How will the looting in Durban impact SA hunting?

[Philip Glass]

We're wheels up in 2 days as well... headed to NW province..

I've been talking to former SADF SOF guys I know as well as some former SAPS Flying Squad guys.. in addition to our PH/Outfitter.. Things are certainly not great in the country.. but for now Im not seeing any reason to not travel to SA.. The airport area seems to be secure.. the major highways in and out of Joberg seem to be secure.. and there are no reports of violence or problems that I am aware of in the provinces most commonly visited by international hunters..

Thanks for the update. I’m wheels up in a week with a group of newbies some of whom are nervous.

 

[mdwest]

Thanks for the update. I’m wheels up in a week with a group of newbies some of whom are nervous.

Yep... My party include myself and my wife, who have done a considerable amount of international hunting and have made several trips to South Africa specifically... but also includes 4 people that have never visited SA before..

Two of those people are former Marine senior NCO's with multiple combat tours though.. and the remaining two are their family members... they arent really nervous so much as they are asking questions and wanting to know what to expect, what to be prepared for, etc..

 

[chashardy]

I am just back from two weeks in South Africa. Spent a night at an airport hotel waiting for my United flight JNB to Newark. The news reports indicated that the rioting and looting were pretty localized to outlying areas and KWZ Gauteng. Our group drove from JNB to Kruger on June 29 and from there to to the hunting camp near Lephalale in Limpopo province with no problems or issues.
From an American perspective, it was sorta like living in Dallas and seeing news accounts of rioting and looting in Portland or Chicago. Serious but not affecting you unless you live in those areas.

 

[Nyati]

This is a map showing the hotspots in the JHB area at the moment. I have highlighted the airport.
I would travel no problem.



View attachment 412531

Even in Sandton, I had the impression it would be safe

 

[Nkawu]

My neighbourhood just north of Durban has now set up a well oiled militia and we are defending key access points and infrastructure around the clock. Our major issues are now fuel and food which are unavailable. We have drones scouting from the air, emergency communication networks, and support staff assisting people on patrol. We check number plates of vehicles coming in on the national data base and turn away anyone remotely suspicious. We have had multiple attempted incursions and as I type this there is a call for armed assistance to repel people infiltrating our borders.

 

[WilhelmM]

Even in Sandton, I had the impression it would be safe

The graphic your seeing shows unrest in Alexandra, which is close to Sandton. Sandton hasn't been hit.

 

[Dewald]

KwaZulu Natal is gone. My town, Empangeni has been plundered to the ground. Fuel stations, shops, malls all destroyed and burnt down. The gunshop in town was plundered, thank God they did not breach the gunsafe. We’ve been supporting the police and private security shooting live ammo for the last two days. I attend to patients in the ER carrying a Glock 19 and a shotgun and we have shot looters holding the hospital premises. We managed to get oxygen under armed escort to the private hospital today, that will last for another four to five days with the current COVID requirements of 800-1000kg used daily. It will not be possible for the Natal economy to recover from this.

 

[WilhelmM]

KwaZulu Natal is gone. My town, Empangeni has been plundered to the ground. Fuel stations, shops, malls all destroyed and burnt down. The gunshop in town was plundered, thank God they did not breach the gunsafe. We’ve been supporting the police and private security shooting live ammo for the last two days. I attend to patients in the ER carrying a Glock 19 and a shotgun and we have shot looters holding the hospital premises. We managed to get oxygen under armed escort to the private hospital today, that will last for another four to five days with the current COVID requirements of 800-1000kg used daily. It will not be possible for the Natal economy to recover from this.

Oh, it will definitely recover, just not from the government's coffers but from the people inciting the violence. These have been some of the tensest yet promising events that have happened in South Africa in years. What I mean by promising is that the people supporting said violence have shown their faces and we know who they are. Their gamble failed and they'll pay the price.

 

[flatwater bill]

I truly hope that they will "pay the price" Wilhelm......but that has rarely happened in RSA. On a more global scale, the push toward lawlessness....the defund the police, riots in the USA always cheered on by the democrats...never condemned ("where does it say that protests have to be peaceful?") are a push to change social order. Destroy what exists. Sounds like RSA is about there. Here in the USA rioters in Portland, Seattle, autonomous zones (land stolen from the USA) was never punished for more than a night in jail. 100's of millions of young med of color, uneducated, lazy, wanting something that they see only on TV and wanting it now. The continued drone of "This is all the fault of the White Male" has started to wear a little thin. Surely Blacks have SOME responsibility for the state they're in. Always given a free pass isn't working. Workers in OR Tambo have families. They need food. Fuel to get to work. It is unreasonable to think that all of these riots and infrastructure damage will not affect them, and travel...even in ways we can't yet predict.............so if you're traveling to, or in RSA stay wide awake, have a plan.....FWB

 

[WilhelmM]

I truly hope that they will "pay the price" Wilhelm......but that has rarely happened in RSA. On a more global scale, the push toward lawlessness....the defund the police, riots in the USA always cheered on by the democrats...never condemned ("where does it say that protests have to be peaceful?") are a push to change social order. Destroy what exists. Sounds like RSA is about there. Here in the USA rioters in Portland, Seattle, autonomous zones (land stolen from the USA) was never punished for more than a night in jail. 100's of millions of young med of color, uneducated, lazy, wanting something that they see only on TV and wanting it now. The continued drone of "This is all the fault of the White Male" has started to wear a little thin. Surely Blacks have SOME responsibility for the state they're in. Always given a free pass isn't working. Workers in OR Tambo have families. They need food. Fuel to get to work. It is unreasonable to think that all of these riots and infrastructure damage will not affect them, and travel...even in ways we can't yet predict.............so if you're traveling to, or in RSA stay wide awake, have a plan.....FWB

@flatwater bill , no disrespect meant, but what happened or is happening in the USA has no effect on what's happening here. These are two completely different scenarios.

 

[Jörg Krüger]

So I have heard via a Police friend that petrol bombing has just started in Kraaifontein in the Cape Town District

 

[jpr9954]

I have been reading of the rioting and unrest in South Africa since the arrest of former president Jacob Zuma on contempt of court charges.

From what I've read, Zuma's base of power was in KwaZuluNatal and he is ethnically a Zulu. I am not up on the different tribes in South Africa. Is the unrest due to inter-tribal fighting between the Zulus and other tribes or is it something else? I'm sure someone here can give me some perspective on that.

On another note, I was pleased to see the Indian community organizing to protect themselves and their property. I guess instead of talking about Rooftop Koreans in the future, we might be talking about Rooftop Indians.

 

[WilhelmM]

I have been reading of the rioting and unrest in South Africa since the arrest of former president Jacob Zuma on contempt of court charges.

From what I've read, Zuma's base of power was in KwaZuluNatal and he is ethnically a Zulu. I am not up on the different tribes in South Africa. Is the unrest due to inter-tribal fighting between the Zulus and other tribes or is it something else? I'm sure someone here can give me some perspective on that.

On another note, I was pleased to see the Indian community organizing to protect themselves and their property. I guess instead of talking about Rooftop Koreans in the future, we might be talking about Rooftop Indians.

Eh, sort of. It was originally thought to be that but the looters clearly didn't care about Zuma's imprisonment, they were purely opportunistic and didn't think about the repercussions they'd face. The Zulu king has decried the violence on TV and has called the mostly ethnic Zulu criminals to stop. Our American and European friends need to understand that there isn't a "white" or "black" racial category. Instead, there are categories based on the ethnicities themselves. To blame this as a white vs. black issue is totally naive and doesn't take into context the socio-economics in South Africa.

 

[flatwater bill]

Wilhelm....... The catalysts for riots vary from country to country, from one time to another. But the global Bolshevik war on modern society includes many battles. Everyone sees their country as unique......and surely no one else can understand it. Right? If the RSA economy collapses, and they cry out for help, let's see if the general liberal focus on socialism doesn't open up European and American coffers to help rebuild for the downtrodden. After all, we carry collective guilt. Look at reparations. Then you may first see how global attitudes have global effects. There are numerous interconnections, and while this isn't the best forum to delineate them, one thing is for sure; the world will not raise a whimper when white owned lands are re-distributed. Because there will be so many poor who have nothing. Best of luck with the problems that only South Africans can understand....(but that we will be asked to help pay for)........FWB

 

[WilhelmM]

Wilhelm....... The catalysts for riots vary from country to country, from one time to another. But the global Bolshevik war on modern society includes many battles. Everyone sees their country as unique......and surely no one else can understand it. Right? If the RSA economy collapses, and they cry out for help, let's see if the general liberal focus on socialism doesn't open up European and American coffers to help rebuild for the downtrodden. After all, we carry collective guilt. Look at reparations. Then you may first see how global attitudes have global effects. There are numerous interconnections, and while this isn't the best forum to delineate them, one thing is for sure; the world will not raise a whimper when white owned lands are re-distributed. Because there will be so many poor who have nothing. Best of luck with the problems that only South Africans can understand....(but that we will be asked to help pay for)........FWB

Bolshevism is dead, flatwater. Socialism and globalism may still exist but they're very different from what the world faced during the Cold War. The Bolshevism of the old days focussed on forcefully overthrowing democratic countries and setting up socialist dictatorships. China, for all its hypocritical authoritarianism, realizes that the only way to spread its ideology is through neo-colonialism. Why they'd want to overthrow our government and install a new one just so that they can invest in infrastructure is non-sensical, considering they could just invest as it is. Liberalism is also a very different ideology. Liberalism is an inherently capitalist, Western outlook only with a heavy stance on progressivism. You'd be amazed at how much fighting goes on between liberals and socialists on social media.

"(but that we will be asked to help pay for)" We're not asking for your help. No disrespect is targeted at you, but don't act elitist and smug.

 

[shark_za]

Things have quietened down in JHB a lot but KZN is still burning.
Hunting travel to KZN is the only thing I would avoid now, the rest of the country is fine.

 

[shark_za]

There seems to be two broad schools of thought about the looting, its origins & instigators:
1. Opportunist crime - hungry, desperate, jobless.
2. Economic sabotage - strategic, targeted.

They targeted and are targeting community radio stations, food and logistics distribution centers, shopping malls and food outlets.
Only in KZN and parts of JHB.
Slow and non existent police action.

All pointing to 2. A coup attempt from within the Government.

 

[Hogpatrol]

All pointing to 2. A coup attempt from within the Government.

Hmm. Military takeover?

 

[WilhelmM]

Hmm. Military takeover?

No chance. All the people you hear about being killed are the looters.

 

[shark_za]

First steps in a plan to destabilise before taking over power politically. Not the classic military coup.
The latest reports are this is co-ordinated by a group of agents and people in the government loyal to Zuma.