Ted Nugent

[sestoppelman]

"When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the Republic" Benjamin Franklin

"When more Americans prefer freebies to freedom, these great United States will become fertile grounds for tryanny." Allen West

This country is experiencing an unprecedented cultural erosion. I truly fear for the future... I hope one day I can be rich enough to be liberal.

Bingo! Give that man a kewpie doll!!

 

[Saul]

One of the problems of holding a political discussion online is that it makes it hard to have a real conversation, and this is why there is so much confusion here. Let me clarify my points throughout the whole thread and ten you guys can reevaluate your opinions on what I have to say.

First of all, I would like to reiterate that I absolutely love TN's music and still listen to it. Unfortunately, I have four really big problems with him that I will discuss.

First of all, I honestly can't stand his shameless promotion of bad products. I know that he has every right to make money, but I would prefer if the items he promoted we're better. This is just small potatoes compared to my other points.

My second big complaint about TN is his stance on gun control. Now I love guns and hunting as much as anyone else here and I conceal carry daily. I think we need to support the 2nd Ammendment, but I also think logically about gun control. No one wants criminals and crazy people to have guns, but people like TN still oppose background checks. Without at least running a simple background check, how do you suppose we weed out the criminals from responsible citizens?

My third big problem with TN is his hunting practices. Not only has he been confirmed and convicted of poaching, but I have seen him make a disproportionately high number of spine shots on deer that he is seemingly proud of. He seems to get enjoyment out of all of the blood and gore and has no respect for the animals. In addition, a more personal opinion of mine, but I strongly disagree with his excessive use of bait and food plots. I'm fine with using it for luring hogs, but the way TN uses it, he is virtually making the deer on his property domesticated.

My fourth problem with TN is how little respect he shows for the POTUS. Love him or hate him, he is still the POTUS. As American citizens, we have every right to voice our outrage with our political leaders, but to an extent. In the end, we all bleed red, white, and blue. This may be the old football player in me, but regardless of my opinion of someone, if they play for my team, I'll fight anyone who challenges them. Do you know who else talks about our president he same way that TN does? Terrorists and all other enemies of this country sure do. Ever whn everyone was in an uproar about Obama bowing to that Muslim? People were upset because our president is the most powerful person in the world and everyone should respect him. Do you know who was saying this? The same people who are criticizing the president now. Where is all of this respect gone. It's not about respecting the president as a man. Since the president is the figurehead of America, it is about respecting America.

There, I've said my piece. I hope this clarifies my feelings on the issue and some of you may agree with me on it.

 

[enysse]

First of all a background check solves nothing. Most of school killers hijacked some else's guns. I don't enjoy watching TN hunt from bait piles, but his enthusiasm is nice. I don't care what products he endorses, I will not buy them most likely anyway. TN hates Obama, so does Sess., I think Obama got in by "the hand out crowd". Respect the president. Do this everyone create a long list of the good actions of Obama, take into account how many hundreds of trillions of dollars he is costing the working public, the guy is a joke. We are setting this country up for anarchy down the road.

 

[sestoppelman]

First of all a background check solves nothing. Most of school killers hijacked some else's guns. I don't enjoy watching TN hunt from bait piles, but his enthusiasm is nice. I don't care what products he endorses, I will not buy them most likely anyway. TN hates Obama, so does Sess., I think Obama got in by "the hand out crowd". Respect the president. Do this everyone create a long list of the good actions of Obama, take into account how many hundreds of trillions of dollars he is costing the working public, the guy is a joke. We are setting this country up for anarchy down the road.

YEP!

 

[sestoppelman]

One of the problems of holding a political discussion online is that it makes it hard to have a real conversation, and this is why there is so much confusion here. Let me clarify my points throughout the whole thread and ten you guys can reevaluate your opinions on what I have to say.

First of all, I would like to reiterate that I absolutely love TN's music and still listen to it. Unfortunately, I have four really big problems with him that I will discuss.

First of all, I honestly can't stand his shameless promotion of bad products. I know that he has every right to make money, but I would prefer if the items he promoted we're better. This is just small potatoes compared to my other points.

My second big complaint about TN is his stance on gun control. Now I love guns and hunting as much as anyone else here and I conceal carry daily. I think we need to support the 2nd Ammendment, but I also think logically about gun control. No one wants criminals and crazy people to have guns, but people like TN still oppose background checks. Without at least running a simple background check, how do you suppose we weed out the criminals from responsible citizens?

My third big problem with TN is his hunting practices. Not only has he been confirmed and convicted of poaching, but I have seen him make a disproportionately high number of spine shots on deer that he is seemingly proud of. He seems to get enjoyment out of all of the blood and gore and has no respect for the animals. In addition, a more personal opinion of mine, but I strongly disagree with his excessive use of bait and food plots. I'm fine with using it for luring hogs, but the way TN uses it, he is virtually making the deer on his property domesticated.

My fourth problem with TN is how little respect he shows for the POTUS. Love him or hate him, he is still the POTUS. As American citizens, we have every right to voice our outrage with our political leaders, but to an extent. In the end, we all bleed red, white, and blue. This may be the old football player in me, but regardless of my opinion of someone, if they play for my team, I'll fight anyone who challenges them. Do you know who else talks about our president he same way that TN does? Terrorists and all other enemies of this country sure do. Ever whn everyone was in an uproar about Obama bowing to that Muslim? People were upset because our president is the most powerful person in the world and everyone should respect him. Do you know who was saying this? The same people who are criticizing the president now. Where is all of this respect gone. It's not about respecting the president as a man. Since the president is the figurehead of America, it is about respecting America.

There, I've said my piece. I hope this clarifies my feelings on the issue and some of you may agree with me on it.

Sure does. Spoken like a true liberal. My reply is as follows::whatever::vomit:

 

[firehuntfish]

Ted and the President

Saul,
Let me begin by stating that you have every right to your personal opinons, and I respect that right...It's one of the priciples supported by the Constitution that we as Americans used to all agree on...Now, not so much...

As for your opinions on TN, I hope you have more evidence that what you are stating because I feel that you may be caught up in the media's caricature version of him via soundbites taken out of context. I'm not a diehard TN supporter trying to defend him, and I don't agree with all of his views. But, I do find him to be intelligent, articulate, informed, and very passionate about what he believes. I have respect for that. Above all, I find him to be entertaining which is first and foremost what he is....An entertainer, lest we forget....

If you have ever read any of his books you would know that his problem with gun control is that the federal government wants to make it very subjective. Specifically with background checks, he is against them in principle because as they have been proposed by the liberal leaders, the disqualifications would be inconsistent and arbitrary. His biggest problem with federal gun control is that it takes the power away from individual states to decide what's best for them. If you are familiar with any of TN's politics, you know he is a huge advocate of states rights, and minimal federal government, which I also believe is what the founding fathers intended when creating our republic.

As for him poaching, are you referring to his bear incident? If so, that hardly quantifies him as a poacher or an outlaw in my opinon. It was a misunderstanding of a very complicated and outdated law, that many hunters before TN have been victim of... If you know how the entire event unfolded, TN made a sincere public appology and explained that although ignorance is no excuse, he felt the law was a bad law, and should be changed. He had his day in court and paid his debt to society. Of course, when you are a controversial celebrity, everything you do is analized and ultimately crucified by the media. He could not win...

Your view is that TN has no respect for wildlife or the animals he harvests? Again with due respect, I completely disagree... I know of no other hunter that is more thankful for nature's bounty than this guy. He revere's the natural resources that he constantly thanks God for providing him. The problem that you and others have, I think, is the way he goes about praising the hunt and the experience of the kill. TN, has a very primal view of the hunting experience as do I... We are not those type of hunters that lie to ourselves about what we are doing, and that we do not enjoy the kill. This is a controversial topic that has debated endlessly here on this and every other hunting forum. The bottom line is that everyone gets something different from their personal hunting experience. TN enjoys it his way, you can enjoy it the way you see fit. I personally find his enthusiasm, and his reverence of the hunting experience as the ultimate tribute to the animal.

As for your view of the President, I can understand your point about respecting the office. However, I think you are looking at it differently that I am. Where is it stated that, we as Americans, are obligated to respect the individual holding said office? I have to agree with others here that this president may be the president holding the office, but he is not my president. I did not vote for him, and I do not believe in any of his policies or agendas. I believe he is doing irrevocable harm to this country and our culture....So, your saying that we as a people are still obligated to respect and revere him simply because he holds a public office?? Why?? I like the analogy you gave about supporting the guy on our team... That's fine, but where does it say that this guy is on my team? If anything, his policy has dictated to me that he is certainly not on "my team". There are millions of people in this world who are socialists, communists, or subject to dictatorships simply because they didn't oppose the guy that was supposed to be on "their team"....

I know you feel that you are supporting America by supporting him, but I assure you that it's not the same...There's a fine line sometimes between patriot and rebel. I guess it just depends who you ask...We were all rebels 240 years ago. I don't mind being one now...

"All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent." Edmund Burke

 

[BnC 04]

The following sums up what I feel our so called "leader" has done for us...


TODAY'S LESSON IN "IRONY
The Food Stamp Program, administered by the U.S. Department of Agriculture, is proud to be distributing this year the greatest amount of free Meals and Food Stamps ever, to 47 million people.
Meanwhile, the National Park Service, administered by the U.S. Department of the Interior, asks us "Please Do Not Feed the Animals." Their stated reason for the policy is because "The animals will grow dependent on handouts and will not learn to take care of themselves."
Thus ends today's lesson in irony.

 

[spike.t]

:clapping: firehuntfish nicely written.

 

[Big5]

. . . . I'm not a diehard TN supporter trying to defend him, and I don't agree with all of his views. But, I do find him to be intelligent, articulate, informed, and very passionate about what he believes. I have respect for that. Above all, I find him to be entertaining which is first and foremost what he is....An entertainer, lest we forget....

. . . . his problem with gun control is that the federal government wants to make it very subjective. Specifically with background checks, he is against them in principle because as they have been proposed by the liberal leaders, the disqualifications would be inconsistent and arbitrary. His biggest problem with federal gun control is that it takes the power away from individual states to decide what's best for them. If you are familiar with any of TN's politics, you know he is a huge advocate of states rights, and minimal federal government, which I also believe is what the founding fathers intended when creating our republic.

. . . . Where is it stated that, we as Americans, are obligated to respect the individual holding said office? I have to agree with others here that this president may be the president holding the office, but he is not my president. I did not vote for him, and I do not believe in any of his policies or agendas. I believe he is doing irrevocable harm to this country and our culture....So, your saying that we as a people are still obligated to respect and revere him simply because he holds a public office?? Why?? I like the analogy you gave about supporting the guy on our team... That's fine, but where does it say that this guy is on my team? If anything, his policy has dictated to me that he is certainly not on "my team". There are millions of people in this world who are socialists, communists, or subject to dictatorships simply because they didn't oppose the guy that was supposed to be on "their team"....

I know you feel that you are supporting America by supporting him, but I assure you that it's not the same...There's a fine line sometimes between patriot and rebel. I guess it just depends who you ask...We were all rebels 240 years ago. I don't mind being one now.

'firehuntfish' - Your thoughts on the matter express my views quite well. I most especially agree with the above highlighted excerpts from your post.

Good hunting to you!

 

[sestoppelman]

The following sums up what I feel our so called "leader" has done for us...


TODAY'S LESSON IN "IRONY
The Food Stamp Program, administered by the U.S. Department of Agriculture, is proud to be distributing this year the greatest amount of free Meals and Food Stamps ever, to 47 million people.
Meanwhile, the National Park Service, administered by the U.S. Department of the Interior, asks us "Please Do Not Feed the Animals." Their stated reason for the policy is because "The animals will grow dependent on handouts and will not learn to take care of themselves."
Thus ends today's lesson in irony.

+10!!!!

 

[sestoppelman]

Saul,
Let me begin by stating that you have every right to your personal opinons, and I respect that right...It's one of the priciples supported by the Constitution that we as Americans used to all agree on...Now, not so much...

As for your opinions on TN, I hope you have more evidence that what you are stating because I feel that you may be caught up in the media's caricature version of him via soundbites taken out of context. I'm not a diehard TN supporter trying to defend him, and I don't agree with all of his views. But, I do find him to be intelligent, articulate, informed, and very passionate about what he believes. I have respect for that. Above all, I find him to be entertaining which is first and foremost what he is....An entertainer, lest we forget....

If you have ever read any of his books you would know that his problem with gun control is that the federal government wants to make it very subjective. Specifically with background checks, he is against them in principle because as they have been proposed by the liberal leaders, the disqualifications would be inconsistent and arbitrary. His biggest problem with federal gun control is that it takes the power away from individual states to decide what's best for them. If you are familiar with any of TN's politics, you know he is a huge advocate of states rights, and minimal federal government, which I also believe is what the founding fathers intended when creating our republic.

As for him poaching, are you referring to his bear incident? If so, that hardly quantifies him as a poacher or an outlaw in my opinon. It was a misunderstanding of a very complicated and outdated law, that many hunters before TN have been victim of... If you know how the entire event unfolded, TN made a sincere public appology and explained that although ignorance is no excuse, he felt the law was a bad law, and should be changed. He had his day in court and paid his debt to society. Of course, when you are a controversial celebrity, everything you do is analized and ultimately crucified by the media. He could not win...

Your view is that TN has no respect for wildlife or the animals he harvests? Again with due respect, I completely disagree... I know of no other hunter that is more thankful for nature's bounty than this guy. He revere's the natural resources that he constantly thanks God for providing him. The problem that you and others have, I think, is the way he goes about praising the hunt and the experience of the kill. TN, has a very primal view of the hunting experience as do I... We are not those type of hunters that lie to ourselves about what we are doing, and that we do not enjoy the kill. This is a controversial topic that has debated endlessly here on this and every other hunting forum. The bottom line is that everyone gets something different from their personal hunting experience. TN enjoys it his way, you can enjoy it the way you see fit. I personally find his enthusiasm, and his reverence of the hunting experience as the ultimate tribute to the animal.

As for your view of the President, I can understand your point about respecting the office. However, I think you are looking at it differently that I am. Where is it stated that, we as Americans, are obligated to respect the individual holding said office? I have to agree with others here that this president may be the president holding the office, but he is not my president. I did not vote for him, and I do not believe in any of his policies or agendas. I believe he is doing irrevocable harm to this country and our culture....So, your saying that we as a people are still obligated to respect and revere him simply because he holds a public office?? Why?? I like the analogy you gave about supporting the guy on our team... That's fine, but where does it say that this guy is on my team? If anything, his policy has dictated to me that he is certainly not on "my team". There are millions of people in this world who are socialists, communists, or subject to dictatorships simply because they didn't oppose the guy that was supposed to be on "their team"....

I know you feel that you are supporting America by supporting him, but I assure you that it's not the same...There's a fine line sometimes between patriot and rebel. I guess it just depends who you ask...We were all rebels 240 years ago. I don't mind being one now...

"All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent." Edmund Burke

Verrrrry well put!

 

[Diamondhitch]

My fourth problem with TN is how little respect he shows for the POTUS. Love him or hate him, he is still the POTUS. As American citizens, we have every right to voice our outrage with our political leaders, but to an extent. In the end, we all bleed red, white, and blue. This may be the old football player in me, but regardless of my opinion of someone, if they play for my team, I'll fight anyone who challenges them. Do you know who else talks about our president he same way that TN does? Terrorists and all other enemies of this country sure do. Ever whn everyone was in an uproar about Obama bowing to that Muslim? People were upset because our president is the most powerful person in the world and everyone should respect him. Do you know who was saying this? The same people who are criticizing the president now. Where is all of this respect gone. It's not about respecting the president as a man. Since the president is the figurehead of America, it is about respecting America.

1st of all, I agree with the others, anyone who wants a gun will get a gun, illegal gun dealers do not do background checks.

Second of all I cant help but drop my jaw at the football analogy. Would you vote for beloved president Joe Patterno and Jerry Sandusky? How long did they stick together as a team while football players were being raped? Blindly following leaders is a recipe for disaster.

 

[Diamondhitch]

Further, the president is not the country, disrespecting the president is not disrespecting the country anymore than disrespecting any other citizen.

 

[Red Leg]

I think we are "debating" a fairly narrow issue - at least I am. I fully agree that it is important to legally oppose policies/laws/etc sponsored by political leadership with which we disagree. I personally think that opposition is best expressed at the ballot box, but letter writing, editorials, even demonstrations are means to express that message. So is ranting on discussion board. My issues begin when we cross a line that can not be defended. Ted used what can only be described as racist bigotted words to describe the President of the United States - to remind - he called him a "subhuman mongrel". The closest verbage I have ever seen to it was language used to describe Jews in Nazi Germany. I will not associate myself with that language, and I am furious that I am being associated with it, however indirectly, because of Nugent's perception as a spokesman for my sport. I might add I am a life member of the NRA, and this sort of drivel can only undermine our efforts to preserve our 2d Amendment rights as well.

So feel free to pull out all the "tree of liberty" quotes one wants, but in what universe is "Subhuman Mongrel" defensable?

 

[Diamondhitch]

A mongrel is a dog and by definition is subhuman. I don't know if that was intended as a racial slur but is certainly derogatory. Calling someone a POS should be worse than a mongerel shouldn't it? after all that is far more subhuman than mongrel? yet that comment constantly goes unchecked and is only one of many dehumanizing phrases that we seem to accept.

I believe Teds comment may have included Muslim, didn't it? That road becomes racist real quickly.

 

[firehuntfish]

I think we are "debating" a fairly narrow issue - at least I am. I fully agree that it is important to legally oppose policies/laws/etc sponsored by political leadership with which we disagree. I personally think that opposition is best expressed at the ballot box, but letter writing, editorials, even demonstrations are means to express that message. So is ranting on discussion board. My issues begin when we cross a line that can not be defended. Ted used what can only be described as racist bigotted words to describe the President of the United States - to remind - he called him a "subhuman mongrel". The closest verbage I have ever seen to it was language used to describe Jews in Nazi Germany. I will not associate myself with that language, and I am furious that I am being associated with it, however indirectly, because of Nugent's perception as a spokesman for my sport. I might add I am a life member of the NRA, and this sort of drivel can only undermine our efforts to preserve our 2d Amendment rights as well.

So feel free to pull out all the "tree of liberty" quotes one wants, but in what universe is "Subhuman Mongrel" defensable?

I must admit that I am shocked at how easily some of us are offended in this country these days...I am a dinosaur, self-admittedly, but I do not appologize for it.... Again, the phrase "sub-human mongrel" sounds awful, but I fail to see how some find it treasonous when it was made in reference to someone in a political office..? It's just words...And, if you really believe that it was intended as a racial slur, you really are not familiar with the biography of TN. This is a guy who grew up in Detroit playing rock and blues with dozens of black American artists. He was interned, influenced, and practically raised by some of the best blues artists of all time, who happened to be black Americans. He refers to himself in his books as more black than white. When I spent time with him in hunting camp in Africa, he conversed with, and embraced the black Africans like they were kin. If he is racist, he sure fooled me...Was it a poor choice of words probably spoken out of his extreme frustration with this administration? Sure....Racially motivated? I seriously doubt it.....

Thanks for noticing the "tree of liberty" quotes... I appreciate the one you posted by Churcill, who I regard as one of the most practically brilliant thinkers of our time. That's one of my favorites...

I love the fact that anytime a white person disagrees with the president's policies, it must be because they are racist....The political correctness in this country has far surpassed the absurd and ridiculous.

 

[enysse]

Second of all I cant help but drop my jaw at the football analogy. Would you vote for beloved president Joe Patterno and Jerry Sandusky? How long did they stick together as a team while football players were being raped? Blindly following leaders is a recipe for disaster.

LMAO! Blindly following is always a recipe for disaster!!!

 

[Red Leg]

I must admit that I am shocked at how easily some of us are offended in this country these days...I am a dinosaur, self-admittedly, but I do not appologize for it.... Again, the phrase "sub-human mongrel" sounds awful, but I fail to see how some find it treasonous when it was made in reference to someone in a political office..? It's just words...And, if you really believe that it was intended as a racial slur, you really are not familiar with the biography of TN. This is a guy who grew up in Detroit playing rock and blues with dozens of black American artists. He was interned, influenced, and practically raised by some of the best blues artists of all time, who happened to be black Americans. He refers to himself in his books as more black than white. When I spent time with him in hunting camp in Africa, he conversed with, and embraced the black Africans like they were kin. If he is racist, he sure fooled me...Was it a poor choice of words probably spoken out of his extreme frustration with this administration? Sure....Racially motivated? I seriously doubt it.....

Thanks for noticing the "tree of liberty" quotes... I appreciate the one you posted by Churcill, who I regard as one of the most practically brilliant thinkers of our time. That's one of my favorites...

I love the fact that anytime a white person disagrees with the president's policies, it must be because they are racist....The political correctness in this country has far surpassed the absurd and ridiculous.

Sigh - I give up. What I find absurb and ridiculous is not rightly perceiving the potential dammage caused by historically incendiary name calling such as "Subhuman Mongrel". That is not some white guy dissagreeing with the President's policies. That is some white guy, with a stage, setting back what we are trying to accomplish with regard to educating the disinterested middle about our sport and the value of the right to bear arms.

 

[firehuntfish]

Sigh - I give up. What I find absurb and ridiculous is not rightly perceiving the potential dammage caused by historically incendiary name calling such as "Subhuman Mongrel". That is not some white guy dissagreeing with the President's policies. That is some white guy, with a stage, setting back what we are trying to accomplish with regard to educating the disinterested middle about our sport and the value of the right to bear arms.

Red Leg,

Please don't sigh and give up... Your sentiment is not lost on me. I simply have a different perspective on the TN issue, and we disagree as to the signifigance of the phrase he used to describe his disgust toward the policies and agendas of the sitting president...That said, I do find that likening the rhetoric of a 60 year old rock star/entertainer/political activist/author to that of Hilter and the nazi party is a bit of a stretch in anybody's book.

I too share your concern about the "disinterested middle" and we could probably have a lengthy, productive discussion on the best ways to win favor for our mutual love of hunting, fishing, etc... If you feel that TN is not the guy you want representing your intertests, you have every right to your opinon....I'm sure the NRA has it's own views as to whom best represents the interests of gun owners, and those who value the Second Amendment. I think is also safe to say that if enough of the membership shared your opinion of TN, he would be out the door. That remains to be seen...I can only assume that they feel he is still doing more good than harm to the cause.

 

[35bore]

Sigh - I give up. What I find absurb and ridiculous is not rightly perceiving the potential dammage caused by historically incendiary name calling such as "Subhuman Mongrel". That is not some white guy dissagreeing with the President's policies. That is some white guy, with a stage, setting back what we are trying to accomplish with regard to educating the disinterested middle about our sport and the value of the right to bear arms.

Red Leg, from a different standpoint, the term "subhuman mongrel",,,, (still trying to figure out what the problem is),,,, Barry is a dog working for his master, i.e. Soros, he's a puppet, nothing more nothing less. You are offended and disturbed over the term. In you recollection, what have gun owners, patriots, hunters, etc.etc., been called in the past???? I understand what you are saying about "name calling" and I thought TN was rather reserved in his description of the POS. No different than me saying Tony Abbott, Michael Moore, Clintons, (the list could go on and on, as a "subhuman Mongrel" he's still a POS regardless of county or race. (And yes, same master)

Seems some may be a little too caught up in the political correctness BS, BBUUUTTTT, it seems that we are the ones who have to refrain from being the "bad guys" because we are the minority, and we don't want to offend anyone. Well guess what,?,?,? WE are not a minority anymore, thanks to the puppet there have been record number sales in firearms here in the US, and Piers Morgan is taking his ass back to England, his show got canceled. Americans, Canadians, Europeans, Australians, Christians and the rest of the World is fed up.

We will always prevail, hunter's, we are providers. Just like farmers, in a sense. We pit ourselves upon ourselves, because we don't agree with a term one of our bretheren used,,,,Whatever,,,, I will finish with this, TN has done more for the gun owners and hunting community than I would guess 99.9% of this forum have ever done. To bash him over a few choice words, I won't, it's his RIGHT to do so....

BTW, Tony Abbot is the Australian version of Barrack...