Acceptable accuracy in a rifle! What’s that mean??

[Doug Hamilton]

With all the variables we might expect in hunting, (weather, terrain, a partially-obscured animal, a less than ideal angle, available light, wind, distance, time), I’m not looking for a rifle that makes the task more difficult.

Who was it, Jack O'Connor maybe, that said, "Only accurate titles are interesting." If I can't get a rifle to shoot at about 1" with hunting loads at 100 yards it won't be going hunting with.me. Even my .458 does that and I can't think of anything that I would be shooting a .458 at that would be further out than that. Deer sized animals might be taken out to say 400 yards. Minute of pie plate just won't cut it.

 

[nomspc]

Who was it, Jack O'Connor maybe, that said, "Only accurate titles are interesting." If I can't get a rifle to shoot at about 1" with hunting loads at 100 yards it won't be going hunting with.me. Even my .458 does that and I can't think of anything that I would be shooting a .458 at that would be further out than that. Deer sized animals might be taken out to say 400 yards. Minute of pie plate just won't cut it.

Townsend Whelen.

 

[rookhawk]

Who was it, Jack O'Connor maybe, that said, "Only accurate titles are interesting." If I can't get a rifle to shoot at about 1" with hunting loads at 100 yards it won't be going hunting with.me. Even my .458 does that and I can't think of anything that I would be shooting a .458 at that would be further out than that. Deer sized animals might be taken out to say 400 yards. Minute of pie plate just won't cut it.

I think the quote was Colonel Townsend Whelen. But as a counterpoint, when he said it virtually no gun was very accurate due to horrible ammunition and his standard of excellence was probably sub-2 MOA. Some of those rifles from his day shooting modern factory ammunition are sub-MOA.

 

[CBeck]

Some good data here and the trend of modern manufacturing in rifles and a short read.

“As for factory rifles, let’s look at what’s changed. I went into my database and randomly selected six bolt-action rifles I tested in 2001. I simply picked them as they came up while I scrolled through the database with no effort to pick and choose. These were all tested to the NRA protocol of five, five-shot groups with each of three different ammo products. The average of 70 five-shot groups at 100 yards was 1.9 inches. Back then, this was considered acceptable accuracy. Today, we demand groups half that size. “

An Official Journal Of The NRA | How Accurate Are Today’s Rifles?

Here’s what you can realistically expect from your new rifle.

www.americanhunter.org

He continues on to give numbers for more recently made rifles….quite impressive improvements to say the least.

Of course he warns as I do, beware of the fabled internet sniper and his claims of accuracy.

 

[JG26Irish_2]

A lot of the older rifles may have struggled to shoot sub MOA mostly due to the relatively poor level of factory ammo and the bullets they used. Cup n Core were the norm and none were that great. Today, the quality of best in grade ammo for hunting is much much better, Even if only comparing to 30-40yrs ago. It was not that the rifles sucked, it was the ammo. I have many vintage and newer rifles that can shoot at or close to sub MOA when using high grade factory ammo today. Examples:

Vintage

• Springfield 03A3 - 30-06, 1942 Remington. This rifle is supremely accurate. No wonder Hathcock liked them.
• FN Browning Medallion Grade - 308, 1963 vintage. Is usually about 1moa.
• FN Browning Safari Grade - 375HH, 1969 vintage. Also about 1moa.
• Husqvarna - Swedish Mauser - 30-06 about 1970 vintage. This rifle is exceptional and shoots 1/2moa or better with almost any decent factory ammo. Has recorded 3 shot groups of 2.25" at 400y from bench.
• ER Shaw P14 Enfield - 375HH Custom safari rifle. Easily shoots sub 1/2moa with Barnes TSX ammo. Vintage unknown but is estimated to be 30+yrs old since they were still using Enfield actions and the quality was superb.

Modern

• Sako S20, 6mm/08 - Likely the most accurate centerfire rifle I own. Shoots all ammo well but Hornady Superformance ammo is great in this little rifle. Common to get sub 1" groups at 200y with it.
• Fierce Firearms CT Edge - 7mm Mag. Sleek, light, lives up to the 1/2moa guarantee.
• Fierce Firearms CT Edge - 7mm/08. Short, light, handy and also matches 1/2moa claim with 140g Barnes, 140g Fusion and 150g Swift ammo.
• Remington 700 - 223. I have two of these. The older of the two has recorded 1/4" group at 200y and <0.152" c-c at 100y with Nosler Partitions or V-max bullets with hand loads. The newer one is not quite that good using factory ammo. About 3/4moa most of the time.

 

[Doug Hamilton]

Townsend Whelen.

Whoever it was, I agree with him. Although I do like nice walnut too.

 

[WyoBull]

If I can’t get sub MOA out of my rifles, I don’t keep them. And for most of them, it needs to be one half MOA.
Why is that important to me? One reason… CONFIDENCE! If I know my rifle is dialed in tight then I know all I have to do is focus on breathing and squeezing the trigger when the time is right.
And that sure beats having a question in the back of your mind as to whether your rifle is shooting well enough to place a bullet where it needs to be.

 

[Rare Breed]

If i can hit somewhere on a 9" pieplate at 50 yards shooting offhand with iron sights more times than not and every time off sticks with a big game hunting rifle, that's acceptable accuracy to me and i will have total confidence for the type of hunting i do and i won't be thinking about it any more. I read in a hunting article the other day, "It used to be that 3-inch groups were considered acceptable in a hunting rifle..." They still are, for most applications. You will hit the kill zone. No improvement required when you are doing that.

To me I want my DRs to shoot within 2 inches at 50 yards and within 6 at 100 yards. Just me but I expect more from my bolt actions, 1 inch at 100 yards. The reality is if you are within 8 inches at 100 yards you should take your animal if on proper point of animal on shoulder or just behind

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

You have already received many good answers, but I will throw my two cents in as well.

Acceptable accuracy, of course is open to interpretation from the seller and what one man’s acceptable accuracy is may very well not be the same for another.

In the context of what I’m understanding you are asking, an older rifle typically, though not always, may not shoot as small group as what we consider acceptable today.

We live in a world now of tactical scopes and sniper rifles built for long range hunting and everyone believes a rifle is no good unless it shoots sub MOA groupings.

The reality is for many years 2 and 3 inch MOA was perfectly acceptable by stalking standards.

My grandfather likely never took a shot at an animal over 80 yards… What was acceptable to him is not the same as a modern long range hunter shooting at 600.

@CBeck
600 yds is a fair poke in anyone's language.
To me you are
Either a hunter
Or
A long range game gatherer
That's only my opinion and others are free to disagree but to me personally longer range shooting just ain't hunting.
I would rather sit around the campfire or go home than take a risky shot.
Bob

 

[Bandera]

Acceptable accuracy for me is a 1 inch group at 100 yards.