R8 3 accidental discharges, human error or?

[BeeMaa]

I recall a time in a duck blind when a friend of my father's was "easing off the safety" and BOOM!
cause: human error. condition: top tang safety on a Mossberg shotgun that was stiff/frozen....need more push...the instinct is to use leverage by placing pressure in the opposite direction....in this case the trigger. I won't own a gun with a top tang safety just for that reason.....lesson learned by another's mistake. He was in his 60's and I was 14 at the time. I realize not a tang safety but on the R8 but the same motion nonetheless.

You have learned nothing from the ND by your father's friend. Avoiding all interactions with a tang safety is not a lesson, it's a wasted opportunity to learn.

The first lesson was to exercise proper firearm safety. Next, know your equipment before going into the field and be well versed in all potential problems. Make sure you have a shotgun that is properly cared for (cleaned, oiled...etc) so the safety doesn't stick and everything operates like it should. Don't push beyond the limits of yourself or your equipment. These are just a couple of lessons that could have been taught from that once incident.

You have deprived yourself of several excellent firearms because of this. Open your eyes.

 

[Red Leg]

I recall a time in a duck blind when a friend of my father's was "easing off the safety" and BOOM!
cause: human error. condition: top tang safety on a Mossberg shotgun that was stiff/frozen....need more push...the instinct is to use leverage by placing pressure in the opposite direction....in this case the trigger. I won't own a gun with a top tang safety just for that reason.....lesson learned by another's mistake. He was in his 60's and I was 14 at the time. I realize not a tang safety but on the R8 but the same motion nonetheless.

I assume virtually all doubles and OU shotguns and rifles are on the self-forbidden list? That strikes me as a rather odd overeaction to your father mishandling of firearm.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

You have deprived yourself of several excellent firearms because of this. Open your eyes.

Maybe, but Mossberg isn't one of them.

 

[Captain David newlin]

Since this is client’s rifle I just keep thinking how many times this has happened to him hunting elsewhere and at home if it happened 3 times on a zim hunt. This has to be stressful on the PH. I always show my PH my rifle is unloaded after taking an animal and getting in truck after two days they say I don’t need to, but I always continue to keep that discipline, and also have them catch me if I made a mistake.a

 

[Captain David newlin]

Hunt would have been over if I was guiding after the second ad. Maybe after the first it is hard to bring back bullets. I firmly believe it was operator error

 

[K E Johnson]

Maybe, but Mossberg isn't one of them.

Definitely not a maybe. @BeeMaa and @Red Leg nailed it.

 

[Altitude sickness]

I like the Krieghoff and Blaser cock/decock safety.

When learning to shoot
I would have been missing my trigger finger if it was ever seen anywhere near the trigger UNTIL,
I was down on the firearm, safety off, and ready to fire.
Thank goodness, on these AD and ND the muzzle was not pointing at anyone.

 

[Red Leg]

Maybe, but Mossberg isn't one of them.

Pretty much sums it up exactly.

 

[Flewis]

Been around the 93 not the R8. AR with a manual transmission.

 

[MD Driver]

So glad for this discussion and for all of your inputs. I’ve had two R8s for quite a while, but never used either under any hunting pressure or duress. Have to “chair fly” (aviator’s term for practice) both and see how close I’ve come to an AD/ND.

 

[20mm]

Hunted with an R8 in Namibia 1989.
AD slam fire issue w/defective bolt.
It went back to the factory for repair
BUT
Never picked up an R8 again

 

[Red Leg]

Hunted with an R8 in Namibia 1989.
AD slam fire issue w/defective bolt.
It went back to the factory for repair
BUT
Never picked up an R8 again

1989!?! That is truly extraordinary. Hard to catch a break when it is blamed for an AD nearly two decades before it existed. Heck, the R 93 didn't exist until - wait for it - 1993.

Sometimes trolls on their first posts are so truly stupid.

 

[Hunting Hitman]

1989!?! That is truly extraordinary. Hard to catch a break when it is blamed for an AD nearly two decades before it existed. Heck, the R 93 didn't exist until - wait for it - 1993.

Sometimes trolls on their first posts are so truly stupid.

Just what I was thinking…had to have jumped in a Time Machine from 2010 to 1989 and had the issue. Clearly the R8 was nowhere near this alleged incident.

HH

 

[R eight]

My Springfield and Mauser are just as super safe ... when carried with an empty chamber. Dragged, kicked, snagged, whatever ... they cannot fire. To make them shoot does require cocking and loading which is a two handed affair. No chance of accidental discharge due to errant trigger finger. For final stalk, my gun MAY be carried with a round in the chamber. A quick glance from PH can determine if 3-position safety is engaged or not (Springfield not so much as it presently has 2-position Mauser style wing safety hidden on left side of the receiver behind the scope).

I would be much more comfortable guiding someone I didn't know who was shooting a 3-position Winchester or Mauser style safety than the R8 or Remington 700 configuration. No matter the configuration, clients should carry the guns unloaded till the PH puts them on the sticks. Then cock/load up with two hands.

I'm sure the R8 design has a lot going for it re portability, etc but this is a safety issue that is obviously a very real threat. A safety that is not real easy to disengage is not necessarily a bad thing. Ask me how I know!

As you yourself have stated you haven’t used an R8. You’re entitled to your opinion but with due respect, in this instance, it doesn’t carry much weight.

My R8 has hunted in Alaska, BC and in Australia. It’s my go to rifle for most hunts. I cannot fault the R8.

I also own and use rifles based on the Mauser 98. I love them too.

As to the original post. My money is on a ND….

 

[AimSmall]

 

[Nyati]

I have tested extensively the R93 and the R8, while writing articles on both.

The guns will not fire unless you cock them and press the triggers.

And I have witnessed AD´s on some idiots trying to uncock rifles with Mauser systems while having a cartridge in the chamber !

So, I believe it´s all due to human error.

 

[rookhawk]

I would guess a dirty trigger mechanism on a trigger that is perhaps set at 1 or 1,5 lbs. Dirt and grime keeps the trigger back and as soon as the cocking device is disengaged the rifle goes bang. Also curious to learn.

It sounds that way to me.

The R8 *I believe* operates like the Heym SR30. (Blaser boys, fact check me)

It's a stick shift. Pull the bolt all the way rear, it unlocks and can load and unload. Pull the bolt forward to "neutral" and you have a locked bolt with an uncocked firing pin. When ready to fire, you push the bolt to "drive" and it has cocked the firing pin.

If that logic holds, some stupid hair-trigger that is grimed up or fragile would potentially AD. It should be a 3.5lb sporting trigger for safety.

So if the trigger is too hairy and you push the bolt into "drive", you may cock and AD in a single swipe.

Simple solution: get the trigger serviced so its got more sear engagement as a sporting trigger, not a 4 ounce to 1.5lb nonsensical bench rest match trigger.

 

[Red Leg]

It sounds that way to me.

The R8 *I believe* operates like the Heym SR30. (Blaser boys, fact check me)

It's a stick shift. Pull the bolt all the way rear, it unlocks and can load and unload. Pull the bolt forward to "neutral" and you have a locked bolt with an uncocked firing pin. When ready to fire, you push the bolt to "drive" and it has cocked the firing pin.

If that logic holds, some stupid hair-trigger that is grimed up or fragile would potentially AD. It should be a 3.5lb sporting trigger for safety.

So if the trigger is too hairy and you push the bolt into "drive", you may cock and AD in a single swipe.

Simple solution: get the trigger serviced so its got more sear engagement as a sporting trigger, not a 4 ounce to 1.5lb nonsensical bench rest match trigger.

No, the Fortner system is different than the R8. It is actually closer to the Savage straight pull. And I do not want a 3.5 lb pull on one of my R8's. The R8 trigger is a major reason why so many of us own the rifle. The trigger design is not one to somehow remain in the fired position during bolt manipulation. Moreover, the chamber is normally loaded with an uncocked rifle. Obviously an immediate follow-up shot will be from a cocked rifle.

I am a member of BlaserBuds, and the only R8 case of an UD they have looked at was a Blaser R8 that left the factory with a defective trigger mechanism. This was discovered by Blaser following an extensive forensic investigation of the rifle.

 

[Dewald]

I would guess a dirty trigger mechanism on a trigger that is perhaps set at 1 or 1,5 lbs. Dirt and grime keeps the trigger back and as soon as the cocking device is disengaged the rifle goes bang. Also curious to learn.

Aprat from sniping baboons and engaging gongs with a very good friend’s Blaser 6XC on his farm in Ladysmith I have never used a Blaser. Oh, and one Blaser sponsored field shoot competition. He used to work for L&O and then bought the rifle for next to nothing. I am not at all against them nor an advocate for them. I simply don’t know enough about them. His rifle seems to be just the tool for the job. Obviously with regular practice no crop raiding baboon on that farm is safe within 500m. I spoke to him now and he has never had an AD, nor does he remember a complaint of one when he worked at L&O.

It seems my guess above is not possible with the Blaser bolt mechanism and safety.

 

[Sauer404XT]

Sauer 404 owner, having the same decocker as the R8. When i first got it i use to decock it first and then get ready to shoot as it was a new system which i needed to get use to it. My finger is never near the trigger unless i am 99.9% confident i will shoot.

After a while it becomes like muscle memory as you are pulling up the rifle you decock at the same time and once shouldered it's ready to shoot.

When i am hunting alone i sometimes have it decocked especially if a red stag is roaring close by if i got to shoot in a hurry, If i spook it i will put it back on safe