Good Gun Deals This Week

[IvW]

Can you direct me to where it says so?

Ask Krieghoff direct they will tell you in no uncertain terms and then ask Heym

 

[AES]

There is this H&H that has come up, not sure if it is a good deal or not. Looking for your feedback..

Holland and Holland Royal Double Rifle .470 NE

Holland and Holland Royal Double Rifle .470 NE for sale online.

www.gunsinternational.com

Worth les than half of the ask, at that point its worth what its worth to you. Gun is a beater.

As to other comments, 500/465 is the best, most elegant, most lovely historic caliber ever created. It is a pleasure and reward in every way. Particularly in an original (proprietary H&H). That is a totally biased opinion.

 

[SStomcat]

Krieghoff said:
Dear Sir;

Thank you for your inquiry. Generally speaking, yes, you can use solid copper bullets in our Classic Double Rifle. However, it is a hunting gun and not a match rifle and a large number of solid bullets shot through the gun will wear it quicker. We recommend using the soft bullets for target practice and the solid only for hunting.

I hope this helpful!

Thank you!
H&H, WR have the same thing

 

[krish]

Not just Krieghoff Even swift bullets said that mono solids are not good for barrels. Good idea to use solids for hunting only.
krish

 

[SkullKeeper]

I own a Krieghoff,what you heard is false,but however when it comes to solids for use in a double rifle there are certain rules to observe,I own several DR'S,the bullets that will hurt your gun is monolithic bullets,some mono's do not have rings cut into the shank,the displaced metal has no place to go,this creates a lot of barrel strain,a good example of which bullet to use is the North fork solid,you will see rings cut into the shank to relieve pressure on the barrels,this is just basic stuff,you can read what others have to say on this subject as well,but no the barrels on a Krieghoff are not soft & I have used mine with solids to hunt hunt Buffalo etc with no problems.

+1 on using North Fork, the solids are great bullets and are very easy on the barrels. I use them exclusively in my 1905 WR&Co 450#2.

 

[Kevin Peacocke]

I have been told solid copper with rings so there is somewhere for the metal to go is acceptable, but never brass. Personally I would never use monolithic solids of any sort in my double, why take any risk at all?

 

[SStomcat]

Ask Krieghoff direct they will tell you in no uncertain terms and then ask Heym

Response from Krieghoff is below. This applies for all DB even H&H and WR, Purdue, Heym is no exception

 

[bill73]

Krieghoff said:
Dear Sir;

Thank you for your inquiry. Generally speaking, yes, you can use solid copper bullets in our Classic Double Rifle. However, it is a hunting gun and not a match rifle and a large number of solid bullets shot through the gun will wear it quicker. We recommend using the soft bullets for target practice and the solid only for hunting.

I hope this helpful!

Thank you!
H&H, WR have the same thing

Good answer from Krieghoff,when getting ready for a hunt? I shoot a lot of softs,cheaper softs,I finish my practicing with softs & solids that are to be actually used for the hunt,it's more cost effective this way,it also gives me an opportunity to really get to know my guns,ask any smith & they will say that monos are to be avoided,however bullet technology has come a long way,solids & monos with the right designs are perfectly safe in any double rifle,I have shot plenty & will continue to do so,the North Fork bore riding designs are my favorite,450 gr in my .458 & 400 gr in my 416.I can see the warranty guys getting nervous if a newbie uses monos not designed with pressures in mind suitable for a DR.

 

[bill73]

Ask Krieghoff direct they will tell you in no uncertain terms and then ask Heym

No need to ask,I own both makes of rifles,I know both brands pretty well,you made a statement,you should back it up is all,no offense intended.

 

[IvW]

Well Krieghoff SA said no monometal solids brass not politely mentioning "copper" as above. I concider brass to be a proper solid not copper. Heym agent said you can use Brass solids. I spoke to both in SA and that was the answer. VC also said you can shoot what you like same as Heym

 

[IvW]

I asked specifically about meplat banded brass solids not copper as in my opinion and experience copper is too soft to be used as a solid on elephant

 

[SStomcat]

Good answer from Krieghoff,when getting ready for a hunt? I shoot a lot of softs,cheaper softs,I finish my practicing with softs & solids that are to be actually used for the hunt,it's more cost effective this way,it also gives me an opportunity to really get to know my guns,ask any smith & they will say that monos are to be avoided,however bullet technology has come a long way,solids & monos with the right designs are perfectly safe in any double rifle,I have shot plenty & will continue to do so,the North Fork bore riding designs are my favorite,450 gr in my .458 & 400 gr in my 416.I can see the warranty guys getting nervous if a newbie uses monos not designed with pressures in mind suitable for a DR.

Yes spot on, bullets have come a long way. I see the Barnes TSX solids have rings around them for expanding metal, designed that has evolved over the years. Secondly using the wrong bullets will hurt any DB even from the best of the best.

 

[bill73]

I asked specifically about meplat banded brass solids not copper as in my opinion and experience copper is too soft to be used as a solid on elephant

Thanks for your input,My experience has only been with copper solids,myself & a buddy shot two tuskless, his was a 500 NE mine was a 458 Lott, both DR’s,one head shot ,one shoulder,both down one shot each,I did put in a second shot on my downed ele to see penetration, one head shot top down from a couple of yards,saw a puff of dust on the opposite side on the ground,North Forks are all I will use,I was completely satisfied with the performance.

 

[IvW]

I did test some copper solids out if my 500 Jeff but found that they tend to bulge/expand in the front part where as brass meplat solids do not. There is a 200 to 250fps difference between my load and typical DR loads. A rhino is a lot harder in terms of body and skin. I shot a bull with a meplat brass solid 570gr @ just under 2350fps hitting the rhino quartering to where the neck meets the body through the vitals and the bullet exited on the front of the opposite back leg.....
Shot numerous elephant with the same combination and have not been able to recover a bullet yet.
Closest we got to recovering a bullet was on a pac 44lb bull elephant that was shot too high on a full frontal with a 375 H&H and my backup shot(necessary as we where only 400m from the river and if he crossed we could not follow up) to the brain as the bull was swinging away dropped him we could never find the exit or the bullet.
So I quess velocity will also have an impact on whether copper solids work or not but for me brass meplat solids have always performed the best.

 

[AES]

I have been told solid copper with rings so there is somewhere for the metal to go is acceptable, but never brass. Personally I would never use monolithic solids of any sort in my double, why take any risk at all?

Because worrying about tarnishing the inside of barrel of a double (its literally not even attached and completely replaceable) is (1) likely to not happen since you don't shoot it enough and (2) completely inconsequential compared to getting stomped by the jumbo for which you are practicing and the rifle was intended.

 

[SStomcat]

In a situation where a charge from a cape buffalo is eminent and you are in close quarters when do you ideally engage the safety in a Krieghoff? I ask as I have read that some gentlemen do it at the same time as they are bringing it up to the shoulder. I find it a little difficult doing both at the same time. I prefer to engage the safety (barrels pointing down) and right before shouldering the rifle. Any thoughts?

 

[bill73]

In a situation where a charge from a cape buffalo is eminent and you are in close quarters when do you ideally engage the safety in a Krieghoff? I ask as I have read that some gentlemen do it at the same time as they are bringing it up to the shoulder. I find it a little difficult doing both at the same time. I prefer to engage the safety (barrels pointing down) and right before shouldering the rifle. Any thoughts?

I was hunting cape buff cows with my K gun in South Africa,my safety was off long before she fake charged us from about 30 yards away,I had a big tree to hide behind,after the 3 rd time my ph & tracker took off screaming shoot it shoot it ha ha,so I did,the 500-416 did a fantastic job,I shot her in the heart & as she humped down? my second shot spined her ,she fell right there,
in a similar situation but hunting with a Heym instead in Zimbabwe,we surprised an old dugga boy in heavy bush,it took all of maybe 3 seconds to shove one guy to the left with my left hand,grab the forearm,remove the cover from my docter red dot sight,grab the pistol grip with my right hand,slip the safety off ,sight & shoot the gun,
so anything is possible,if you train enough with your weapon?your safety will be off when you shoot.

 

[SStomcat]

I was hunting cape buff cows with my K gun in South Africa,my safety was off long before she fake charged us from about 30 yards away,I had a big tree to hide behind,after the 3 rd time my ph & tracker took off screaming shoot it shoot it ha ha,so I did,the 500-416 did a fantastic job,I shot her in the heart & as she humped down? my second shot spined her ,she fell right there,
in a similar situation but hunting with a Heym instead in Zimbabwe,we surprised an old dugga boy in heavy bush,it took all of maybe 3 seconds to shove one guy to the left with my left hand,grab the forearm,remove the cover from my docter red dot sight,grab the pistol grip with my right hand,slip the safety off ,sight & shoot the gun,
so anything is possible,if you train enough with your weapon?your safety will be off when you shoot.

Wonderful, which caliber is your Heym and which one would you prefer for dangerous game and why?

 

[freefall]

Looks to me like it's a .500-.416.

 

[bill73]

Wonderful, which caliber is your Heym and which one would you prefer for dangerous game and why?

I have two Heym's,that day I was using the 470,my second one is a 450-400,I have hunted DG with a 470,458 Lott & 500-416,all three worked very well,I would hunt with any of these guns again,I load all three to about 5000ftlbs including the Lott,regardless of caliber? my preferred bullet is the North Fork FN solid,always great results,in one instance,I backed up a friend,he had put one shot from his 470 into a buff,PH shot as well a 458 win,two shots & buff was still standing,I joined the fray,one shoulder shot with the NF solid & buff on the ground,generally speaking,in my eyes I like a gun to be able to deliver 5000lbs of energy,but even more critical is your choice of bullet,I have not used my 450-400 on big game yet,but if I do? you can bet it will be loaded with NF solids.