Resurrecting the 270 Win

[Red Leg]

I’m reading this with interest as the .270 has a good reputation within Australia.
It has been highly regarded by gunwriters and hunters for years.
It is also a minimum legal calibre for some deer in some states.
Red Leg I realise the quote is made in jest but when I started researching reduced loads for low recoils loads I found actual subsonic loads use a heavy for calibre projectile. In fact they produce heavy projectiles designed to expand at the lower velocities. With suppressors being restricted in Australia there a few exceptions to use them and some agencies can use them for pest control in populated areas (Deer included). The Bullets that are designed for this purpose were probably designed for other applications. I’m not sure a solid is suited in that situations but I guess it will get penetration over expansion.

One can build a projectile that will expand if “fired” from a slingshot. That doesn’t mean that it will penetrate adequately to be of any utility. My problem with nearly all the sub-sonic loads is that their effective operating envelope - driven by trajectory and adequate penetration make them of questionable practical value for hunting game animals. Even with vermin, I think we have a responsibility to kill quickly. Regardless of weight for caliber, an expanding sub-sonic load is challenged if trying to penetrate a boar’s shoulder except at very close range. Even in combat, a suppressed sub-sonic weapon is considered a tool for essentially pistol range applications.

 

[Mr. Zorg]

I find all the "If" speculation on the timing of the .270 Winchester vs the .280 Remington amusing, since the 7X64mm Brenneke predates both those cartridges. The bigger "If" to me is "If the 7X64mm Brenneke had jumped the Atlantic Ocean shortly after WWI, would the .270 Winchester and / or the .280 Remington ever have become recognized standardized cartridges?"

 

[ldmay375]

As stated prior, the 270 Winchester still seems popular in my parts of Alaska.
Last week a friend's daughter filled her cow moose permit. Per his feedback, 270 Win, at about 75 yds, cow pretty much broadside, after shot travel distance about 25 yds, 1 rib going in, massive internal destruction, exit opposite side, Remington 150 grain factory load, believed to have been pointed Core Lokt bullet. I saw the picture and this was a sizable mature cow.

 

[gizmo]

I have to echo @Red Leg, no need to resurrect it. 270 has been a very popular caliber for many years. I love mine and have killed everything from whitetail and mule deer to exotics and pg in Africa with mine. I actually shoot a little lighter bullet than most, 130 grain, and never had an issue. It’s been a go to caliber for just about everything within reason for me. I’d have no issues taking it elk hunting or kudu hunting. I have to say the heavy bullets mentioned , I.e. 180 gr, just seem unnecessary. 150 would be about the heaviest that would be practical. By the time you custom built a rifle to shoot something like 180’s I think there are better options. The 270 is what it is and I think it is extremely effective for what it was designed for.

 

[375 Ruger Fan]

I've been slowly getting back into reloading. My current project is to work up a load for a son-in-law's 270. We are going to Montana in 2020 for an elk hunt and I'm going to work up a load with 150 gr Swift A-Frames.

 

[gizmo]

I've been slowly getting back into reloading. My current project is to work up a load for a son-in-law's 270. We are going to Montana in 2020 for an elk hunt and I'm going to work up a load with 150 gr Swift A-Frames.

I’d say that will serve him well. Good luck and I hope he whacks a monster.

 

[HWL]

.270 Winchester....? a damned good coyote gun!



HWL

 

[Ray B]

.270 Winchester....? a damned good coyote gun!



HWL

Ah, Another Elmer Keith convert.

 

[ldmay375]

I was a fan of Elmer, as well as Bob Hagel and Jack O'Conner.
Since this thread caught my eye, I have acquired a 270 WSM which is currently in shop having the stock bedded. This is a New Haven M70 stainless.
I also just purchased a 270 Winchester. It is a New Haven M70 Stainless with a 24" barrel.
My son has a New Haven M70 stainless featherweight with 22".

I personally have always favored the 7mm Rem Mag over the 270 Win. Presently 7 WSM may be my preferred cartridge of 270's and 7mm's
Not that I think that there is a significant performance difference with 130, 140, 150 grain bullets for my hunting distances.

 

[colorado]

Well we have two 270s (BDLs the newest being mid-80s vintage) a 270 Weatherby Magnum I bought very used but shoots lights out as long as you let the barrel cool between shots. As far as Elmer goes, when hunting elk in the black timber I take my 500 Jeffery, just shoots right through the trees ....

 

[Bonk]

I like my 270 but I don't have much use for it. It sits in no man's land between .257/.264 and .284.

 

[colorado]

I think the bullet choices for the 270 are fine. I find it hard to find a better bullet than the 150g Partition at 3000 fps. For my 270 Weatherby I wish Swift would make a 160g A-Frame with a solid boattail (no gap in the base) with a polymer tip. The 270 Bee can get a 160g bullet up to 3150 fsp

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

a good choice for a 1-gun-hunter; or if it's your first gun in a collection which is going to be acquired subsequent to being a 1-gun-hunter. and especially if you don't plan on reloading.

otherwise, in the same weight bullets, it recoils like a 30-06. not bad recoil, but why sacrifice the versatility you'd get out of a 30-06?

I agree with @bruce moulds - 280 Rem is a better choice.

IMO, "flat shooting" is way over-rated. if you understand the concept of Maximum Point Blank Range, then pretty much all modern cartridges are "flat shooting" inside about 300 yards. and in all honesty, if you aren't practicing past 300 yards, pretty routinely at that, you've no business hunting at distances that far, either.

reloading choices for the 264 and 284 bullets are staggering. reloading choices for the 270 are a bit more limited. I've said it before - if 280 Rem had come out before 270 Win, the latter would be an oddity today, a footnote.

to each his own, but I've never been a fan.

Sgt Zim
I agree mate the 270 won't do anything the 280 or 06 won't do a bit better.
If it wasn't for Jack O'Connor jamming it down our throats I don't think it would be where it is today. If it wasn't for a bucket full of advertising the 270, 243 and a few others may have died at birth.
Cheers mate Bob

 

[ZG47]

Guys, I have probably said this before BUT it is my belief (based on reading and application of logic) that the .270 Winchester was a response to the .256 Newton, created initially by rechambering a 6.8x57 barrel to use a necked-down .30-06 case. W.R.A. would most likely have received full technical data on that prewar Chinese military cartridge by virtue of being on the winning side in WWI, thus acquiring a new cartridge with greater safety margins than a hot 6.5 cartridge and at a lower cost than starting from scratch.
When talking about hunting of goats and deer, etc. ; I consider the .270 Winchester to be a practical lower pressure alternative to the hot 6.5mm chamberings; in the same way that I consider a 6.5x55 SE rifle with a 1-220mm/8.66” OR 1-9” twist barrel to be a practical lower pressure alternative to the .257 Roberts and .25-06 Remington chamberings.
We all make different choices with kit and application thereof but so long as we kill the animals cleanly and do not blow up rifles when other people are within range of the resultant flying steel fragments, is it really that much of an issue?
One good thing about this thread is that it has remained so civilised. Good on you, fellow forum members!

P.S It is fashionable to dismiss the .376 Steyr chambering as having inadequate ballistic performance BUT it has achieved identical test performance to that advertised for the original .375 H&H ammunition when it is fired from a 28” test barrel, i.e. exactly the same test barrel length as reportedly used by Eley. Perspective is a funny thing.

 

[colorado]

Sgt Zim
I agree mate the 270 won't do anything the 280 or 06 won't do a bit better.
If it wasn't for Jack O'Connor jamming it down our throats I don't think it would be where it is today. If it wasn't for a bucket full of advertising the 270, 243 and a few others may have died at birth.
Cheers mate Bob

I think the 270 Win is a great cartridge. You can shoot Sierra 90g HPBTs at 3400 fps at praire dogs all day, and 150g Partition at 3000 fps is plenty for anything including mountain grizzlies in the lower 48. It shoots flatter than 30-06, and hits just as hard. The 30-06 has the edge with heavier bullets (200g and 220g) but other than that the 270 just beats it all day long. As far as the 280 Rem, great cartridge, but woulda shoulda ....

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I think the 270 Win is a great cartridge. You can shoot Sierra 90g HPBTs at 3400 fps at praire dogs all day, and 150g Partition at 3000 fps is plenty for anything including mountain grizzlies in the lower 48. It shoots flatter than 30-06, and hits just as hard. The 30-06 has the edge with heavier bullets (200g and 220g) but other than that the 270 just beats it all day long. As far as the 280 Rem, great cartridge, but woulda shoulda

Colorado
The only reason the 280 was a shoulda woulda is that Remington castrated it at birth by underloading it. It's capable of far better
A good 7mm 160 grain bullet at 3,000 fps is about the best medicine for game that you could get. The 270,280 and the 06 May be screamers with light bullets but they are HUNTING rounds not varmit rounds. The choice is yours but give me an 06 or a properly loaded 280 any day.
I liked my 270 that much I converted it to 35 Whelen. A real hunting cartridge.
I can hear the screams of the lynch mob now but that's my humble opinion.
Cheers mate Bob

 

[colorado]

Well I wish you well and hope you and your family are healthy. The 280 is a great cartridge, the 7mm Rem Mag probably better. I like my 270 better than my 270 Weatherby Mag, but my son won't give me my 270 back lol. The elk won't notice the difference between any of the three.

 

[RayAtkinson]

Apparantly we on the internet forum and what ever, have lost contact with the outside world where you still see more 270s and 30-06s in the field during hunting season, be careful with tunnel vision. I only recently retired from 40 years of being in the hunting business, spent most of the year in hunting camps, and the old 270, 30-06, 308, and a few others still showed up the most and took home the bacon. yes there was a sprinkling of new stuff, and it grew a lot of attention in camp, sometimes just out of politeness I suspect..

In Tanzania I saw the 375 H&H, the 416 Rem, and 458 win. almost to the client..and if anything "new" showed up it wasn't new stuff it was the 404, Jefferys, 505 Gibbs or whatever...and a few double rifles in 450-400, 9.3x74, and .470 with a few others from time to time..

My point being most hunters are not deep into the new stuff or the wildcats as blog gents are..and that only makes since if you think about it..

 

[Dr Ray]

Sgt Zim
I agree mate the 270 won't do anything the 280 or 06 won't do a bit better.
If it wasn't for Jack O'Connor jamming it down our throats I don't think it would be where it is today. If it wasn't for a bucket full of advertising the 270, 243 and a few others may have died at birth.
Cheers mate Bob

Hey the 270 is my favorite!
I had 308 30/06s and on my fourth 270 in Sako.
I really like it for medium game.
I won’t use on buffalo I might add.
To each his own.

 

[RayAtkinson]

If anyone of you can show me any difference, in the field, not playing paper games, between the 30-06, 270, 280, 284, and few more, I will eat your hat as O'Connor used to say...The 280 has had more names than Carter had pills, none of them set the world on fire because of the other two..I will take the 7x57 over the 280 for what its worth..Of all of these calibers I prefer the 30-06 mostly because of the heavier bullets, I would never feel undergunned with a flat shooting .270, its a fantastic caliber..still a best seller, as are the dies..