Tipping Guide

[Hank2211]

Hank,

Though I do my best to hide it I'm actually pretty well heeled in the loot department, and should I wish I could take extended hunts that few could do.

We have over 40 thousand members at this site, but last year less than 18'000 people world wide traveled to Africa to hunt.

Many people here may never in their lifetime ever have enough loot saved up to ever make it there to hunt, but to add injury to that when we have members who pile on what they believe is an obligation for everyone to tip gets on my nerves a bit.

Many a guy here is excited that he finally got himself a big boy caliber finally and someone will put the sharp stick in his eye that his boomer Remington isn't up to the task which i believe has caused some guys to never post here again which is sad as I do enjoy reports of their evolutions.

Anyway....read into it as you see fit.....

I would hope that no one on this site ever behaves in such a way as to put people off hunting Africa . . . although I acknowledge that hope is rarely a good strategy. Equally, I don't see why anyone should be put off by opinions expressed here. Everyone has (and is entitled to) their own opinions, some more informed than others, some more forcefully expressed than others, but neither necessarily right (or wrong) because of that . . . . Most members have experience with social media . . . I'm not a young man anymore, but I certainly take social media that way . . .

Now, about that Remington . . .

 

[Bushpig4Ever]

"I would like to point out however than if your P.H. is also the owner of the hunting outfit, you still need to give him a tip as you would with any other P.H., based upon your overall satisfaction no more, no less."

Above is nonsense. If you go to a shop or a car dealer, do you tell the owner he may add another 5% to the bill because he was friendly and gave good advice? Well, you might do it if you don't know what else to do with your money. Many hunters get nervous when it comes to the end of the hunt because often tipping crosses their mind. Tipping should be abolished altogether.

If the ph or tracker saves you from being killed by a buffalo, by all means give him a reward but that the entire staff should get a tip is ridiculous. What for? Give him/her money for doing the job? The hunting client isn't responsible for the staff's wages. Tipping got out of hand. It's quite understandable that less hunters go hunting in Africa.

 

[Hank2211]

"I would like to point out however than if your P.H. is also the owner of the hunting outfit, you still need to give him a tip as you would with any other P.H., based upon your overall satisfaction no more, no less."

Above is nonsense. If you go to a shop or a car dealer, do you tell the owner he may add another 5% to the bill because he was friendly and gave good advice? Well, you might do it if you don't know what else to do with your money. Many hunters get nervous when it comes to the end of the hunt because often tipping crosses their mind. Tipping should be abolished altogether.

If the ph or tracker saves you from being killed by a buffalo, by all means give him a reward but that the entire staff should get a tip is ridiculous. What for? Give him/her money for doing the job? The hunting client isn't responsible for the staff's wages. Tipping got out of hand. It's quite understandable that less hunters go hunting in Africa.

Can someone please enlighten me? Why does this thread continually generate so many seemingly irate posts?

It's pretty simple, at least as I see it. Everyone - or virtually everyone - seems to agree that tipping is up to the individual. You are not required to tip. Can that be said enough times?

But most people who post here do want to tip, and are asking for guidance about who to tip, when to tip and how much to tip. Others then post their practices, experiences or views. It's these posts which seem to get some of the "no tipping" or "less tipping" commentariat into a lather, or provokes them to consider defenestration as a barely suitable punishment for those who dare to post their views regarding appropriate tipping etiquette.

An example might be, if I can use your post as an example @Bushpig4Ever, to say that "I disagree with the above" rather than "Above is nonsense." And "Tipping should be abolished altogether"? Is that in Africa or the world generally? In either case, I think your suggestion is less than helpful to those seeking guidance. But if expressed as your view, you are, of course, fully entitled to it.

Maybe I should take my own advice . . . serenity now . . .

 

[Von S.]

Hank,

I explained how tipping of the natives came about in Africa, but that was then and this is now.

Some outfitters are now leaving out of the " what's not included" section tips and gratuities.

As a paying customer the 18,000 paying customers world wide who went to Africa last year hunting already paid their outfitters payroll, but yet many feel that the hunter should pay even more.

Ok! If that's the way one feels.....fine! Let them pay double......triple if they feel like it. Hell....I don't care if they adopt them all and start an Angela Jolet tribe of their own.

I used to go to Venezuela every year to fish. Big money was wanted for the boat and big money was wanted for the mates....all of who had been Americanized by some " big-a-shot,," who showed them that dummies have money and should throw it away.

After giving it some thought I realized that on one trip the mates were getting the pay that a factory worker made in a whole yeear in a day.

I rented a fisherman with a big panda for a day for $5 us, a .98 cent case of beer, a .46 cent bottle of native tooth melter and ,10 gallons of 15 cent a gallon gasoline and he .got to keep all the fish.

When I was leaving and gave him a nice watch from Sams Club he was genuinely sad and now that he was the richest man in the village.....a damned great ful one as well.

I really don't care what anyone gives as a tip.

 

[Michael Dean]

I believe that tipping has become an emotional issue in Africa for several reasons. First and foremost tipping has become the norm, it's expected, and not only is it expected just about anyone and everyone believes that they are entitled to a tip. More so, they have preconceived notions as to how much of a tip they are entitled to.

Your Professional Hunter, your PH is first in line. He commands the highest tip. Weather he saves your life from a buffalo attack or just manages to find you representative species to take home, he is first in line. He can command anywhere from 50 to 200 dollars a day. Then you have your tracker, he's the one who manages to find the Eland that was not properly shot and saves you the price of the animal. Then you have your skinner who expects to be paid a handsome tip whether he skins a dozen animals or none at all. Then you have your driver who's job it is to drive you wherever you PH deems appropriate.

In addition to these key people you have your cook and camp staff which can be as many as a dozen individuals who clean your cloths, build your fires and make your bed. Everyone of these people expect to be tipped, even the young lad in charge of fetching wood for the fire. While people claim you don't have to tip, you don't want to be responsible for telling everyone that your hunter has declined to tip.

The average for tipping is somewhere around 10% of the cost of the hunt with some operators suggesting to their clients to tip as much as 20%. How can they claim tipping is not expected when operators actually suggest what is proper?

Europeans are not expected to tip as much as Americans. Somewhere along the line American hunters established a president and we now live with it. Americans are expected to tip more.

At the end of the day, we have to accept that we are in their country and expected to follow their customs. This October I will hunt plains game for ten days. I already broached the topic with my operator and been given "suggestions" as to what I should consider acceptable tips for my hunt. I've already established a sum that I will take with me to cover tips. From my perspective it's simply not worth losing sleep over what essentially is an added expense. Unless the trip turns out to be a tragic disappointment I will tip in accordance with what was suggested to me.

I chose to hunt Africa, I will follow their customs and norms. It's supposed to be a trip of a lifetime. I'm not going to allow the custom of tipping to detract from it.

 

[mark-hunter]

Fact: the tipping is part of "planned budget".

I ask the outfitter to confirm what are expected overall expenses, and how much is expected to tip.

If I think that overall expenses (with tipping included) are too much for my budget, I move on to next offers, or other possibilities. Very simple.

The problem may occur if hunter is not fully familiar with local ways, and gets in situation to tip, and is short of budget. This is situation to be avoided. For the first time hunter, in my view it is responsibiliy of outfitter or the agent, to make clear of this point.

 

[Foxi]

I chose to hunt Africa, I will follow their customs and norms. It's supposed to be a trip of a lifetime. I'm not going to allow the custom of tipping to detract from it.

The culture of tip- proliferation is not a custom.
The guests are often misused to improve the poor wages of the camp helpers.

 

[Michael Dean]

The culture of tip- proliferation is not a custom.
The guests are often misused to improve the poor wages of the camp helpers.

Wrong; look up the word "custom' and you'll find that tipping fits the very definition of the term custom.

 

[Foxi]

I believe that tipping has become an emotional issue in Africa for several reasons. First and foremost tipping has become the norm, it's expected, and not only is it expected just about anyone and everyone believes that they are entitled to a tip. More so, they have preconceived notions as to how much of a tip they are entitled to.

Your Professional Hunter, your PH is first in line. He commands the highest tip. Weather he saves your life from a buffalo attack or just manages to find you representative species to take home, he is first in line. He can command anywhere from 50 to 200 dollars a day. Then you have your tracker, he's the one who manages to find the Eland that was not properly shot and saves you the price of the animal. Then you have your skinner who expects to be paid a handsome tip whether he skins a dozen animals or none at all. Then you have your driver who's job it is to drive you wherever you PH deems appropriate.

In addition to these key people you have your cook and camp staff which can be as many as a dozen individuals who clean your cloths, build your fires and make your bed. Everyone of these people expect to be tipped, even the young lad in charge of fetching wood for the fire. While people claim you don't have to tip, you don't want to be responsible for telling everyone that your hunter has declined to tip.

The average for tipping is somewhere around 10% of the cost of the hunt with some operators suggesting to their clients to tip as much as 20%. How can they claim tipping is not expected when operators actually suggest what is proper?

Europeans are not expected to tip as much as Americans. Somewhere along the line American hunters established a president and we now live with it. Americans are expected to tip more.

At the end of the day, we have to accept that we are in their country and expected to follow their customs. This October I will hunt plains game for ten days. I already broached the topic with my operator and been given "suggestions" as to what I should consider acceptable tips for my hunt. I've already established a sum that I will take with me to cover tips. From my perspective it's simply not worth losing sleep over what essentially is an added expense. Unless the trip turns out to be a tragic disappointment I will tip in accordance with what was suggested to me.

I chose to hunt Africa, I will follow their customs and norms. It's supposed to be a trip of a lifetime. I'm not going to allow the custom of tipping to detract from it.

If you are unlucky enough to have a PH which is guiding megamultimillionaires, he will you quickly smear on the bread "what is usual here." Sometimes much more than the operator recommended.

I noticed very fast that the recommendations of the operator are mainly based on the fact, that he pays his people badly to very badly. Many get only costs and logis.......................a shame.
A professional hunter has nothing to ask and command for, after all I pay daily costs of USD 1.000.- upwards. Yes, I know how much of it he only gets and also how much he has to do for me.
But if he doesn't like it, he should sell vacuum cleaners.

It's not about denying recognition, it's about often audacious demands.
If you go on safari more often, you will know what I mean.

Everyone has to give his best in the job, it won't be any different for you, than it will be for me.

 

[Michael Dean]

Traveling to Zimbabwe in a few months for a 12 day adventure.:happywave:

My sister and i will have a camp crew of 7...5 men & 2 women...plus the PH.

We are in the process of putting our..tip and a gift packages together...some of you will feel that this is over kill so save your thoughts and comments for your wife or self.

Here is what i am taking for the gifts bags for the 7 camp staff and trackers, skinners workers:
1. Tooth brush and paste.
2. Bar Soap
3. hand cream for the women
4. hair shampoo for the women
5. Candy & gum bag.
6. T-shirts - With a couple of extras
7. caps for the men
8. Knives for the men with the skinner getting 2.
9. flip-flops
10. 2 pair of Socks for the men
11. fingerless gloves for the 2 trackers.
Plus a couple of extra t-shirts and caps. for good job or saving the days.

Personal thank you cards will be made for each member and we will have a $___.__ inside. basic $10.00 a day per person up or down based on performance.

PH
1. 2 lb of coffee
2. 2 T-Shirts
3. Custom Skinning knife
4. Bottle of Spirits
Plus i will usually leave 2 to 3 pair of smart wool socks that i purchased prior to the trip.

Our daily snacks package: :rockon:
Hunting day snacks.
1. Jerky - beef and salmon
2. Beef honey nuggets (yum-yum)
3. Red & Green Chili jerky (oh yea)
4. assorted candy bars
5. Assorted Gum

Have i missed anything.:think:

To suggest that readers hear should not comment on your post is ignorant at best. You "List" of gifts is ludicris at best. You have no idea what treatment your going to recieve and to put together an extravagent list of goods transcends foolish. Foolish as well for you to expect people not to comment.

 

[Von S.]

To suggest that readers hear should not comment on your post is ignorant at best. You "List" of gifts is ludicris at best. You have no idea what treatment your going to recieve and to put together an extravagent list of goods transcends foolish. Foolish as well for you to expect people not to comment.

Oh Boy!

I couldn't agree with you more Mike.

 

[sierraone]

Oh Boy!

I couldn't agree with you more Mike.

You guys do realize you are arguing with a 7 year old post?

 

[Michael Dean]

You guys do realize you are arguing with a 7 year old post?

You are correct sir, arguing with a 7 year old post is in simple terms, foolish at best. That being said, after reading the post I simply couldn't help myself. Of all the posts in this 31 page article, her post without question was one of the most idiotic nonsensical posts I've ever read. She recognized the level of her own lunacy by prefacing her comments by instructing other readers not to comment on her post. The simple number of items she packed to travel with half way around the world with to give as gifts to people she doesn't even know transcends lunacy. I couldn't help myself, I had to comment.

 

[TXhunter65]

You are correct sir, arguing with a 7 year old post is in simple terms, foolish at best. That being said, after reading the post I simply couldn't help myself. Of all the posts in this 31 page article, her post without question was one of the most idiotic nonsensical posts I've ever read. She recognized the level of her own lunacy by prefacing her comments by instructing other readers not to comment on her post. The simple number of items she packed to travel with half way around the world with to give as gifts to people she doesn't even know transcends lunacy. I couldn't help myself, I had to comment.

Is James a girl?

 

[TTundra]

You are correct sir, arguing with a 7 year old post is in simple terms, foolish at best. That being said, after reading the post I simply couldn't help myself. Of all the posts in this 31 page article, her post without question was one of the most idiotic nonsensical posts I've ever read. She recognized the level of her own lunacy by prefacing her comments by instructing other readers not to comment on her post. The simple number of items she packed to travel with half way around the world with to give as gifts to people she doesn't even know transcends lunacy. I couldn't help myself, I had to comment.

Michael, have you been to Africa yet for a hunt? If not, chastising someone for their choice of gratuities or gifts is foolish in its own sense.

I have gifted the trackers and drivers, other staff, etc that I have used on my hunts: T-shirts, candy, knives, Cigarettes, etc (as well as shirts for their children if they have some). All of which I brought specifically for them and not used on the hunt and just left. I did so because I learned from my first trip what they used often and liked to see and gave that thought on preparing for my second trip. Go figure, my PH emails me regularly and still expresses how thankful his staff is for these gifts. Bet they will remember that when I'm back next year for my 3rd hunt with them....

Asking to not receive comments is ignorant on James' part, as comments on forums are the nature of the game. Your assumption on what is appropriate or not for a gratuity for a hunt you have not taken can also be considered ignorant, and quite frankly, lunacy in itself.

 

[Von S.]

Hahahaha...

What I found amusing was the comment about telling the population of this chat site to keep any comments than are different than the posters who made up the long drawn out list of things to give away to either not post them or tell them to their wives, but just don't post them here.

To that person I must chuckle at them as I always thought that this was a comment driven community.

Personally.......I couldn't give a fat baby's ass what anyone gives as a tip or doesn't give.

 

[TTundra]

@Von S. This is indeed not a forum to think you wont get a comment back let alone one by someone who has more experience....there's always a bigger fish.

 

[Michael Dean]

Michael, have you been to Africa yet for a hunt? If not, chastising someone for their choice of gratuities or gifts is foolish in its own sense.

I have gifted the trackers and drivers, other staff, etc that I have used on my hunts: T-shirts, candy, knives, Cigarettes, etc (as well as shirts for their children if they have some). All of which I brought specifically for them and not used on the hunt and just left. I did so because I learned from my first trip what they used often and liked to see and gave that thought on preparing for my second trip. Go figure, my PH emails me regularly and still expresses how thankful his staff is for these gifts. Bet they will remember that when I'm back next year for my 3rd hunt with them....

Asking to not receive comments is ignorant on James' part, as comments on forums are the nature of the game. Your assumption on what is appropriate or not for a gratuity for a hunt you have not taken can also be considered ignorant, and quite frankly, lunacy in itself.

I gues our PH's have a completely different viewpoint when it comes to gift giving. When I go back in October for ten days the only gift I will bring my PH is a bottle of single malt scotch. THe so-called gifts you describe that your PH appreciates was quantified by my PH as trinkets and crap. He's tired of putting on a fake smile accepting tea shirts candy and cheap knives, his words not mine. He made mention that he's in business to make money and as he put it, trinkets are the last thing he needs.

You can continue to provide your PH with assorted trinkets and I'll continue to bring good scotch and a generous cash tip. Given the option I can promise you that the majority of PH's would prefer cash over trinkets. THe majority of commenters thought James' gift giving to be over the top and foolish. If you want to play Santa Claus so be it; I'll continue to compensate my PH as I have, good luck with your tea shirts.

 

[Bushpig4Ever]

If I pay US$ 1,400 a day plus trophy fees then I‘m expecting all involved to deliver a good job. A tracker carrying my rucksack the entire day will get a reward, also a pretty maid if she is good to me during the night. Why should I fork out additional money to people just doing their job? By the way the client is in no way responsible for the wages of other peoples employees.

 

[JimP]

Most PH's, trackers, spotters, packers, kitchen help, and so forth already have most of what they need. Yes some T shirts, candy, or other trinkets will be appreciated but those things should not be considered the "tip". They work hard to make your hunt a successful and fun adventure so why not give them some cash to show them your appreciation? Then if they want a new knife, binoculars, T shirt, or whatever they can go and purchase them with the cash that you give them.

On my hunt I gave my PH a very generous tip of cash, he was saving up for a trip here to the US and Colorado to go elk hunting. I even volunteered to take him out but he had already made arrangements with another hunter that he had guided for his hunt. In other words he didn't need trinkets to help him on his way for this US elk hunt.