9.3X62 for Cape Buffalo?

[DuncanF]

Question to owners of the 9x3 x 62 caliber hunting rifle:
What is the smallest animal you have hunted with the 9.3 and what is your largest animal??
Do you use your 9.3 x 62 as a plains game hunting rifle?

Springbok and buffalo. These are not calibre limits they are my choice of game. I grew up shooting for the pot, I would not have made myself very popular shooting something that was too small. The buffalo was an opportunity that could not be refused! I cannot afford to shoot anything bigger!

I tend to use my 9,3 mainly in bosveld and boar in the UK/Europe.

If I am to go after pg specifically in open country then I will take either my 300WM or 375H&H. Here my choice will often be governed by how energetic I feel and how far I am going to walk! 375H&H can get heavy after a long walk on a hot day!

 

[samu]

Probably odd place to open this can of worms but why not just put more powder behind .375 instead of larger bore? .375 EnaBLER has KE of 10 kJ at muzzle. Too much for african hunters to handle?

Meanwhile I'm quite happy about my choise of 9.3x62. Light enough to practice regularly, big enough for anything I'm going to hunt in foreseeable future.

 

[DuncanF]

Probably odd place to open this can of worms but why not just put more powder behind .375 instead of larger bore? .375 EnaBLER has KE of 10 kJ at muzzle. Too much for african hunters to handle?

Meanwhile I'm quite happy about my choise of 9.3x62. Light enough to practice regularly, big enough for anything I'm going to hunt in foreseeable future.

If I am going to use a round producing that sort of energy then I would prefer to go for a larger caliber.

The 375Enabler I believe was designed for ELR shooting, not really suitable for DG?

As you said “a can of worms”!

 

[Red Leg]

Care to elaborate beyond your love of .375H&H?

My McMillian Heritage in .375H&H has a 24" barrel shooting .300 grain TSX at 2,520 (4,229 ft/lbs at the muzzle). My .458 B&M which I most likely will use for my buffalo hunt this August has an 18" barrel shooting 420 grain CEB raptor at 2,350 (5,149 ft/lbs). I'd submit that the .375H&H is more unwieldly while providing a lot less energy not to mention a 20% smaller hole starting off.

Sure. I have used it on my last two trips to Africa. Blaser R8 with aluminum action in the all wood sporter stock. Less than nine pounds all kitted up with scope and four rounds of ammunition. 25.5 inch standard barrel on the short Blaser action makes a very compact rifle while retaining a full length barrel. It'll put all four of those rounds whether 300 gr TSX, A-Frame, or Hydro into a thumbnail (ok a big thumbnail - but sub-moa) at 100 meters. I can pick the tick that I want to hit with it. And it has done it on everything from Suni to cape buffalo. It is the easiest travel rifle I own (I hate schlepping multiple rifles); has the finest trigger of any rifle in my gun room (and there are some very finely made triggers in there), and I am convinced delivers as fast an aimed second shot as one of my doubles - and three or four far faster (though I have never had the need). It is the perfect solution for me.

My only point being, I think too many new African hunters get fed some version of the line that a .375 is ok for buffalo, but something bigger is much better - almost always with an implied "if you can handle it." I think that is absolute BS. For me, the .375 is not only an adequate solution for a general game safari that includes buffalo - it is the ideal solution. Particularly in this rifle.

The .375 is an easy transition from deer rifle for an American or European hunter preparing for their first DG safari. And it is probably useful for them to know there are hunters who prefer it to a heavier option.

And I personally can not imagine owning a "rifle" with an 18 inch barrel of any caliber. I hope it works out for you.

 

[Tanks]

...

And I personally can not imagine owning a "rifle" with an 18 inch barrel of any caliber. I hope it works out for you.

It has worked pretty well for 100 or so guys that have the B&M family of wildcats. From plains game to all the way to elephants. The whole series of cartridges have been designed to be able to use shorter barreled rifles that perform while using standard length Win. model 70 actions with CRF. As mentioned above it provides about 20% more muzzle energy than a .375 H&H. BTW, the rifle with a wood stock is about 7.5 - 8lbs without a scope so very handy "to be lugging around".

You can find more info about the cartridge here:
https://www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/458-B-M.html

 

[Big5]

@Tanks - your above post (today 10:47am) attributes a quote to me that I did not make. The quote is as follows;
“... I personally think a client lugging around a stopping rifle on a buffalo hunt is not a very effective use of ones time and opportunity set...”

Not that I disagree with the quote but you really should be more careful when quoting others.

 

[Tanks]

...

Not that I disagree with the quote but you really should be more careful when quoting others.

Sorry. I think what happened is that I had actually wanted to quote the poster of that quote and had clicked on yours. Then I hit back and then clicked on his and I think the web software appended his quote to yours. Then when I deleted from the top to the actual sentence it was your handle that got left as it was the first one that got left. I was not aware of that.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

The 9.3x62 is more powerful than .35Whelen ... according to the manufacturer you choose, look at, for instance, the UNI / TUG RWS /Brenneke .. 20% more .
And .375 H&H 20% more than the 9.3x62. And .416 (RM, Rigby, Ruger) 20% more than the .375 H&H
Another possibility but, the cartridge is not easy to find 9.3x64 Brenneke, equivalent to the .375 H&H, marvellous cartridge but ... only two manufacturers all over the world .. (RWS/Brenneke, and Kynoch ?) ..
Another way .. why not the .338WM ..
An other parameter which must be taken into consideration : the momentum !

bebop
The 9.3 is only more powerful in factory loads. In good handloads the Whelen will out do the most 9.3 loads and equal others.
Cheers mate Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I love the 35 Whelen, but those 286's should out penetrate your 225's on anything big and tough. For the same reason I prefer the 250 gr .338 over a 225 in 35 Whelen if I know I have to really drive through something tough or carry that penetration out there a ways.

Red Leg
You can drive the 250 grain Whelen to 2,700 fps that is equivalent to a 286 in sd. The Whelen can also be loaded with 275,300 and mono projectiles such as Barnes and the Woodleigh hydrostatic stabilized.
Cheers mate Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Please, PLEASE take a look an any ballistics chart for a 35 Whelen pushing a 225 Gr bullet at 2700 fps compared to a 9.3 x 62 or a 9.3 x 74R with their 286 Gr. bullets. The 35 Whelen has them both beat. It's not that I dislike or disrespect the 9.3(s) I just don't like seeing the Whelen rated second best. Maybe that is because I own a couple of Whelens and not any rifles in 9.3.

Shootist43
What about the Whelen pushing a 225 at close on 2,900 fps or a 250 at 2700. Let's see the 8.3 do that.
Cheers mate Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I've shot a bunch of elk with three different .35 Whelens over the past 25 years or so, and my experience indicates that 225 grain bullets from a Whelen kill elk just fine, but they do not penetrate as well as 250's, and the longer, slower 250s are more reliable when they hit heavy bone.

The suggestion is that a 225 gr. .35 Whelen beats a similar construction 9.3x62 286 grain? Sorry I don't buy that. Calculated energy figures do not translate exactly to game killing performance in the field. In my experience, a bullet with greater sectional density, and diameter, and weight going just slightly slower will penetrate further, in a straighter line, than a lighter, shorter, faster bullet of similar construction. Big critters are not as succespable to foot pounds of energy as they are to destruction of major organs and bones.

Nosler's published ammunition data:
9.3 x 62 / 286 Partition: MUZ: 2,350fps 3506ft/lb.

35 Whelen, / 225 partition, MUZ: 2,750fps 3777ft/lb.

The Whelen is one of my all time favourites, and it's not "second best" but it shoots lighter bullets faster than the 9.3, which I feel makes it slightly more suitable for smaller animals farther away, and the 9.3's bigger heavier bullets are slightly more suitable for larger or nasty critters not quite so far away.

Most hunters would never notice a difference on any moderate size animal at moderate range. The Whelen might even be superior on medium game like kudu. On real big stuff like buffalo, I'd certainly feel happier with a 9.3/286 gr. and not worry about the "inferior" foot pounds of energy at all.

I recently took delivery of my first 9.3x62, after observing my brother in action for a few years with his. I might soon sell my last .35 Whelen, too much overlap.

Longwalker
225 grain accubonds 2,850 fps over 4,000fpe
225 Woodleigh PPSP 2,950 fps over 4,300fpe
250grain 2,700 fps over 4,000fpe
All seem to be greater than the 9.3
Let's not forget the 225 grain monos at 2,800 for 4,000 fpe
Cheers mate Bob

 

[IvW]

It has worked pretty well for 100 or so guys that have the B&M family of wildcats. From plains game to all the way to elephants. The whole series of cartridges have been designed to be able to use shorter barreled rifles that perform while using standard length Win. model 70 actions with CRF. As mentioned above it provides about 20% more muzzle energy than a .375 H&H. BTW, the rifle with a wood stock is about 7.5 - 8lbs without a scope so very handy "to be lugging around".

You can find more info about the cartridge here:
https://www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/458-B-M.html

Like the 50 B&M the 458 B&M is designed for Winchester M70 WSM control feed actions. The 458 B&M comes with either an 18 or 20 inch barrel standard. At 18 inches it is overall 38 inches and 7.5-8 lbs sporting an Accurate Innovations Wood Stock. It also is very desirable using the Winchester Ultimate stock, it weighs a mere 6.5 lbs. In a stainless configuration it makes an excellent rifle for Alaska. It is capable of 500 gr bullets at 2150 fps in the 18 inch version, but is at it's best with 450 gr bullets. An excellent combination for buffalo is the new Cutting Edge Bullets CEB BBW#13 420 NonCon HP and CEB BBW#13 450 Solid.

The 458 B&M is derived from the 50 B&M. The 458 B&M is made from any full length Remington Ultra case that is cut and trimmed to 2.240 inches. The case is now formed easy in the sizing die.

The original specs for the 458 B&M called for a case length of 2.295 inches. Once I started load development many of the available 458 caliber bullets would not seat to a proper overall length at 2.295”. I shortened the case to 2.240 and solved that issue for most bullets. The 458 B&M has the same case capacity as the 458 Winchester Magnum.

WOW 458 WM performance in a rifle that weighs 7-8 lb from a 18 inch barrel.....

The big difference between the two is that for the 458 Winchester it takes a 24 inch barrel and a 9-10 lb rifle to reach it’s maximum potential, where the 458 B&M can reach it’s that same potential in an 18 inch barrel, exceed that potential in 20 inches and a 7-8 lb rifle! That is quite a difference when one goes to the field!

What a crock of bu......

 

[bruce moulds]

bob, you forgot the 35 cal 280 gn swift aframe.
I would rate the 250 gn 35 cal as closer to the 270 gn 375 in s.d, and behind the 286 gn 9.3 and 300 gn 375.
going up to swift will put the whelen in the next higher category of big game rifle.
bruce.
bruce.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Just to be a prick, here is the data regards the 35 Whelen and the 6.3x62. As you will see there is virtually no difference with the same bullet weights. There is only .008" difference in diameter. Data from both is through a 26" barrel.
From the Nosler reloading manual:
35 Whelen (.358) - 250 gr. max load 2637fps. BC 446. SD 229
6.2 x 63 (.366) - 250 gr. max load 2583fps. BC .494 BC 267
35 Whelen - .275gr. 2400fps ( data on line) 6.3x62 2414 (Nosler data)
I think the Whelen would be as good on buff as the 6.3.

Rick Cox
That's not being a prick mate that is being factual.
My PH said he would have no problems guiding me on a buff hunt with the Whelen with the RIGHT bullets.
Cheers mate Bob

 

[IvW]

Rick Cox
That's not being a prick mate that is being factual.
My PH said he would have no problems guiding me on a buff hunt with the Whelen with the RIGHT bullets.
Cheers mate Bob

Even if it was not legal?

 

[Tanks]

Probably odd place to open this can of worms but why not just put more powder behind .375 instead of larger bore? .375 EnaBLER has KE of 10 kJ at muzzle. Too much for african hunters to handle? ...

If I wanted to put more power behind a .375 projectile I think I would go with .375 RUM instead. It is designed as a hunting cartridge instead of a long range target cartridge. Not to mention the rifle is not going to weigh 18+ lbs or require a big muzzle brake.

 

[Tanks]

Even if it was not legal?

I think in RSA depending on location it could be legal.

 

[IvW]

I think in RSA depending on location it could be legal.

Really??? Where????

 

[IvW]

Just to be a prick, here is the data regards the 35 Whelen and the 6.3x62. As you will see there is virtually no difference with the same bullet weights. There is only .008" difference in diameter. Data from both is through a 26" barrel.
From the Nosler reloading manual:
35 Whelen (.358) - 250 gr. max load 2637fps. BC 446. SD 229
6.2 x 63 (.366) - 250 gr. max load 2583fps. BC .494 BC 267
35 Whelen - .275gr. 2400fps ( data on line) 6.3x62 2414 (Nosler data)
I think the Whelen would be as good on buff as the 6.3.

You guys know more about calibers than I could ever imagine...........

 

[Tanks]

Really??? Where????

From first page of this thread where countries listed on minimum calibers:

South Africa
Most provinces do not have a minimum equipment requirement for rifle hunting and rely on common sense.
Some provinces require a minimum of .375 caliber for dangerous or big game hunting.
No provinces require a minimum energy (Eo - muzzle velocity) for calibers used.​