Fixed Magazine vs Detachable Magazine

[steve white]

Nobody ever mentions floor plates opening and dumping the remaining cartridges--and that has happened under DG conditions, even during charges. Both systems have their merits. The crucial thing is that all bugs are worked out and everything works properly (apparently not the case with the Franchi mentioned above). Drill until flawless with either system, but perhaps--choose one or the other to limit user error by switching.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

Nobody ever mentions floor plates opening and dumping the remaining cartridges--and that has happened under DG conditions, even during charges. Both systems have their merits. The crucial thing is that all bugs are worked out and everything works properly (apparently not the case with the Franchi mentioned above). Drill until flawless with either system, but perhaps--choose one or the other to limit user error by switching.

The bottom metal I bought for my 404 from Swift-Blackburn has a floor plate latch that requires significant effort to trip. Yes, it is on the inside of the trigger guard but I think my trigger finger would suffer a compound fracture before the recoil could make it pop open the magazine.

 

[Marc Ret]

Fixed, my old Browning BLR the magazines were misplaced. If I wanted to buy they were $500 years ago. My old 760 REM Pump they are still available. But the BLR made me search for weeks. They were found.

$500 for a BLR magazine??

 

[steve white]

Anybody have a preference for reloading in a hurry--those that can be single fed from the top for instance?

 

[Forrest Halley]

I cannot personally understand the leaving behind or loss of a magazine. I couldn't care less about fixed or detachable, but that it is reliable in its feeding and unobtrusive. I understand the damage or disabling due to dirt and carry cleaning gear for that too. I'm rather deliberate with my gear when I go afield. I enjoy the packing and preparation. I usually take two guns if I am traveling any distance from the house and if there isn't air travel or weight restrictions involved I've got enough magazines and ammunition for the season at all times. I usually don't like to have a gun along with me without ammunition and a magazine. I have found that I am never entirely certain about when I will need to shoot a gun except that it will most definitely be when I have no ammunition. Case in point I took my .300 WM to be fitted for a suppressor with no ammunition. Gunsmith wanted to do a shooting demo of the suppressor and it was a minute to get some ammunition. Lesson learned.

 

[Alistair]

I have no issue with a removable mag, but one thing to be aware of with the Tikka.

It's single stack, so no top loading. That was my only complaint with my old M695.

It's a pita in the field to drop the mag and top off, especially if it's cold and you're wearing gloves. Even more especially if you make ready, the animal buggers off before you can shoot and you then have to eject and catch the unfired round, drop the mag, juggle round, rifle and mag whilst you close the bolt and slot the cartridge back into the mag, then mag into rifle.

With a double stack you can just ease the cartridge out the chamber till it snaps out of the extractor and prod it back into the mag when it's sitting loose in the action. Way, way easier.

Plus you only get 3 rounds if you want it to seat flush with the bottom of the stock with the Tikka. And it's plastic.

I would go (in order of preference):
Removable, flush fit double stack (all the advantages, plenty of flush fit capacity, none of the hassle)
Fixed floor plate
Flush fit single stack box.
Non flush fit single stack box.

That's why my preference is more Sako 85 than Tikka T3.

Just my opinion though.

 

[Sideshow]

$500 for a BLR magazine??

Sure the original ones made in Belgium would go for that.

 

[Rule 303]

I was brought up on the old SMLE, who's magazine was not meant to be removed during combat unless damage. I don't mind either system. What I don't like are single stack magazines, hold less rounds and normally you can not top feed them. The exception being the rotary mags however my experience with these is limited to a Browning X Bolt and this carries more than a standard single feed mag.

I have had internal mags with a floor plate fail due to the floor plate opening on firing.

As said, which ever you have got, get to know it well and practice. I leave removeable box magazines in the rifle at home and during transport.

 

[mark-hunter]

What I don't like are single stack magazines, hold less rounds and normally you can not top feed them. The exception being the rotary mags however my experience with these is limited to a Browning X Bolt and this carries more than a standard single feed mag.

I am in full agreement with you.
In my opinion, single stacks are modern industry shortcut, as they can be adjusted for wide range of cartridges in same production line. (cost cutting)

Shame is that some high-end guns utilize single stack mags. (for example sauer 404).
So for Tikka T3 single stack mag is acceptable because it is budget gun, but not Sauer 404.

Rotary mags, are tipical for Steyr SSG 69.
And older steyr hunting guns based on this design. I am not thrilled with them either. I have some experience with steyr ssg69, two seasons used in competitions on target, and one safari done with hunting steyr in 375 HH,of same magazine design.

Steyr rotaries - they affect two things.

Plastics, high volume target shooters in my community complain that plastic breaks. They change this with AI steel mags, there is backmarket for this. Trigger guard must be replaced with backmarket trigger guard to accept AI mags.

My 2nd expreience, I hunted during my first safari with rented older steyr, hunting rifle in 375 HH. Rotary mag, 3 round capacity
So, PH tells me, a year earlier they had to send it for service because stock cracked in position where the wood was thinned on the magazine well. The rifle served me well during first safari.

I came next year to same place to hunt, I wanted same rifle to rent.
Not possible.
Rifle was again on the service, for same issue. Stock cracked on same place, as I was told by PH.
So, it is not heavy duty stock, for this reason.

Sako 85 has good solution. Double stack mag, flush with stock, stainless steel. Can be topped from top. Very good option for all around rifle, in 30 cal.

For DG rifle, I would prefer mag with hinged floor plate, or fixed floor plate to avoid possibility of loosing the mag, in inconvenient moment. Or If i wanted to have light mountain rifle, the same, for same reason.

 

[Tucketed]

$500 for a BLR magazine??

Ok, relooked today used on eBay. Pre81 run $100 to $350. Back 10 years ago not many available. Still would make a darn it if misplaced.

 

[Philip Glass]

I’m looking for opinions Based on your experiences of using rifles with fixed magazines vs detachable magazines for hunting. I’m looking at adding a 300 Winchester to my hunting rifles. I Have hunted with fixed magazine rifles most of my life but recently (last 10 or 12 years) have started liking Tikka rifles. I have gone on several hunts and so far haven’t had any problems with the magazines. I always carry a spare magazine in my hunting vest in case I loose a magazine but so far that hasn’t happened.

I’m looking at Tikkas, Benelli Lupos, Franchi Momentems and Weatherby Vanguards in 300 Win and am leaning towards fixed magazines with the thoughts of “that’s just one thing less thing that could go wrong”. Thanks for your thoughts.

From a purely hunting perspective a fixed magazine is better. I love Tikka and highly recommend them. They are inexpensive, lightweight, and very accurate. Please take extra mags!

 

[Badboymelvin]

I'm on the fixed team.

Russ

 

[Hunt anything]

Anybody have a preference for reloading in a hurry--those that can be single fed from the top for instance?

Practice, practice, practice! As a right handed shooter I keep my extra ammo on my right hip so I don’t have to switch hands to grab ammo to top off the magazine. I used to spend 20-30 minutes a day blind folded so it has become second nature. This works for me.

 

[Nyati]

Fixed

 

[BeeMaa]

Fixed or detachable. I say both...and I'll do so with the same rifle.

The rifle in question is the Blaser R8. The magazine is part of what Blaser calls the trigger group. A button located just in front of the magazine insert will allow/restrict the trigger group (magazine) removal.

If it's in the forward position as the picture above shows, the trigger group can be removed for magazine loading or a complete change of it.

Sliding the button to the rear reveals a "S" and this means the trigger group can not be removed. In order to reload the rounds need to come from the top of the loading port.

Also on the Blaser R8 rifles, to remove the trigger group, there are tabs on both the left and right side of the trigger need to be depressed at the same time while pulling the trigger group out. Pushing just one of these will not result in it coming out, making this system even more foolproof.

So yes, I will definitely take the option of having both.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

Anybody have a preference for reloading in a hurry--those that can be single fed from the top for instance?

I prefer controlled feed with Mauser style extractor that "snaps over" cartridges dropped in the chamber. Best of both controlled and push feed worlds. Generally this design works flawlessly. However, I had to do a LOT of work on my Mauser 98 extractor to get it properly snapping over on 404 Jeffery rims. Turns out the extractor was simply too stiff. Should have figured it out when a screwdriver was necessary to pry it off. Finger pressure on the extractor spring should be enough to pop it off the bolt/retaining ring. I tuned the spring tension by bending it and that fixed the snap over issue.

I think it should be illegal to make a push feed rifle that doesn't have either a removable magazine or hinged floor plate. Especially if the design is only 2-position safety that requires the gun to be off safe while every cartridge is completely cycled to unload the gun. On that subject, this Mauser build is actually my first experience with 3-position safety. Love it! I'll order one for my Springfield too. Only ones out there for those guns are $500 US but I think it will be worth the money. Traditional low scope striker safeties (e.g. Buhler or Timney) are too vulnerable to being dislodged when I'm carrying the gun with scope removed (bad weather or very rough country). Safety is upright unprotected and gets caught on clothing,brush, etc.

 

[meigsbucks]

Prefer fixed. Never had an issue with either, although protruding mags can get in the way. Blind fixed mags you have to cycle all of the rounds thru to empty, which can be a pain.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

Prefer fixed. Never had an issue with either, although protruding mags can get in the way. Blind fixed mags you have to cycle all of the rounds thru to empty, which can be a pain.

Only push feed design fixed magazines require complete cycling of every round to unload. Controlled feed I need only push each round forward far enough for it to jump onto the bolt face under the extractor claw. Then pull the bolt back and eject. Closing the bolt all the way is not necessary to unload cartridges in the magazine. Hard to believe Paul Mauser came up with the design way back in 19th century. That guy was a genius. John Browning was second place in that race ... but it was a close run thing.

 

[Wyatt Smith]

I prefer controlled feed with Mauser style extractor that "snaps over" cartridges dropped in the chamber. Best of both controlled and push feed worlds. Generally this design works flawlessly. However, I had to do a LOT of work on my Mauser 98 extractor to get it properly snapping over on 404 Jeffery rims. Turns out the extractor was simply too stiff. Should have figured it out when a screwdriver was necessary to pry it off. Finger pressure on the extractor spring should be enough to pop it off the bolt/retaining ring. I tuned the spring tension by bending it and that fixed the snap over issue.

I think it should be illegal to make a push feed rifle that doesn't have either a removable magazine or hinged floor plate. Especially if the design is only 2-position safety that requires the gun to be off safe while every cartridge is completely cycled to unload the gun. On that subject, this Mauser build is actually my first experience with 3-position safety. Love it! I'll order one for my Springfield too. Only ones out there for those guns are $500 US but I think it will be worth the money. Traditional low scope striker safeties (e.g. Buhler or Timney) are too vulnerable to being dislodged when I'm carrying the gun with scope removed (bad weather or very rough country). Safety is upright unprotected and gets caught on clothing,brush, etc.

I have always failed to see how dropping a round in is quicker than snapping on in the mag, especially when half the time just dropping one on top jams up.
You can top off by pressing the las round just deep enough into the mag to get it under the extractor.

 

[cmk]

Fixed. Double stack. Hinged floorplate with the release button outside the trigger guard.