What is an adequate back-up rifle for a Professional Hunter..?

[siml]

Bossie, what about 2 penetrating slugs in the shotgun?

 

[slad68]

I agree there.
But then and please correct me in a humbled way if I am wrong.

It's not SHOT anymore but rather a SLUG.
Believe it or not I backed a Lion with slugs.

 

[KWALATA SAFARIS]

If I shoot the slug I might as well pump it with a 550 gr woodleigh's soft, but I get your line of thought Simon.

Or a 700gr woodleigh from the 550 magnum!

By the way spoke to Neal from CZ USA today and we are setting up import and paperwork for my 550 magnum.

Ooooo the wife is not happy!

 

[Pheroze]

Question from the peanut gallery (hope this does not hijack the thread) : for a professional hunter is a .375 as much a charge stopper as any cartridge, its just the large bores have more room or error?

 

[siml]

@Pheroze , 375 is definitely enough gun to stop an elephant charging. I have seen a side brain shot with 500NE, not hit the brain, the elephant didn't even flinch, turn and came straight for us, next shot was frontal brain, dropped on the spot. On a brain shot on elephant, it's accuracy that counts, not size of bullet.

@Jaco Strauss , the reason for shotgun/slug, I can pull those two shots off in an instant.

 

[slad68]

Pheroze it's a good and valid question.
I would say, Yes it is because me and my client both used 375,s to stop a charging Elephant cow. His shot went off first and the Elephant immediately went down. I followed as she was about to hit the ground, it actually had no need to shoot.

You are 100% correct to say the larger calibers has more room for error.

I personnaly would not back down with a 375 in my hands.

 

[KWALATA SAFARIS]

@Pheroze , 375 is definitely enough gun to stop an elephant charging. I have seen a side brain shot with 500NE, not hit the brain, the elephant didn't even flinch, turn and came straight for us, next shot was frontal brain, dropped on the spot. On a brain shot on elephant, it's accuracy that counts, not size of bullet.

@Jaco Strauss , the reason for shotgun/slug, I can pull those two shots off in an instant.

@TMS simon I get your line of thought but to acquire a double shotgun purely for cats is a waste IMO, that's just me.

The thing with rifle pushing 6000 ft/lbs and enlarged frontal bullet diameter is impact and what we refer to as Knock down.

I love a 375 but it can not compare in terms of "knock down" to the larger calibers and for this very reason it's not a stopper, it can stop a charge but it's not ideal.

On cats it's all about the bigger the hole the harder the impact the quicker it's down, I have had several lion hit square with a 375 and it still comes with momentum, I have not experienced this with a true big bore, pushing in excess of or around 5500 to 8000 ft/lbs and enlarged frontal bullet diameter.

Stoppers are less about penetration and more about momentum IMO, and in my personal experience and as African DG ph's, we are and will be hard pressed to beat the true big bores.

If I recall correctly there is revision on the old math that calculated knock down I believe Craig Bodington was quite instrumental in this...

Hey we are going to look long and hard to beat 375 and 416 penetration but that's not what we are discussing.

Big bores are things that one teaches one self to shoot you do t just pick up a 470, 500, 460 or a 600 and shoot well with it.
You need to learn how to handle it, ride the recoil, re aquire target...... this is what made the old TG18 (large caliber rifle handling in Dagerous game areas module exercises) so good you got to drill scenarios with your big bore or bores, jams, short strokes, mag reloads, speed testing, running targets....

Because if we have to be honest as a professional it needs to be the rifle you handle and shoot the best in your arsenal.

My best always

 

[siml]

We always have double shotgun in camp, how else we gonna get bush chickens?????

 

[Foxi]

Jaco,
can you translate for me IMO Momentum ,please
Thanks
Foxi

 

[KWALATA SAFARIS]

In my opinion

 

[spike.t]

404 Jeffery

@DOC-404 was wondering where that post was going to be as i was reading through them.

 

[spike.t]

If I shoot the slug I might as well pump it with a 550 gr woodleigh's soft, but I get your line of thought Simon.

Or a 700gr woodleigh from the 550 magnum!

By the way spoke to Neal from CZ USA today and we are setting up import and paperwork for my 550 magnum.

Ooooo the wife is not happy!

jaco how long will it take to get to you? and what you buying the madam to keep your nose above the kak, so you get back to your usual chin just above it?

 

[KWALATA SAFARIS]

aaahhhh spike she'll be in Vegas with us this year....
In all actuality a pretty good deal for me still!

Neal reckons around three months and then we start with the importing on this side...

 

[spike.t]

is yours going to be the same as the .550 mag they had on the cz stand at sci this year? as i did quite like it............and i hope you meant she is going to be there next year......

fk we back off there to vegas in the morning for my brothers 50th bday ........jeez twice in one year..........

 

[Pheroze]

Great discussion, thanks!

 

[KWALATA SAFARIS]

Pretty much I changed it a bit, golden trigger, this and that but it'll be one you like!

Lindie will be there! But sure you and I will be able to keep her in line or away from gambling!

 

[spike.t]

Pretty much I changed it a bit, golden trigger, this and that but it'll be one you like!

Lindie will be there! But sure you and I will be able to keep her in line or away from gambling!

you sure..........her and PR on the loose together .......now they would require a serious charge stopper...wheres that Trex thread!!!!

 

[KWALATA SAFARIS]

you sure..........her and PR on the loose together .......now they would require a serious charge stopper...wheres that Trex thread!!!!

O sh*t thanks for that now I'm not that sure!....

 

[CAustin]

Foxi I like your elephant very much. Can you tell me please the weight of the animals tusks? Thank you in advance.

 

[Foxi]

Foxi I like your elephant very much. Can you tell me please the weight of the animals tusks? Thank you in advance.

No problem Sir.
the first : 60 pound (almost)
second : 30 pounds
Both shot in Gwai River .150km easterly from Vic Falls.
I didn't shot the elephants,my PH send me sometimes a picture from his results and I send him mine (the small ones ,from the German peanut gallery (one of the new words I've learned in this thread)
The communication is really good to Zimb.Much better as to Zambia.

Bye
Foxi