you are quite free to do so. Buy a farm, put critters on it and hunt your butt off. No PH required.
The same in Namibia. (This is an excellent plan for a first time hunter on a budget, as you save a lot on day rates and trophy fees. This is only suggested for those who did not pass grade three arithmetic.)


.............unqualified statements that hunting without a PH escort is "illegal," while true in RSA, is NOT universally true everywhere.

A Master Guide may be short of a PH, (a technicality of the law). However he/she is licensed under the LAW in that country to guide "clients".
A "client" can not hunt on their own in Namibia nor can a client hunt on their own in: Benin, Burkina Faso, Congo Brazzaville, CAR, Cameroon, DRC, Zambia, Zimbabwe, Tanzania, Uganda, Mozambique, Madagascar, Mauritius, Malawi, Angola, Kenya.

....... and how many African countries offer reciprocity with such a license. That would be equally if not more educational.

Onward and upward for your edification. About reciprocal arrangements for PH licenses. There are few. Turf protection and trade restriction across international borders and indeed internal boundaries is rife.
  • In my understanding: Mozambique and Tanzania recognize RSA licensure.
  • Benin, Burkina Faso, Cameroon, CAR, Congo Brazzaville and Uganda are likely candidates for reciprocity. Certainly if you are hired by a local outfitter.
  • Namibia, Zimbabwe, Zambia, not bloody likely. Turf protection. Neither are the lauded Zim PH licenses recognized in RSA.
  • No where in North America or Europe will recognize any of them. Non Resident aliens can hunt on their own in very few places. I think Sweden might be free wheeling enough to allow it.
Similarly, educate readers about the "difficulties" in obtaining an RSA PH license, ........

Anyone thinking it is a breeze to pass the PH course in RSA, please do spend the two weeks and invest your time and energy. The majority do not pass. (If you really feel smart, do it in Afrikaans.) Of those that do pass, very few go on to finding a placement in the industry.
How many Outfitters trust their hard won clients to some wet ink certificate?



Do you wonder why the Zimbabwe has a different program? Do you think it restricts access to the industry? More qualified? Whatever. :rolleyes:
All those trackers that have never gone past grade three know more than the PH's ever will and there are plenty of good PH's that freely admit it.

:A Vomit:
 
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Somebody can correct me if I'm wrong but I think it is same in SA, with a PH license required in each province. I think that's a large part of the reason you often see 2 PH on a DGS hunt. The booking one is often from a different province and not DGS licensed.

Each province issues their own licenses. They are now moving away from an automatic reciprocal arrangement with other provinces.
Two PH's is typically about licensing. One is likely not DG qualified on their license to they require a DG qualified PH to be present. Not just extra-provincial issues.

Interesting point. Where can you hunt in AFRICA without a PH or equivalent guide? Seems like there were self hunts in Cameroon or some such place? .............

"Private" tribal land by invitation of the regent would be the example that you are thinking of. (Cam's hunts.) Very similar to many jurisdictions in Africa.
Get the Swazi King to invite you over for a hunt and you are set. No license, no PH required. :)
 
It seems that only the Limpopo has wording that could be interpreted in more ways than one.

I doubt it, when it comes down to the court house. There will be a very clear interpretation at some point.
 
But my only hunt in Africa, in Namibia at Barry Burchells, one of my fellow hunters was left without a ph, hunting on his own and shot a 1 curl kudu. Then the camp manager put a ranch hand with him to tell him size on animals
 
Pedant! (That is you being called a name, by the way.)
I just love it when I learn something new. Had to look that definition up. I will try to use that in a sentence this week at work. Thanks for teaching me something!
 
But my only hunt in Africa, in Namibia at Barry Burchells, one of my fellow hunters was left without a ph, hunting on his own and shot a 1 curl kudu. Then the camp manager put a ranch hand with him to tell him size on animals
Probably got to pay the trophy fee on a Nyala.......:whistle:..sorry, just couldn't let that one go. No disrespect to your fellow hunter, I am sure he regretted the decision.
 
He was proud of his kudu, didn't know it was juvenile until we told him. He was naive, didn't study african animals. Just saying burchell knew he was newbie and left him on his own
 

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