What's up with todays' gun shops?

As someone who works for a certain store with a giant fish as the logo. We get no say what firearms we get. Luckily I have good working relationships with some reps and I just drop subtle hints of what we need. But it truly is supply and demand. We have more people that would rather play Navy Seal in their basement then have wood guns. Especially high quality wood guns.
 
Those brass belt buckles do look classy but I'm not sure I would want them rubbing against the fancy wood and glossy blued metal of a fine $15K gun. I do greatly dislike velcro but must admit it does have utility for some applications.
There is a broad leather flap on the underside of the buckle which protects the rifle - just not visible in the pics .
 
This has been a very interesting thread to follow. I walk in and out of gun shops every day for a living (gun manufacturer sales rep) and I had to come terms a long time ago that the guns were getting less and less interesting every year that goes by. That being said, they are technological way better than most stuff from the past....but still less interesting.

It would be an interesting survey for this site to ask how many of us own individual guns worth over 10k, 15k, 20k, etc, and how many? Most on this site IMO would be considered far above average hunters and without a doubt we are all spending way more money toward this hobby than 90% of people that go hunting.

If I was a betting man and we did another survey that asked how many members on this site are under 35 years of age, the number would be super small. Then ask them what their most valuable gun would be in their collection, my guess is it's a 2k shotgun or 3500 bolt rifle (with scope), or a 4k Black Rifle. The only trend I see at the higher end for young folks is long range target "tactical" rifles. For some reason these young bucks are willing to go through the trouble of buying 5-8k heavy rifle in 6.5 or some super 30, spend another 2-3k on a scope and go through some "long range shooting course" engineered by some ex-military guy that probably just read a book about it last week, .......But he's an expert and knows how its done. Now that's not meant to be a shot at our military patriots, I have nothing but respect for folks that served, but let's not kid ourselves, 99% of these fellas were never, nor are they ever going to be the "American Sniper".

In a nutshell, there is more happening than most people realize in the gun industry. The management structure is getting younger and younger (lack experience) and are from outside our industry, and the local shops are just trying to survive. They have no choice but to sell what they can bring in and get rid of in a hurry, (for the worst margins of any industry I've worked in)....... or they go broke. The up-and-coming generation was raised on Call of Duty and the plethora of other military inspired games that highlight all the "tacti cool" stuff currently in the stores. Add to that their buying is inspired by the movie industry. How do I know this? Every time a new John Wick movie comes out, whichever HK pistol or Benelli shotgun he is using, we see a spike in sales after the movie release.

Times have changed my Africa Hunting friends, and they are continuing to change. It's becoming more and more difficult and expensive to do these things we love. The incredible level of complication to even get in your truck, drive somewhere out west and go hunting in our own country "the country with the most freedoms" illustrates the future of our sport........but that's probably a topic for a whole new thread....
I’m 26, my two most expensive guns were pretty much the same price. One is an absolutely lovely 270 on pre war Model 70, the other is a pre ban HK-91.
 
There is a broad leather flap on the underside of the buckle which protects the rifle - just not visible in the pics .
After my post I thought about it and presumed Rigby must have added a protective flap under the buckle. It's too easy a solution for them to have overlooked. I am about to start on a travel case (that won't actually travel) for my 404J. I still have most of a sheet of 1/2" cherry veneer plywood and some dimension lumber left over from making this case for a Citori I bought a couple years ago.
Citori case 1.JPG
Citori case 2.JPG

If enough wood is left over I'll make a matching second range box.
Ammo Box Montage.jpg

Thanks for posting your photos I will use them as a guide for making my 404's case. It won't have the Rigby name on it but perhaps some day my name will be more famous ... in my grandson's mind anyway.

Are the cases lined with felt?
 
33 here most exy firearm bought was $2k bolt gun, your age demographic guess (3rd paragraph) was pretty correct so far. Anyone else this bracket wanna chime in? I’m curious too.
I'm 35 and none of my friends and hunting companions like nice guns. They all want black plastic stocks and big chunky scopes. I only have one friend who likes wood on his guns and he is perfectly happy with Remington and Ruger stuff. I had to explain what a CZ was. Terms like Blaser or Rigby mean nothing to them.
 
Been following this thread and have to give my input which is going to be counter to many of the "classic" gun lovers out there. Like many of you I too do not like the AR guns. Own a couple of them and they are fun range guns but that is about it for their usefulness. I much prefer an accurate bolt gun. Being a left handed shooter and not wealthy I can't go for the expensive guns that I see displayed on this site. Can't see spending $10K on a gun. I would rather spend that on the hunt. I also just dislike many of the features of the classic guns. Wooden stocks, crap. Give me a good fitting and durable composite stock with a good neutral color to it. I am 6'6" and have a 15" LOP. I have never seen a wooden stock that fit me and getting one made would be the same price and buying a new rifle. Blueing, very pretty but not practical. Take all the metal and get it cerekoted which is a much better finish. Also, any gun that does not have a detachable box magazine is not worth carrying. They are safer to use, faster to reload/unload and feed just fine in a bolt gun with CRF. Plan on doing this on DGR when I purchase it in the next year. 375 Ruger will work in 338 WM magazines.

All that being said, I do love the look of the classic guns. They are beautiful and the workmanship that went into making them is something to be appreciated. Even if I owned one, I wouldn't hunt with it. Why risk damaging something so beautiful and valuable while hunting. Most of my hunting in the past was in the mountains of Utah and Washington. Durable and weatherproof were just as important in the firearms list of features as was accuracy and reliability.
My 2 cents.
 
From an old guy (75 this month) that's done a mix of the gun games starting with skeet and IMSHA (pistol silhouette) in the '70s through action pistol and 3-gun tactical in the 80s thru the mid 20-teens:

The AR15 and similar is the easiest firearm with which to become proficient with, and more importantly the easiest to maintain proficiently, that ever existed.

How do I know? As I've aged and no longer compete, I still go out and run some of the same pistol and rifle drills from when I competed in the IPSC and 3-gun matches.

My pistol times have gone up by at least 50% (sub 8 seconds to ~ 11 or 12) for a standard El Presidente. And these days I cheat by not doing the 180* turn.

But with the AR or similar gas or piston rifles, be it 5.56/223 or 7.62/308, the times are holding so even it's magical. For home defense, I don't think a properly set up AR15 can be beat. Especially as one's reflexes and eyesight go through the aging process.

And why are black rifles so popular? The initial desire to own one still applies and originated with Billy Bob Clinton's AW ban in 1994.

But I still appreciate my other rifles equally well, if not more so :)
you are so correct about Clinton being the greatest black rifle salesman the country has ever seen. In the early 80s, you’d see some big ads for black rifles in Soldier of Fortune but it wasn’t until the ban that that type of rifle became mainstream. And the ban unleashed firearms creativity that continues to this day, starting with the Colt Sporter: they milled off the bayonet lug and changed the name and all of a sudden it’s no longer dangerous in the eyes of the law .
 
Black rifles are definitely fun to shoot and great tools for teaching marksmanship.
Not sure I agree with this. I was a range safety officer for a few years and what I experienced was Black guns taught people to shoot fast not accurately. Especially the younger people. Trying them to slow down and concentrate on hitting the same hole was impossible. Instead, they wanted to see how many times they could hit the 10 ring on a man sized target at 50 years in under a minute. Compare that to the hunters shooting at 200 yards getting 3 shots off in ten minutes while trying to keep barrel temp the same to fine tune their skills and the guns sighting. Big difference.
 
After my post I thought about it and presumed Rigby must have added a protective flap under the buckle. It's too easy a solution for them to have overlooked. I am about to start on a travel case (that won't actually travel) for my 404J. I still have most of a sheet of 1/2" cherry veneer plywood and some dimension lumber left over from making this case for a Citori I bought a couple years ago.
View attachment 611953View attachment 611952
If enough wood is left over I'll make a matching second range box.
View attachment 611954
Thanks for posting your photos I will use them as a guide for making my 404's case. It won't have the Rigby name on it but perhaps some day my name will be more famous ... in my grandson's mind anyway.

Are the cases lined with felt?
1/2 inch and it will be heavy before the gun ever gets in it! Better have a stout handle. I'm amazed how thin the wood actually is on fancy gun cases. (BTW, I am speaking from experience--the case I made is freaking heavy)
 
Now days M98 Mauser receivers are harder to find, junker rifles are north of 400.00, stocks worth a hoot are 300.00 plus, barrels are north of $200.00, triggers are $150.00 plus, what you used to throw together for $500.00 is now over $1200.00 once you start drilling holes for scope mounts, bending bolt handles, if you get rid of the flag safety add another $100. For a commercial shroud, and that’s if you do all the smith work yourself. For that price you can buy two kick around AR platform rifles, fun to shoot they sure are but just not the same as a well built Mauser. Just reminiscing I suppose…..

Been following this thread and have to give my input which is going to be counter to many of the "classic" gun lovers out there. Like many of you I too do not like the AR guns. Own a couple of them and they are fun range guns but that is about it for their usefulness. I much prefer an accurate bolt gun. Being a left handed shooter and not wealthy I can't go for the expensive guns that I see displayed on this site. Can't see spending $10K on a gun. I would rather spend that on the hunt. I also just dislike many of the features of the classic guns. Wooden stocks, crap. Give me a good fitting and durable composite stock with a good neutral color to it. I am 6'6" and have a 15" LOP. I have never seen a wooden stock that fit me and getting one made would be the same price and buying a new rifle. Blueing, very pretty but not practical. Take all the metal and get it cerekoted which is a much better finish. Also, any gun that does not have a detachable box magazine is not worth carrying. They are safer to use, faster to reload/unload and feed just fine in a bolt gun with CRF. Plan on doing this on DGR when I purchase it in the next year. 375 Ruger will work in 338 WM magazines.

All that being said, I do love the look of the classic guns. They are beautiful and the workmanship that went into making them is something to be appreciated. Even if I owned one, I wouldn't hunt with it. Why risk damaging something so beautiful and valuable while hunting. Most of my hunting in the past was in the mountains of Utah and Washington. Durable and weatherproof were just as important in the firearms list of features as was accuracy and reliability.
My 2 cents.
Not sure why you would think that a detachable magazine would be better than a hinged floor plate on a bolt action hunting rifle. It certainly isn't any safer and I have heard the stories of loose magazines falling out and lost. I had one fall out, I saw it and picked it up, catastrophe avoided, but it could have been a problem.

Most of my hunting rifles are walnut and blued steel. They just look and feel better. After I moved to Western Washington I realized that constant wet was not doing my nice rifles any good. Even I had to buy a Remington Model 7 in 7-08 stainless and synthetic. It worked well one rainy day and a blacktail buck went down. I still carry it in rainy weather. I also take it to Eastern Washington as a back-up just in case. The only problem is "plastic" guns just don't have a soul. I might see it different if I had grown up in the "Great North Wet."
 
Not sure why you would think that a detachable magazine would be better than a hinged floor plate on a bolt action hunting rifle. It certainly isn't any safer and I have heard the stories of loose magazines falling out and lost. I had one fall out, I saw it and picked it up, catastrophe avoided, but it could have been a problem.

Most of my hunting rifles are walnut and blued steel. They just look and feel better. After I moved to Western Washington I realized that constant wet was not doing my nice rifles any good. Even I had to buy a Remington Model 7 in 7-08 stainless and synthetic. It worked well one rainy day and a blacktail buck went down. I still carry it in rainy weather. I also take it to Eastern Washington as a back-up just in case. The only problem is "plastic" guns just don't have a soul. I might see it different if I had grown up in the "Great North Wet."
Not sure why you quoted me about the detachable magazines, I don’t like them and don’t build around them.
 
Not sure I agree with this. I was a range safety officer for a few years and what I experienced was Black guns taught people to shoot fast not accurately. Especially the younger people. Trying them to slow down and concentrate on hitting the same hole was impossible. Instead, they wanted to see how many times they could hit the 10 ring on a man sized target at 50 years in under a minute. Compare that to the hunters shooting at 200 yards getting 3 shots off in ten minutes while trying to keep barrel temp the same to fine tune their skills and the guns sighting. Big difference.
That’s an example of a loose not behind the trigger. Any coach can stop that in a heart beat. As far as using them as a marksmanship training tool they are light weight, low recoil, well balanced and the sights are easily manipulated.
 
Even the guns you guys say aren't that expensive are expensive in my world....
Agreed. Last 2 guns I bought were a marlin 1895cb ($1100) and a winchester 94bb ($1250). Before that was a Howa .30-06 ($900 with a bipod and scope brand new). Before that a $300 .22. And before that there was a 5 year gap when I couldn’t afford anything at all.
 
I'm 35 and none of my friends and hunting companions like nice guns. They all want black plastic stocks and big chunky scopes. I only have one friend who likes wood on his guns and he is perfectly happy with Remington and Ruger stuff. I had to explain what a CZ was. Terms like Blaser or Rigby mean nothing to them.
Ask some of your friends what a CRF action is? If they’re like mine they won’t have a clue. LOL
 
i
After my post I thought about it and presumed Rigby must have added a protective flap under the buckle. It's too easy a solution for them to have overlooked. I am about to start on a travel case (that won't actually travel) for my 404J. I still have most of a sheet of 1/2" cherry veneer plywood and some dimension lumber left over from making this case for a Citori I bought a couple years ago.
View attachment 611953View attachment 611952
If enough wood is left over I'll make a matching second range box.
View attachment 611954
Thanks for posting your photos I will use them as a guide for making my 404's case. It won't have the Rigby name on it but perhaps some day my name will be more famous ... in my grandson's mind anyway.

Are the cases lined with felt?
That wooden gun case for your Citori is magnificent . A real testament to your skills. The Rigby Americase of mine is lined with a material like felt . The “Big Game” leather case is not made by Rigby but sold by the Rigby distributor for 10% of what Rigby want for their own case . It is not as good as the proper case but not bad at all . It is felt lined . I baulk at paying A$7000 for a rifle case !
 
That’s an example of a loose not behind the trigger. Any coach can stop that in a heart beat. As far as using them as a marksmanship training tool they are light weight, low recoil, well balanced and the sights are easily manipulated.
To those points I will concede as long as someone is teaching them this way.
 

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Grz63 wrote on Werty's profile.
(cont'd)
Rockies museum,
CM Russel museum and lewis and Clark interpretative center
Horseback riding in Summer star ranch
Charlo bison range and Garnet ghost town
Flathead lake, road to the sun and hiking in Glacier NP
and back to SLC (via Ogden and Logan)
Grz63 wrote on Werty's profile.
Good Morning,
I plan to visit MT next Sept.
May I ask you to give me your comments; do I forget something ? are my choices worthy ? Thank you in advance
Philippe (France)

Start in Billings, Then visit little big horn battlefield,
MT grizzly encounter,
a hot springs (do you have good spots ?)
Looking to buy a 375 H&H or .416 Rem Mag if anyone has anything they want to let go of
Erling Søvik wrote on dankykang's profile.
Nice Z, 1975 ?
Tintin wrote on JNevada's profile.
Hi Jay,

Hope you're well.

I'm headed your way in January.

Attending SHOT Show has been a long time bucket list item for me.

Finally made it happen and I'm headed to Vegas.

I know you're some distance from Vegas - but would be keen to catch up if it works out.

Have a good one.

Mark
 
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