Premium bullets needed for PG?

[Rem700stw]

As I have expressed before, I am a firm believer in Barnes bullets, the TSX in particular. Since first using them in 2008, I have had zero problems/failures with them. I have shot animals from Jackal to Buffalo with them and my confidence in them is immense.

I am also an advocate for accuracy. On the safari I took in September for my birthday, I faced a bit of a dilemma. This trip was rather last minute as my wife made the mistake of asking what I wanted for my August 10th 60th birthday in late June. I replied SAFARI! I knew immediately by the look on her face that SAFARI was not the answer she had anticipated.

My good friend and PH, Pieter, wanted in on the birthday theme by wishing to surprise me by not telling me what we would be hunting. What does one take for a surprise safari?

I had a CZ 416 Rigby that I had not taken to Africa yet, so it was selected along with loads using Barnes TSX and solids. I selected a Chapuis double in 9.3x74 with a set of 20 gauge barrels with handloads using the Swift A-Frame as I do not use mono-metal bullets in doubles. My final pick was a CZ in 7x57 that I had never even fired. My time to find a suitable load was limited by the unfortunate circumstance that I still work. I tried multiple loads and factory offerings with poor results until I tried the Federal PowerShok roundnose load with a 175 grain bullet. Grouping was amazing. How would it perform on game?

I shot a trophy Steenbok, Duiker, and white Blesbok. One and done. I also culled an Impala, WaterBuck cow, and Kudu bull. Also one and done. The chronographed velocity of the 7x57 was 2345 fps. At modest velocity it worked quite well. The only bullet recovered was from the Waterbuck which was a quartering away shot. I have not weighed that projectile as of yet.

The Barnes TSX in 416 worked well on a cull Cape Buffalo cow and Crocodile. The 9.3 A-frame handled a cull Giraffe with authority.

3 completely different types of bullets all with great results. I would never load a cup and core like the Federal bullet "hot" but at appropriate velocity it performed flawlessly from 60 yards on the Waterbuck cow to 300 on the Blesbok.

I think the question is not if premium bullets are needed for plains game but rather are premium bullets needed for the requirements you set for your hunt. No doubt the premiums provide some insurance but shot placement is vital as well and one must respect the intended velocity window for any projectile.

 

[SStomcat]

Well said, as I'm reading through the thread I should have mentioned that cost is not an issues as some of you have reasons to believe. I believe in using what is required and not go overboard with anything that may not be necessary or justified.

 

[Hunter-Habib]

You pay top Dollar on an African Safari. The bullet is the only thing you’re paying for, which actually touches the animal. I hope that my answer is self explanatory.

That said, a lot of people these days have pretty rigid definitions of the word “Premium”. Barnes TSX and Swift A Frames are great bullets, but a lot of younger hunters these days feel that anything other than these two designs… will fail to bring game to bag.

I did/do all this in Africa over the years with the following bullets:

Remington Core Lokt

Winchester Super X (now discontinued)

So far as I can recall, very few of the game required a second shot. And when they did, it was purely due to my faulty shooting. Not due to the bullets not performing properly.

Granted; these bullets were the “Premiums” back when I first started hunting in Africa as a client in 1974. And today, the consumer’s definition of “Premium” has changed considerably. But to the best of my knowledge… the anatomy of African fauna (such as a Kudu or the like) hasn’t.

To further put matters into perspective… in Tanzania, local hunters almost always use Sellier & Bellot rifle ammunition (Tanganyika Arms Limited seldom stocks any other brands) for their plains game harvesting purposes. This is as basic rifle ammunition as one can get, but most are pretty successful.

 

[JG26Irish_2]

As I have expressed before, I am a firm believer in Barnes bullets, the TSX in particular. Since first using them in 2008, I have had zero problems/failures with them. I have shot animals from Jackal to Buffalo with them and my confidence in them is immense.

I am also an advocate for accuracy. On the safari I took in September for my birthday, I faced a bit of a dilemma. This trip was rather last minute as my wife made the mistake of asking what I wanted for my August 10th 60th birthday in late June. I replied SAFARI! I knew immediately by the look on her face that SAFARI was not the answer she had anticipated.

I think the question is not if premium bullets are needed for plains game but rather are premium bullets needed for the requirements you set for your hunt. No doubt the premiums provide some insurance but shot placement is vital as well and one must respect the intended velocity window for any projectile.

Well said Sir. An accurate, quality bullet that is well suited for the job it will do is about as good as any of us can do.

Regarding an earlier comment by another poster... You are correct. My comment about my discussion with Bill Hober (President and CEO of Swift) was not 100% correct. I got lazy and mis-stated that he was also the founder which was not correct. I knew that but had forgotten. Bill was a big advocate for his Scirocco line for PG or most North American Game. He said if you are not hunting DG, you really did not need an A-Frame bullet. I am not advocating for Swift but it is one of the arrows in my quiver. For my next Safari I am planning to take the following: 30-06 180g Swift Scirocco (30), 180g Barnes TTSX (10), 375HH 300g Swift A-Frame (15) Woodleigh Hydro 300g (5), I also have a full box of the Barnes 300g TSX that I left with my PH following this year's hunt. That is a lot of ammo since I barely used 9rds for each rifle this year. 18 total for the trip. 10 used on game and 8 used at the sight-in range since one scope was a bit off following the flight over. Better to have too much than not. For 2025:

30-06 w/Scirocco is for general PG use, meaning almost everything.
30-06 w/TTSX is to try them on something. Not sure which yet.

375 with A-Frame/Woodleigh Hydro for Buff
375 with Barnes TSX for larger PG
All the chosen loads shoot to the same POI in my rifles at the ranges it will be use on.

 

[CBH Australia]

I agree on the thoughts of using a suitable bullet, and there are many suitable options.

I used a hire rifle with the supplied hand loads. The PH loaned his personal rifle with Hornady SST projectiles.

I bagged out, the guiding PH was happy with the results of the hunt and no animals were lost. No animals required any lengthy tracking.

I agree with using Quality bullets suited to the game you are hunting. Something that has proven performance on game.

As a hand loader and keen shooter I have tried heaps of brands for accuracy and performance.

I have shot a heap of Pigs with PPU.

If I hunt Africa again I would probably take a rifle and probably use hand loads.

The target species would sway my decision on the calibre and rifle. The calibre would sway my decision on the projectiles and it could be one of a few Aussie made mono’s or Woodleigh PPSP for plains game.

My current options include several 7mm cartridges, two 30 cals and a .375 H&H. All can be used on plains game but my projectile preference would change depending on the species.

Plains game can be from
The tiny ten through to eland. You would not use a Premium soft point on the tiny ten from 7mm but I would use a Premium 7mm mono on the larger species.

My Highland (PPU) ammo in .300wm would take all of the large species and my .375H&H PPU ammo would do the same.

I could load Premium monos in the .375H&H and probably take Buffalo and down to Duiker but it’s probably going to punch through Impala sized species requiring tracking.

I get great accuracy from Hammer Hunter projectiles in my .308. I have dropped pigs and drilled through Fallow with the same round. I think they failed to expand in that situation. Recovered animals showed fatal wounds with complete pass through.

 

[coreydb]

Research the different bullets, their purpose and designs, and determine what you like the most based on the animal(s) you intend to hunt. Most PG are taken 250 yds and less, so based on that distance the bullet selection will be based on your personal desire or expectations. Every bullet manufacturer makes bullets similar to their competition and all are good, so in a way, bullet selection is a target rich environment.

 

[375Fox]

I agree on the thoughts of using a suitable bullet, and there are many suitable options.

I used a hire rifle with the supplied hand loads. The PH loaned his personal rifle with Hornady SST projectiles.

I bagged out, the guiding PH was happy with the results of the hunt and no animals were lost. No animals required any lengthy tracking.

I agree with using Quality bullets suited to the game you are hunting. Something that has proven performance on game.

As a hand loader and keen shooter I have tried heaps of brands for accuracy and performance.

I have shot a heap of Pigs with PPU.

If I hunt Africa again I would probably take a rifle and probably use hand loads.

The target species would sway my decision on the calibre and rifle. The calibre would sway my decision on the projectiles and it could be one of a few Aussie made mono’s or Woodleigh PPSP for plains game.

My current options include several 7mm cartridges, two 30 cals and a .375 H&H. All can be used on plains game but my projectile preference would change depending on the species.

Plains game can be from
The tiny ten through to eland. You would not use a Premium soft point on the tiny ten from 7mm but I would use a Premium 7mm mono on the larger species.

My Highland (PPU) ammo in .300wm would take all of the large species and my .375H&H PPU ammo would do the same.

I could load Premium monos in the .375H&H and probably take Buffalo and down to Duiker but it’s probably going to punch through Impala sized species requiring tracking.

I get great accuracy from Hammer Hunter projectiles in my .308. I have dropped pigs and drilled through Fallow with the same round. I think they failed to expand in that situation. Recovered animals showed fatal wounds with complete pass through.

I have had to track duiker 50-100 yards after getting shot by 375 with Barnes and swift bullets. I’ve done more tracking for them post shot than any other species I’ve hunted in Africa. However, I’d choose to track a duiker 100 yards after a shot than track a kudu for a mile to put in finishing shots. I generally don’t see the option to load for a specific species. You go out hunting with a bullet that’s suitable for anything you might encounter that day.

 

[NIGHTHAWK]

I have had to track duiker 50-100 yards after getting shot by 375 with Barnes and swift bullets. I’ve done more tracking for them post shot than any other species I’ve hunted in Africa. However, I’d choose to track a duiker 100 yards after a shot than track a kudu for a mile to put in finishing shots. I generally don’t see the option to load for a specific species. You go out hunting with a bullet that’s suitable for anything you might encounter that day.

I agree. 1 bullet loaded the same per Caliber. The only difference for me would be Barnes TSX or TTSX. TSX in my 7MM REM MAG & .375H&H. Bullet weight is primarily 300 Grain for .375H&H. I do have 350 Grain TSX loaded, but 300 Grains work great on most everything up to Hippo for me. 243 uses TTSX and I’ve killed up to Roan with them in 80 Grain.

Once I’ve shot and validated my groups are good where I will be hunting, then all I need to concern myself with is making a good shot. Not ammo and bullet selections.

To each their own..

 

[CBH Australia]

I have had to track duiker 50-100 yards after getting shot by 375 with Barnes and swift bullets. I’ve done more tracking for them post shot than any other species I’ve hunted in Africa. However, I’d choose to track a duiker 100 yards after a shot than track a kudu for a mile to put in finishing shots. I generally don’t see the option to load for a specific species. You go out hunting with a bullet that’s suitable for anything you might encounter that day.

Thank you, that reaffirms the second last paragraph of my post.

 

[Philip Glass]

I took a springbok, gemsbok, jackal, kudu, blue wildebeest, eland, blesbuck, and baboon with my 300 prc and was very happy with the on game performance of my 208 gr LRX.

Highly recommend it for those of you searching for a deep penetrating bullet for your 300 PRC. I recovered some on the offside on the kudu (broken offside humerus) and eland (just under the skin), some from frontal shots on a blue wildebeest down in the pelvis, and a finishing shot on the gemsbok that passed through and hit the ground. The round on the right hit a tree branch, hit the neck of my impala and was found just inside the thoracic cavity.

View attachment 639190

Very interesting. Thanks for sharing these results.

 

[NIGHTHAWK]

I took a springbok, gemsbok, jackal, kudu, blue wildebeest, eland, blesbuck, and baboon with my 300 prc and was very happy with the on game performance of my 208 gr LRX.

Highly recommend it for those of you searching for a deep penetrating bullet for your 300 PRC. I recovered some on the offside on the kudu (broken offside humerus) and eland (just under the skin), some from frontal shots on a blue wildebeest down in the pelvis, and a finishing shot on the gemsbok that passed through and hit the ground. The round on the right hit a tree branch, hit the neck of my impala and was found just inside the thoracic cavity.

View attachment 639190

I have these 308 LRX in 208 grain. I haven’t loaded any yet. They require a twist rate of 1:8.5 or faster. I’m eager to try them in my 300 RUM. I believe my RUM is 1:9. I need to double check…

Glad you like them! How far have you shot them? Either at a target or an animal?

 

[Field28]

When I was hunting Eastern Cape in May, there was an older fellow in camp that decided to shoot an Eland. In the Boma that night a group of younger guys that had been singing the praises of the latest and greatest calibers and bullets asked him what he shot it with.

His reply, 270.

Their next question, wow what kind of bullet?

Remington Core Lokt.

I personally like Nosler Partitions though!

 

[CBH Australia]

When I was hunting Eastern Cape in May, there was an older fellow in camp that decided to shoot an Eland. In the Boma that night a group of younger guys that had been singing the praises of the latest and greatest calibers and bullets asked him what he shot it with.

His reply, 270.

Their next question, wow what kind of bullet?

Remington Core Lokt.

I personally like Nosler Partitions though!

That’s great. It’s interesting because cup and core have been doing it well for years.

I was introduced to an older hunter many years ago and offered to see his collection of trophies.

I believe it was about 52 trophies taken over 26 trips.

I couldn’t name all the species then and could not remember them now.

I do remember he said he used a .270 and a 338wm and he wasn’t interested in the big cats.
The other thing I remember was I thought the Warthogs were cool.

 

[FlyGuy]

Premium bullets are like tow ropes and jumper cables.
Better to have it, than not.

 

[SStomcat]

So far the Interlocks have dropped everything that I have taken in NA. I’m not debating whether the premium line of bullets are superior, but against PG are they absolutely needed like DG

 

[Doug Hamilton]

So far the Interlocks have dropped everything that I have taken in NA. I’m not debating whether the premium line of bullets are superior, but against PG are they absolutely needed like DG

Absolutely needed? No, but there are a few good reasons to use them. They are more likely to exit and leave a bigger hole for more blood to trail. They are more likely to penetrate deeply and reach vitals that a more frangible bullet won't. I've had basic cup and core bullets come apart on small blacktail bucks. Now I only use bonded bullets here and Africa. AccuBonds have worked every time on mule deer, blacktail deer, black bear, moose, and a bunch of PG. I can see no reason to go back to conventional bullets just because I killed a bunch of animals with them before I upgraded.

On my first safari I used Partitions. Those are what was recommended to me at the time. They worked fine as well. Remember, African animals tend to be bigger and tougher than most NA animals. Their vitals are also further forward and a good hit usually means shooting through heavy shoulder bones.

 

[StevenQ718]

I took a springbok, gemsbok, jackal, kudu, blue wildebeest, eland, blesbuck, and baboon with my 300 prc and was very happy with the on game performance of my 208 gr LRX.

Highly recommend it for those of you searching for a deep penetrating bullet for your 300 PRC. I recovered some on the offside on the kudu (broken offside humerus) and eland (just under the skin), some from frontal shots on a blue wildebeest down in the pelvis, and a finishing shot on the gemsbok that passed through and hit the ground. The round on the right hit a tree branch, hit the neck of my impala and was found just inside the thoracic cavity.

View attachment 639190

Hi! How did 208gr LRX perform on big plains game like gemsbok, zebra and eland? One shot kills?

 

[375Ruger416]

I have these 308 LRX in 208 grain. I haven’t loaded any yet. They require a twist rate of 1:8.5 or faster. I’m eager to try them in my 300 RUM. I believe my RUM is 1:9. I need to double check…

Glad you like them! How far have you shot them? Either at a target or an animal?

View attachment 640159

Good morning,

Most game animals were taken at 80-120 yds with the exception of the baboon which was at 270 yds.

I was consistently getting hits on vital size steel off a bipod out to 500 m and standing off my tripod to 400 m. 5 rd groups at 100 m were about 1” from the prone.

 

[375Ruger416]

Hi! How did 208gr LRX perform on big plains game like gemsbok, zebra and eland? One shot kills?

Muzzle velocity at home was 2876 fps; likely slightly faster with the suppressor I use - maybe 20-30 fps. At 80-120 yds, penetration and expansion was excellent. In fact, they expanded and deformed, in some cases losing petals more than I expected.

I kept shooting as long as the animal was on its feet or until the PH told me to stop. Gemsbok - 1st shot through lungs, 2nd shot through L pelvis as he was running away. He was down in about 50 yds but needed a finishing shot. That is the severely deformed bullet on the L which passed through and struck the ground. I watched the skinning and the lungs were severely contused - they had been struck right through the middle of both.

The blue wildebeest took a single frontal chest shot at about 100 yds and did not go far/died quickly. The kudu took one broadside shot through the shoulder at 120 yd (broke the offside humerus) and died quickly. The eland reacted as though hit hard to the broadside shot at about 120 yds. However, I kept firing until he was down at the instructions of my PH which we had discussed prior to the shot. The first shot passed completely through the vitals and was tenting the skin on the offside. He was hit hard and I don’t think he would have gone far but I placed two steeply quartering away shots on his L side one penetrated into the vitals and the other into the rumen.

The blesbok died to a single shot through the vitals.

The expansion and exit wound on the baboon was impressive - taking him under the R nipple and exiting his back on the L.

My impression is that these LRX bullets do in fact expand more rapidly than the TSX; at least in my limited experience.

 

[NIGHTHAWK]

Good morning,

Most game animals were taken at 80-120 yds with the exception of the baboon which was at 270 yds.

I was consistently getting hits on vital size steel off a bipod out to 500 m and standing off my tripod to 400 m. 5 rd groups at 100 m were about 1” from the prone.

Good to know. Thank you!

The RUM is coming out for a warm up prior to Sonora…