Crocodile Infestation Worry Chief Mpindi

[mark-hunter]

Sad to hear that.

 

[R.M.C.]

Sad to hear that.

+1

 

[Doug Hamilton]

Talking about animals overpopulation. Look at people population growth in Africa. Human population is what needs to be managed. Animals did a fairly good job managing their numbers until human populations exploded. I just turned my head and looked out on the Zambezi. I do not see any crocs, but I can see cattle on the beach and illegal fishermen in their mokoro's. Am I going to loose any sleep if one of the fishermen are taken, hell no. Will I help recover the body wrap it in a tarp and take it to the family home for burial? Yes, I do it several times a year. Death in Africa is much different than it is in most of the world. A death and burial (at least amongst our Tonga people) involves several ceremonies and then the deceased is not spoken of again.

Doug I do not blame you for your opinion, but you really have a lot to learn about Africa. Come to Africa and learn.

Lon

I have been to Africa, most recently in August. I do understand what you are saying. I don't know every culture on Africa. No one does, or could. All I have been saying is that if (that's IF) an animal is over abundant in a given area it is up to humans to manage that number. Most animals do not eat humans if other food is available, but crocs really don't care about whether the food is human or anything else if that is what presents itself. That's what my comment about people feeding themselves to crocodiles was about. But I was speaking in generalities, I do not know about the particular area in this case and never said that I did, but the politics around hunting, and animal "rights" goes on around the world, not just in Africa. Americans and Canadians seem to be the worst about blaming the victims. Not long ago, a girl was dragged out of her tent in a campground and killed by a grizzly. People were quick to say that people had "invaded" the bears territory. That kind of thing goes on here all the time. Some years ago, however, a white South African woman lectured me on why I should not be going to Africa to go hunting and we "should leave the animals alone." Apparently she did not know about the history of ranching and rebuilding of wildlife through hunting in her own country. I just get tired of it.
By the way, I did see a crocodile from A'Zambezi Lodge, and God knows how many in Chobe National Park during one morning on the water there. We also saw several along a mostly dry river that runs into the Limpopo in Zimbabwe. I never shot any, but I did get to know some of the camp staff, and would have been horrified if any of them had gotten chopped. I would have been happy to shoot any that did attack a human. Just because I don't live in Africa, doesn't mean I don't know anything about it.

 

[BRICKBURN]

....... All I have been saying is that if (that's IF) an animal is over abundant in a given area it is up to humans to manage that number. Most animals do not eat humans if other food is available, but crocs really don't care about whether the food is human or anything else if that is what presents itself. ........

You forget an essential factor in the wildlife management equation; Humans. With the ever expanding human population eating the Croc's out of house and home there is not enough food available for the critters. Consequence.....

Americans and Canadians seem to be the worst about blaming the victims. Not long ago, a girl was dragged out of her tent in a campground and killed by a grizzly. People were quick to say that people had "invaded" the bears territory.

Apples and Oranges.
Bears are restricted severely in North America. People have to venture into wild spaces to encounter a Grizzly around here. We eradicated them from any proximity to human habitation. Hence, the characterization of "invading" the bears space.
My good friend was mauled by a Grizzly Sow, he made certain that the authorities did not kill the "offending" bear. He admits the mistake(s) he made and did not blame the bear for almost killing him.
You walk into wild places expect to have to manage yourself properly or stay home.

........... but I did get to know some of the camp staff, and would have been horrified if any of them had gotten chopped....

I doubt anyone is interested in seeing someone they know get killed. Do you feel a lot of sympathy for the ignorant/stupid people being squished in Kruger when they crowd Elephants? I have none.

This Elephant paid with it's life because of a stupid tourist crowding it.

Just because I don't live in Africa, doesn't mean I don't know anything about it.

Most people with opinions, like your example of an ignorant South African women, have just enough knowledge to be dangerous.
A member of Parliament in the UK was recently provided the opportunity to "save" some (5) Elephants by transporting them to a new environment and pay for it. In reply, he back handly asked for some Ostriches too. A Namibian reserve proceeded to call that bluff and offered 20 Ostriches to sweeten the package. Shocking - the Member declined saving the Elephants and Ostriches.
He sure does "know" how to save Africa though with his continued efforts to propose laws with no basis in science.

 

[R.M.C.]

Wow, there's a lot more to this than some locals getting eaten by crocs, you guys have kinda swayed this retarded Americans opinion. I guess given the choice I'd rather have a truly wild Africa than the mass killing of anything that bites people like my ancestors did in the US. Thank you BRICKBURN and spike.t

 

[spike.t]

Wow, there's a lot more to this than some locals getting eaten by crocs, you guys have kinda swayed this retarded Americans opinion. I guess given the choice I'd rather have a truly wild Africa than the mass killing of anything that bites people like my ancestors did in the US. Thank you BRICKBURN and spike.t

Appreciate you actually listening and trying to understand....unlike some others....feel like one is headbutting a granite wall ....brick wouldn't be hard enough....

 

[spike.t]

have been to Africa, most recently in August.

OK so you have been to Africa....2 times?....possibly 3 ....we find it amazing how many people with 2 or 3 trips are suddenly experts .....but hey .....people have tried to explain how/why its a bit different here to you...but you don't appear interested in listening....as I said like beating our heads against a granite wall.....oh and I am waiting for my peta subscription that I am hoping you have bought for me.....need some expensive psper to wipe my ass with

 

[R.M.C.]

Appreciate you actually listening and trying to understand....unlike some others....feel like one is headbutting a granite wall ....brick wouldn't be hard enough....

It's really the danger that attracts people to places like Africa, stories of people being torn apart by totally unapologetic animals that have been doing it since the beginning of time. I say keep Africa wild. There aren't enough places like it.

 

[spike.t]

It's really the danger that attracts people to places like Africa, stories of people being torn apart by totally unapologetic animals that have been doing it since the beginning of time. I say keep Africa wild. There aren't enough places like it.

Unfortunately with the population mega explosion happening in most countries here, it will be not long till most is no longer Bush....I see it every time I drive to and from the ranch.....the Bush is being cleared at a really frightening rate.....as soon as a road ..especially a tar road is put in....all I can say is to me devastation follows pretty quickly....plenty others call it progress and development.....depressing when you look at the quality of some of the land and know crops can't be grown....but that won't bring the trees and Bush back....just end up with degraded land....these fktards like bill Gates etc should be concentrating their foundations money not on getting rid of malaria etc....but on spending shit loads on promoting and education on use of contraception.....at least that would be doing something positive for African countries.....vaccination of children is pretty good here and in other countries...so lot more kids are surving compared to the past....so hence the massive population explosion...Zambias population will double in the next 15 years..other countries are rising even faster....recipe for disaster

 

[R.M.C.]

Unfortunately with the population mega explosion happening in most countries here, it will be not long till most is no longer Bush....I see it every time I drive to and from the ranch.....the Bush is being cleared at a really frightening rate.....as soon as a road ..especially a tar road is put in....all I can say is to me devastation follows pretty quickly....plenty others call it progress and development.....depressing when you look at the quality of some of the land and know crops can't be grown....but that won't bring the trees and Bush back....just end up with degraded land....these fktards like bill Gates etc should be concentrating their foundations money not on getting rid of malaria etc....but on spending shit loads on promoting and education on use of contraception.....at least that would be doing something positive for African countries.....vaccination of children is pretty good here and in other countries...so lot more kids are surving compared to the past....so hence the massive population explosion...Zambias population will double in the next 15 years..other countries are rising even faster....recipe for disaster

Unfortunately I think you're right. And if Zambias population doubles in 15 years the shit will surely hit the fan.

 

[Doug Hamilton]

You forget an essential factor in the wildlife management equation; Humans. With the ever expanding human population eating the Croc's out of house and home there is not enough food available for the critters. Consequence.....


Apples and Oranges.
Bears are restricted severely in North America. People have to venture into wild spaces to encounter a Grizzly around here. We eradicated them from any proximity to human habitation. Hence, the characterization of "invading" the bears space.
My good friend was mauled by a Grizzly Sow, he made certain that the authorities did not kill the "offending" bear. He admits the mistake(s) he made and did not blame the bear for almost killing him.
You walk into wild places expect to have to manage yourself properly or stay home.


I doubt anyone is interested in seeing someone they know get killed. Do you feel a lot of sympathy for the ignorant/stupid people being squished in Kruger when they crowd Elephants? I have none.

This Elephant paid with it's life because of a stupid tourist crowding it.

Most people with opinions, like your example of an ignorant South African women, have just enough knowledge to be dangerous.
A member of Parliament in the UK was recently provided the opportunity to "save" some (5) Elephants by transporting them to a new environment and pay for it. In reply, he back handly asked for some Ostriches too. A Namibian reserve proceeded to call that bluff and offered 20 Ostriches to sweeten the package. Shocking - the Member declined saving the Elephants and Ostriches.
He sure does "know" how to save Africa though with his continued efforts to propose laws with no basis in science.

I actually agree with everything you just said.

 

[404Jeffry]

What a progressive wacko would rather have people die to keep numbers down among the human population that to have animals culled
We’re above them in the world order

 

[Doug Hamilton]

Unfortunately with the population mega explosion happening in most countries here, it will be not long till most is no longer Bush....I see it every time I drive to and from the ranch.....the Bush is being cleared at a really frightening rate.....as soon as a road ..especially a tar road is put in....all I can say is to me devastation follows pretty quickly....plenty others call it progress and development.....depressing when you look at the quality of some of the land and know crops can't be grown....but that won't bring the trees and Bush back....just end up with degraded land....these fktards like bill Gates etc should be concentrating their foundations money not on getting rid of malaria etc....but on spending shit loads on promoting and education on use of contraception.....at least that would be doing something positive for African countries.....vaccination of children is pretty good here and in other countries...so lot more kids are surving compared to the past....so hence the massive population explosion...Zambias population will double in the next 15 years..other countries are rising even faster....recipe for disaster

You.got that right, and I see it in more places than Africa as well.

 

[Doug Hamilton]

You forget an essential factor in the wildlife management equation; Humans. With the ever expanding human population eating the Croc's out of house and home there is not enough food available for the critters. Consequence.....


Apples and Oranges.
Bears are restricted severely in North America. People have to venture into wild spaces to encounter a Grizzly around here. We eradicated them from any proximity to human habitation. Hence, the characterization of "invading" the bears space.
My good friend was mauled by a Grizzly Sow, he made certain that the authorities did not kill the "offending" bear. He admits the mistake(s) he made and did not blame the bear for almost killing him.
You walk into wild places expect to have to manage yourself properly or stay home.


I doubt anyone is interested in seeing someone they know get killed. Do you feel a lot of sympathy for the ignorant/stupid people being squished in Kruger when they crowd Elephants? I have none.

This Elephant paid with it's life because of a stupid tourist crowding it.

Most people with opinions, like your example of an ignorant South African women, have just enough knowledge to be dangerous.
A member of Parliament in the UK was recently provided the opportunity to "save" some (5) Elephants by transporting them to a new environment and pay for it. In reply, he back handly asked for some Ostriches too. A Namibian reserve proceeded to call that bluff and offered 20 Ostriches to sweeten the package. Shocking - the Member declined saving the Elephants and Ostriches.
He sure does "know" how to save Africa though with his continued efforts to propose laws with no basis in science.

I have not forgotten that. I know human overpopulation is the biggest problem, all over the world. But we live in a man modified world and man eating (fill in the blank) will have to be dealt with IF there is an overpopulation of that species. If the chief's people are in fact being killed what is he supposed to do other than ask for help in thinning the number of crocs? I guess he could encourage people to kill every croc until they are all gone, but who wants that? I don't.

 

[Doug Hamilton]

OK so you have been to Africa....2 times?....possibly 3 ....we find it amazing how many people with 2 or 3 trips are suddenly experts .....but hey .....people have tried to explain how/why its a bit different here to you...but you don't appear interested in listening....as I said like beating our heads against a granite wall.....oh anda I am waiting for my peta subscription that I am hoping you have bought for me.....need some expensive psper to wipe my ass with

Many Africans are under the impression that their problems don't exist anywhere else in the world so nobody else can understand the issues. Not true, but hey, they refuse to listen and are incapable of understanding if they have never been out of Africa.

 

[Doug Hamilton]

Unfortunately with the population mega explosion happening in most countries here, it will be not long till most is no longer Bush....I see it every time I drive to and from the ranch.....the Bush is being cleared at a really frightening rate.....as soon as a road ..especially a tar road is put in....all I can say is to me devastation follows pretty quickly....plenty others call it progress and development.....depressing when you look at the quality of some of the land and know crops can't be grown....but that won't bring the trees and Bush back....just end up with degraded land....these fktards like bill Gates etc should be concentrating their foundations money not on getting rid of malaria etc....but on spending shit loads on promoting and education on use of contraception.....at least that would be doing something positive for African countries.....vaccination of children is pretty good here and in other countries...so lot more kids are surving compared to the past....so hence the massive population explosion...Zambias population will double in the next 15 years..other countries are rising even faster....recipe for disaster

That's the first thing you've written that actually makes since. I believe you are completely right, but what do we do in the meantime?

 

[PeteG]

Interesting

now this could be a genuine problem

Or …

It could be increased predation as a consequence of human migration into new areas

it could be as a consequence of increased human presence in general

it could be as a consequence of wildlife changes brought about by any numbers of factors- usually human in origin

It could be a desire for financial compensation

PS - I’m not aware of any “palaces” amongst most local cultures in Zambia

In fact - other than on Hollywood films, I never hear the expression used

Found it…
Just for you bud, saw this on the road back from Takeri Reserve today.