Wow My Cooper 52 in 416 Rem Mag is falling apart

[Graham Hunter]

Possibly but with the close tolerances in machining today not really a problem. This handle was silver soldered not TIG welded. CUSTOM guns like Cooper keep very tight tolerances from one gun to the next.

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

My post referred to ....if the bolt is replaced......not the handle, which was a suggestion by Caustin. Ofcourse replacing the handle would be nothing more than timing and tig welding, but I was referencing a previous post of replacing a bolt, which would need to have the barrell to be removed unless you were very fortunate with the new replacement bolt that would have the correct head space....if that happens, buy a lottery ticket...lucky day.

For my own education since I was the one who actually said to replace the bolt, can another bolt not be built to be headspaced correctly?

Also, since the first go around with this bolt was obviously mucked up, can you trust the second attempt will work? I truly ask as I have no experience or more than a very cursory knowledge of welding.

 

[johnnyblues]

Bottom line there is no way in hell I would trust this rifle on a DG hunt. Replacement bolt or not. Retork every nut, bolt and screw I would still not trust the gun. I'm sure your PH is capable of backing you up but I'm sure in the back of his mind he's wondering if you'll be able to back him up . When I went on my leopard hunt I told my PH if we need to go after a wounded cat I wanted to be there, I want to make that killing shot if at all possible. Whatever you decide I wish you the greatest hunt you can experience.

 

[IdaRam]

Minor headspace adjustments can also be achieved by machining the bolt face or grinding the back side of the locking lugs. Both of these actions will lengthen the headspace, so only applicable if the "new" bolt produces a short headspace initially.
The process of silver soldering (not welding) will produce a blackened, discolored look on the bolt and would need to be re-blued and re polished.

 

[Areaonereal]

Close tolerances in machining today are not that close, Borden actions are the only ones, I know that have interchangeable barrels to match head spacing...production line rifles are not within the specs for interchangeable bolts and head spacing. Bolts are matched to,the rifle, that is why bolts have the serial number of matching receiver. Tig welding would be much better than silver solder in this case. Well in this case Cooper and their custom tolerances, what ever that would be, was an abject faux paus in this instance. Of the 9 switch barrel rifles that I have not one, not even the custom Surgeon and Stiller actions are close enough tolerances for interchangeble for switching barrels without chambering and threading to the individual bolts. Phoenix Phil..bolts are not built to headspace, the barrel is threaded and chambered to headspace to the specific bolt. Borden Custom Actions, the Roll Royce, Lambroghini, of custom actions uses by many paper punchers, has such tolerances that any barrel chambered for a Borden action is interchangeable with another Borden action..they are custom, custom to the max, specs are unbelievably consistent.

 

[Graham Hunter]

Hey maybe he could buy a Savage and one of the barrels from numerous makers with the barrel nut. Then when the bolt handle comes off he can just throw a new bolt on and adjust for headspace. LOL

 

[mrpoindexter]

If your PH does not have a .416 Rigby and your heart is set on using one, I have a CZ 550 American Safari in .416 Rigby I could loan you. I have 30mm scope rings for it as well...

 

[Therack]

http://www.gunbroker.com/item/639372779

 

[IdaRam]

Standard SAAMI spec headspace tolerance is +/- .003, so six thousandths total.
@Areaonereal , I dont disagree with you about manufacturers tolerances and it is unlikely they would just be able to just drop in a new bolt. But it is entirely doable to replace the bolt and re-headspace without removing the barrel.

 

[BRICKBURN]

Possibly but with the close tolerances in machining today not really a problem. This handle was silver soldered not TIG welded. CUSTOM guns like Cooper keep very tight tolerances from one gun to the next.

Seems like there was a pretty loose tolerance on this firearm.

 

[Royal27]

With all do respect to the OP, this is why I won't ever plan to take a rifle on a hunt that I have had for a long time and put a lot of rounds through, especially if I don't have a backup option in the same caliber range. Start shooting this rifle a year before the hunt and this is an avoidable situation. When I bought my .375 it was right at two years before the intended hunt.

Something for others to remember and a lesson to learn.

 

[Mekaniks]

With all do respect to the OP, this is why I won't ever plan to take a rifle on a hunt that I have had for a long time and put a lot of rounds through, especially if I don't have a backup option in the same caliber range. Start shooting this rifle a year before the hunt and this is an avoidable situation. When I bought my .375 it was right at two years before the intended hunt.

Something for others to remember and a lesson to learn.

This^^^ What he said!!

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

Close tolerances in machining today are not that close, Borden actions are the only ones, I know that have interchangeable barrels to match head spacing...production line rifles are not within the specs for interchangeable bolts and head spacing. Bolts are matched to,the rifle, that is why bolts have the serial number of matching receiver. Tig welding would be much better than silver solder in this case. Well in this case Cooper and their custom tolerances, what ever that would be, was an abject faux paus in this instance. Of the 9 switch barrel rifles that I have not one, not even the custom Surgeon and Stiller actions are close enough tolerances for interchangeble for switching barrels without chambering and threading to the individual bolts. Phoenix Phil..bolts are not built to headspace, the barrel is threaded and chambered to headspace to the specific bolt. Borden Custom Actions, the Roll Royce, Lambroghini, of custom actions uses by many paper punchers, has such tolerances that any barrel chambered for a Borden action is interchangeable with another Borden action..they are custom, custom to the max, specs are unbelievably consistent.

Thank you for the explanation. So if I understand this correctly, outside of Borden Custom Actions or perhaps other high end manufacturers, whether it be Winchester or Mauser, it seems that all barrels will go thru a final machining process to match up with the chosen bolt. Correct?

If so, then it would seem that for the OP to get a new bolt, they would have to pick one that is tight to allow for more machining of the barrel. If it were loose, pretty hard to add steel to tighten things up.

 

[GuttormG]

Send it back, take the money, buy a cz...

 

[Graham Hunter]

I would wonder why a CZ would be suggested when on this and every forum there are complaints of feed issues. You would think CZ might of had known of concerns about this and addressed the situation. But 15 plus yrs later this problem still exists. I have worked on a few CZ and I like the rifle. Strong action decent trigger and accurate. Not the prettiest girl on the dance floor IMHO.

 

[Rob404]

I would have no confidence in that rifle, get your money back,, go buy a Win M70

 

[Dr Ray]

WOW! I own several Cooper Rifles also and love them. I bet anything if you call them with the urgency they will take care of you! But you are correct, what if that happened in the middle of the hunt! I would be wanting a completely new rifle or my money back so you can at least save your hunt. Please let us know how this comes out.
Cody

This could have been an extremely dangerous situation if you were actually hunting. Image the problems you would have had if you had, for example, a very angry & vindictive wounded buffalo coming to greet you!
I bet the manufacturer is totally besides itself and this incident is going to damage the reputation. Personally I have NEVER heard or seen anything like this in my life.

 

[Texas-LTH]

if I was your PH I'd be as nervous as a long tailed cat in a room full of rocking chairs. No thanks.

 

[frog stealer]

Ditch the POS Cooper and like others have mentioned, buy an M70! I'm sure those guys were distracted watching Hillary lose the election when they made your rifle.

 

[Rule 303]

I am for totally new rifle. To much wrong with that one, what else has not been done correctly.

If you want another Cooper, fine, just have them screw the handle to the bolt as well. whether you take the same one back or a new one do as somebody else suggested, have them fire 50 full power loads through it first.

Winchester, CZ, Ruger..maybe or some other new rifle Is what I would be getting. Don't know if CZ come in 416Rem. However I would not rush this and use the PH's rifle and fix the problem on returning.....................well I wouldn't as I am an impatient bastard but common sense would dictates fix on return.