PHASA Captive Bred Lion Hunting

[IvW]

WOW!

I have never met Hank in person, but we have gone back and forth on threads enough over the past five years that I think we respect each other, I know I respect him, and I think he understands the sarcasm and humor in the post that you reference. The post reflects US politics and policies over the past 70 years in a way that most people on this forum would easily understand. It doesn't reflect my opinion at all, it is hyperbole for America's actions in our lifetimes.

America did a pretty good job of staying out of world affairs until WWII. We even let the war go on for two years until we were sucker punched. If I recall my 8th grade history correctly, it was Germany and Italy that declared war on us after the Japanese attack, not the other way around. Since WWII, things have been completely different. We rebuilt Europe and Japan. Europe wanted our protection for another 45 years as the cold war went on. They evidently still do since only a couple of NATO countries are paying the required 2% while we cover them paying 4% of GDP. Africa and Asia wanted a handout after colonialism. We gave it freely.

Since WWII, America has acted as the worlds policeman, effectively hacking everyone in the world off. Non American's understand this. Most American's understand this and don't care for it. By acting as the worlds policeman, we have run up a national debt equal to $60,000 plus for each man, woman and child in America. American's are getting tired of this, leading to a revolt at the polls on November 8 of last year. American's are getting tired of being thought of as "the ugly American".

After my post #66, just to make sure people understood it was a joke, I made post #67. After post #67, I didn't see how anybody would not understand it as a joke in response to Hank.

If Hank is offended, then I apologize to Hank and I will ask Wayne or Jerome to remove the offending post.

I am an American! I am making fun of America! If you can't understand that, then you need more joy and fun in your life.

All the best.

I read post your post #66 and was highly offended by it and typed my response, which took longer than the 5 minutes it took you to post your next post #67. I then posted my reply before seeing your next post.

Irrespective, I am still offended by what you posted in your post as it comes across as belittling to me as an African and this on a public international forum.

We obviously do not share the same sense of humour.

All the best to you to.

 

[Wheels]

Having hunted in 5 African countries you should no better than making idiotic statements like this.

You may think you are very smart and of superior race, please remember each time you hunt here you have a two year old who is incapable of making fair decisions but is much more capable than yourself to keep you in one piece so you can get safely back to your mother America.

You despise me with this post.

I see you edited and updated your post since I originally saw it and quoted it. Let me respond to a couple of your new points.

You state that since I have hunted in 5 African countries, I shouldn't make idiotic statements. I see that you too have hunted in 5 African countries. Interesting comment about idiotic statements.

You state "you think you are very smart and of a superior race" . What race am I? Am I a mixed race? Do you even know or are you assuming?

If you knew that my family left Tanzania in 1970, that some of my parents assets were nationalized during Ujamaa or flat out stolen, that I lost many of my childhood friends to AIDS, that I have a farm in Tanzania now, that I have friends in Tanzania, that I spend time their regularly, would you still say the things you say?

In no way do I claim to know more about Africa, or South Africa than you do, or anyone else here on this forum.

Please don't get so uptight. I hope you can smile, laugh and have a good day.

 

[SafariA]

Phasa has no Business with any Breeders Lions or otherwise.

The Resolution taken supports Ranch Lion Hunts with conditions as stipulated . This is currently only 10 approved SAPA facilities.

On the other hand should those facilities need to replenish Lions they may only do so from SAPA members with accreditted breeding facilities. Their members is about 48 % of the total Lion Breeders or Lion Hunting Properties.

So what it boils down to is regulated Ranch Lion Hunts with min 30 day release or more should client request that.

I hope this helps !

 

[IdaRam]

@Wheels
I chuckled all the way through your post. Then I laugheed my ass off at your next post. I knew you were poking fun at all of us “we know best”americans. Yourself included. It was sad, funny and ironic. Most of us got it and were nor offended at all. I enjoy your wit and humor and I respect your candor and honesty.
@IvW , I just don’t understand why you are offended. He was making fun of US, not belittling you or anyone else.

 

[Hunting Sailor]

Phasa has no Business with any Breeders Lions or otherwise.

The Resolution taken supports Ranch Lion Hunts with conditions as stipulated . This is currently only 10 approved SAPA facilities.

On the other hand should those facilities need to replenish Lions they may only do so from SAPA members with accreditted breeding facilities. Their members is about 48 % of the total Lion Breeders or Lion Hunting Properties.

So what it boils down to is regulated Ranch Lion Hunts with min 30 day release or more should client request that.

I hope this helps !

Oh, it sure does. Thanks for being the bringer of info.

//Gus

 

[Royal27]

Phasa has no Business with any Breeders Lions or otherwise.

The Resolution taken supports Ranch Lion Hunts with conditions as stipulated . This is currently only 10 approved SAPA facilities.

On the other hand should those facilities need to replenish Lions they may only do so from SAPA members with accreditted breeding facilities. Their members is about 48 % of the total Lion Breeders or Lion Hunting Properties.

So what it boils down to is regulated Ranch Lion Hunts with min 30 day release or more should client request that.

I hope this helps !

@SafariA ,

I'm still admittedly confused on the "ranch" piece of this.... The definition of ranched Lions from the PHASA Proposal is:

"Lions that are managed for sustainable utilization purposes. "

If the ranch has to be constantly replenished from a breeding facility is it truly a sustainable utilization purpose? I'm not taking either side here, but as laid out "ranched lion" still seems like a marketing term more than anything else.

Am I missing something?

 

[LivingTheDream]

@Royal27 "Ranch" tested through the roof of least offensive hunting phrases.

 

[Hank2211]

WOW!

I have never met Hank in person, but we have gone back and forth on threads enough over the past five years that I think we respect each other, I know I respect him, and I think he understands the sarcasm and humor in the post that you reference. The post reflects US politics and policies over the past 70 years in a way that most people on this forum would easily understand. It doesn't reflect my opinion at all, it is hyperbole for America's actions in our lifetimes.

America did a pretty good job of staying out of world affairs until WWII. We even let the war go on for two years until we were sucker punched. If I recall my 8th grade history correctly, it was Germany and Italy that declared war on us after the Japanese attack, not the other way around. Since WWII, things have been completely different. We rebuilt Europe and Japan. Europe wanted our protection for another 45 years as the cold war went on. They evidently still do since only a couple of NATO countries are paying the required 2% while we cover them paying 4% of GDP. Africa and Asia wanted a handout after colonialism. We gave it freely.

Since WWII, America has acted as the worlds policeman, effectively hacking everyone in the world off. Non American's understand this. Most American's understand this and don't care for it. By acting as the worlds policeman, we have run up a national debt equal to $60,000 plus for each man, woman and child in America. American's are getting tired of this, leading to a revolt at the polls on November 8 of last year. American's are getting tired of being thought of as "the ugly American".

After my post #66, just to make sure people understood it was a joke, I made post #67. After post #67, I didn't see how anybody would not understand it as a joke in response to Hank.

If Hank is offended, then I apologize to Hank and I will ask Wayne or Jerome to remove the offending post.

I am an American! I am making fun of America! If you can't understand that, then you need more joy and fun in your life.

All the best.

Wheels, let's be clear about one damn thing.

I found your post so funny, I howled out loud! It did take a shot at someone - Americans. I have no idea how anyone could not have seen what you intended, so please, keep posting. Don't change a thing.

I am prepared to accept that for people whose first language may not be English may have a more difficult time with our humour - it's a truism that humour tends to be cultural, and does not always travel well.

I would ask those who were offended to realize that the post was intended to be humourous, that it actually was humorous, and the only people it was poking fun at were Americans.

 

[Hank2211]

Hank, the problem is the CBL will not survive in the wild ....... It will be vulnerable to wild lions.....Were not talking about the 3 Amigod....

I get that, but the point was that captive bred lions won't hurt wild populations, and may in fact one day be useful in repopulating wild areas, if that need were ever to arise. Sort of how many zoos justify their existences these days.

 

[robertq]

I get that, but the point was that captive bred lions won't hurt wild populations, and may in fact one day be useful in repopulating wild areas, if that need were ever to arise. Sort of how many zoos justify their existences these days.

Hank I don't know about that....

I get that, but the point was that captive bred lions won't hurt wild populations, and may in fact one day be useful in repopulating wild areas, if that need were ever to arise. Sort of how many zoos justify their existences these days.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/07/120731135010.htm

 

[Royal27]

Hank I don't know about that....

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/07/120731135010.htm

Interesting read.

 

[wesheltonj]

Hand feed, pet lions are not designed to be released into the wild no matter what the operator of the petting zoo says. That's like saying, Fairchild the pet bear from the Beverly Hillbilly being release back into the wild after the show was over. Too much human imprinting.

 

[robertq]

 

[billc]

Lets see pigs , goats and even cattle have gone wild over time an live on there own with no human help. But the lion could not because someone writes a paper.

They may not help the wild population now but there is no way anyone knows if they could in the future. They may not be needed now but one day one never knows. I think it has been proven more then once animals raised have brought back numbers and a few can be HUNTED in texas now even if it is behind fence. I look at that as better then nothing in my book.

 

[robertq]

I have a passion for the lion..... I would love to have one for a pet.... but I know it's tabu.

 

[robertq]

Lets see pigs , goats and even cattle have gone wild over time an live on there own with no human help. But the lion could not because someone writes a paper.

They may not help the wild population now but there is no way anyone knows if they could in the future. They may not be needed now but one day one never knows. I think it has been proven more then once animals raised have brought back numbers and a few can be HUNTED in texas now even if it is behind fence. I look at that as better then nothing in my book.

READ #90.....

 

[billc]

READ #90.....

I did and that is my point one person or one paper does not mean it is right. Any animal and I mean any animal will go back to being wild over time. Many of dogs have gone feral and are natural killers and I am sure they have been breed overtime more then lions to be people friendly.


Here is one of the pet lions that after the shot came charging my son and I am sure it was not to give him a hug or get a bottle.

 

[robertq]

Pigs, goats, and cattle are not PREDATORS.... if you release a CBL in the wild it will be killed by wild lions.

 

[billc]

Pigs, goats, and cattle are not PREDATORS.... if you release a CBL in the wild it will be killed by wild lions.

I agree with you but what about areas were wild lions have been killed off or worse yet when all the wild lions are poached out. Would you rather have a chance to bring them back with raised lions or just let them not be around.


I am not saying there is a direct need for them now to help wild lion areas. I also don't think they are hurting wild lions at all by being raised like any other animal.

 

[Royal27]

Lets see pigs , goats and even cattle have gone wild over time an live on there own with no human help. But the lion could not because someone writes a paper.

They may not help the wild population now but there is no way anyone knows if they could in the future. They may not be needed now but one day one never knows. I think it has been proven more then once animals raised have brought back numbers and a few can be HUNTED in texas now even if it is behind fence. I look at that as better then nothing in my book.

The point of the article wasn't that they couldn't turn wild, but rather that they weren't needed as wild lions are both available for translocation and that wild lions adapt more quickly and are more disease resistant etc because they are, well, wild.

And the "just in case" argument is a weak one as long as zoos are around. There are plenty of lions without SA CBL hunting, even from a genetic diversity standpoint.