Wounded? Yes or No?

[JimP]

Here is kind of a related story.
A woman from I think California was mule deer hunting In western Wyoming with a guide and she shot at a good mule deer on their way down a hill to look the guide spots a monster buck to the side he lines the lady up and she shoots at that time the record mule deer for a female in Wyoming. No place in the article did it say anything about the buck she shot at first just a great photo with the record buck?
I hoped that other people thought it was kind of strange.

I've seen and had that happen to me on both mule deer and others.

Myself and a friend were cow elk hunting here in Colorado. I shot a cow and she dropped like a rock. I looked away for a minute to grab my binoculars and my friend said that she got back up. I looked through my scope and sure enough, a few feet away from where mine dropped stood another cow. For some reason I didn't pull the trigger. When we got up to the spot there my cow was laying dead as a door nail. I could of had two elk down.

Another time I was hunting javelina in Arizona. I had shot mine and a couple of days later we just took our 4 wheelers out for a ride in the desert. When we saw one of the heaviest javelina that we had ever seen, he was huge. When we told another friend he just asked why we didn't shoot it also. I just told him that wasn't the way that we did things.

 

[Ragman]

I've seen and had that happen to me on both mule deer and others.

Myself and a friend were cow elk hunting here in Colorado. I shot a cow and she dropped like a rock. I looked away for a minute to grab my binoculars and my friend said that she got back up. I looked through my scope and sure enough, a few feet away from where mine dropped stood another cow. For some reason I didn't pull the trigger. When we got up to the spot there my cow was laying dead as a door nail. I could have had two elk down.

The exact same thing happened to my father back in the 80s. We were moose hunting in thick bush and a young bull stood up not too far from him. He dropped it and was walking toward where he saw it fall. When he got halfway there it stood up again, so he gave it a finishing shot. You could have knocked him down with a feather when he got to the spot and found two nearly identical bulls lying there. Fortunately I was not far away and came running when I heard the shots. I was probably more surprised to see two dead bulls than he was. Luckily we both had tags and took care of them quickly.

 

[UKHunter]

If I have to draw a line in the sand - show me the proof I hit the animal; hair, blood, bone. Of course, being a reasonable person, the PH is my guide and they have the final say.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I was going through some of the old threads and happened to come across a topic that made me think that it would bring about some constructive discussion which is probably due for some renewal. Hopefully, some of the members who are yet to embark on their first safari will find this useful.
The post is simply for educational purposes.

When, in your eyes as a hunter, do you accept that an animal has been wounded as opposed to a clean miss?

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@KMG Hunting Safaris
If I know I have made a good shot and the animal doesn't react I usually keep shooting. If the animal wanders off I try and tie a marker to my shooting position the walk to where the animal was looking for anything that may have thrown my bullet off course. When I get to the spot I do a ground search for blood, hair or any other sign that the animal was hit like foot prints. The way an animal walks can tell you a lot of favouring one leg.
Then I do a grid search for the animal. If nothing is found I will come back later to check the area incase I missed something the first time.
Fortunately I have not had to do many follow ups but there have been a couple of times I thought did U or didn't I just wound as I didn't find the animal. Not a nice feeling but I know I did my best to locate the animal
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

So, you get set up on a Waterbuck at 30 yards. They are feeding, unaware to your presence. The shot rings, he flinches and runs off. No blood to be found. They are notoriously tough, and are known not to throw a lot of blood. How would you handle that?

@KMG Hunting Safaris
If'n that happened to me I would want to know why as he would have been hit with a big 35 cal bullet that would have left a decent size exit hole.
If he didn't bleed from that he would be one tough sob but I would still follow it up to make sure.
Bob

 

[Eduard_Venter]

Blood is a good indication, but certainly not the only one. Out of the +-300 kills a year I'm involved with as PH and farm manager, plenty animals are found without ever finding blood. Some are found a couple of days later when I see vultures circling.

Good, solid hits rarely produce any problems. But it's easier to be a little off target than to miss completely. Luckily, lost animals don't happen too often if everyone put in some effort to find it.

In my opinion, trust your PH. They do this every day. A reputable outfit won't charge you unless they are certain it's a hit. They will have to pay the land owner if the animal is found dead later on

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I've been in this position in Africa. On an eland no less. Multiple shots taken, and at least one where I was 100% confident of where my crosshairs were pointing at. (see my recent report).

We never found any blood, leakage, hair or anything. Tracked that bull for 2.5 days, until he finally jumped over a boundary cattle fence and just kept going.

I was willing to pay for it, as I was sure that I must have hit him at least once. And I trusted my PH for him to speak the truth and act accordingly. In the end it was considered a miss, and the eland was not added to the bill. I still do not know what happened those 2.5days.

@VertigoBE
Might have been one of them armour plated eland and you just didn't hear the bullet hit.
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

@JG26Irish_2 - you raise good points and I agree the animals “reaction” is not reliable to determine a “miss” - because some animals show little or no reaction to being Hit… But when you see an animal “react” - ie: fall down, jump straight up-kick, hump, staggers, limp….that is a Very Good indication of a hit and almost always correct (nothing is 100% - even blood can be from an existing wound). I would always pay very close attention to the animals reaction. As far as paying a trophy fee? Many outfits will use the term “if you draw blood” You PAY.

@HankBuck
Once shot a rabbit up the arse with a 30-30 loaded with 125 gn hollow point at around 59 yards. Literally blew one side of the rabbit clean off. Found him about a foot down his burrow with only one bag leg a front led with some ribs and skin holding it together and an intact head
You can't judge an animals will to escape even when mortal hits are taken by them.
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

My best whitetail buck was years ago at maybe 40 yards. I shot him broadside, double lungs with a .375 H&H and a 300 grain Sierra hand load. I pulled the trigger and he never flinched. He stood there and I jacked another shell in. I stood there and thought there was no way I could have missed. He finally did go on a short death run with me not firing again.
One of the best bucks with a crossbow was not much different. He just never went on a death run. He walked around a little until his legs got wobbly and he collapsed.
Some time it is much easier to tell then others as far as a hit.

@K E Johnson
I've seen animals fall over dead with a shot that normally would worry them and I have seen others soak up multiple rounds that gave no indication of being hit. Just wandered around until the brain finally got the message that something was not how it should be.
Bob

 

[HankBuck]

@HankBuck
Once shot a rabbit up the arse with a 30-30 loaded with 125 gn hollow point at around 59 yards. Literally blew one side of the rabbit clean off. Found him about a foot down his burrow with only one bag leg a front led with some ribs and skin holding it together and an intact head
You can't judge an animals will to escape even when mortal hits are taken by them.
Bob

@Bob Nelson 35Whelen - ok Bob, your post here explains a lot and removes any mystery about why you “disparage” the fantastic .243 —- You use a .30-30 for RABBITS !! And even then, some get away wounded. Following your Caliber-Logic I will assume if a .30-30 is used for Rabbits, the .35 Whelen covers Coyotes, Geese & Turkey and .470NE for Deer…and so on. There is a clinic (run by Winchester) and they “treat” those with your issue….it’s a 30 Day Program to help “Caliberaholics”,,, those poor folks that started using bigger & bigger calibers and then just couldn’t stop. No ‘Cold Turkey’ here - they start you out slowly w/a .30-06 and then work you Down the scale to a .223, once you can hit a target with a .22 rimfire - You graduate ! I could be Your Sponser !!

 

[Hyde Hunter]

Trust the PH and trackers, I as the hunter know if it was a hit most of the time. If a question arises as to hit or not comes up I will defer to the pros. That said, would never hunt with a PH that I didn’t trust 100%.
That’s where only going with “outstanding” outfits, such as yours comes into play.

I am not sure about trusting your PH, I took a shot last year at a sable and he went straight up on his hind legs and took off like a cut cat. we could see him run off in open country around a hill side, we did not go and look for blood just followed him. no blood at all found. after 1 1/2 days searching with cattle wranglers looking never found him. when it came time to settle the bills for the week he said oh I sent the tracker later to the spot you shot and he found one drop of blood so you have to pay 3000.00 for the unrecovered sable. I will never hunt with him again, he was the property owner and PH!

 

[Doug Hamilton]

@HankBuck
Once shot a rabbit up the arse with a 30-30 loaded with 125 gn hollow point at around 59 yards. Literally blew one side of the rabbit clean off. Found him about a foot down his burrow with only one bag leg a front led with some ribs and skin holding it together and an intact head
You can't judge an animals will to escape even when mortal hits are taken by them.
Bob

You're right about judging an animals will to escape. I once shot a ground squirrel (about the size of a rat) with a 7mm Rem Mag. Not my normal vermin removal weapon, but I was almost back to the truck after a deer hunt. The bullet removed a front leg and half of the chest. He ran in a circle, then ran about 10 feet and died at the edge of his hole. If he had been closer to his hole I would not have known how much damage had been done before he ran as far as he did.

 

[375Fox]

I am not sure about trusting your PH, I took a shot last year at a sable and he went straight up on his hind legs and took off like a cut cat. we could see him run off in open country around a hill side, we did not go and look for blood just followed him. no blood at all found. after 1 1/2 days searching with cattle wranglers looking never found him. when it came time to settle the bills for the week he said oh I sent the tracker later to the spot you shot and he found one drop of blood so you have to pay 3000.00 for the unrecovered sable. I will never hunt with him again, he was the property owner and PH!

I wouldn’t trust just any PH. South Africa has the easiest requirements to be a PH in Africa and more outfitters than any other country on the continent. Some are great and some are bad and most fall somewhere in the middle. On a first safari it would be impossible to really know what or who you are looking for, after a few safaris you should be able to narrow down what you are looking for and outfitters/PHs you can trust to hopefully avoid the situation you described.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I wouldn’t trust just any PH. South Africa has the easiest requirements to be a PH in Africa and more outfitters than any other country on the continent. Some are great and some are bad and most fall somewhere in the middle. On a first safari it would be impossible to really know what or who you are looking for, after a few safaris you should be able to narrow down what you are looking for and outfitters/PHs you can trust to hopefully avoid the situation you described.

@375Fox
All the PHs we had in Namibia were great even the apprentice PH was on the ball. All found us great animals, told us where to hit them and asked if we were comfortable with the range.
I thought they were bloody brilliant a estimating the range of animals until I asked how they known the range that well. I was told very easy with practice AND good range finding binoculars.
That one cracked me up
Bob

 

[Creigh]

I am not sure about trusting your PH, I took a shot last year at a sable and he went straight up on his hind legs and took off like a cut cat. we could see him run off in open country around a hill side, we did not go and look for blood just followed him. no blood at all found. after 1 1/2 days searching with cattle wranglers looking never found him. when it came time to settle the bills for the week he said oh I sent the tracker later to the spot you shot and he found one drop of blood so you have to pay 3000.00 for the unrecovered sable. I will never hunt with him again, he was the property owner and PH!

We had a weird PH who was the owner as well. He'd made promises during the ramp up to the hunt that he looked like he'd changed his mind. He'd make 'mistakes' during stalking, we never got sights on the animal. Another member of our group was with his [PH] family member in a hide. All we ever heard from that guy was 'wait wait wait'. Looking back we think he wanted us to take an Eland and was worried we'd blow the budget on smaller game. Of course my hunting partner, 30 years experience, does not suffer from a lack of confidence, quite the opposite. Day 3, he starts to ignore the PH. We have a standing joke now of 'wait wait bang'.

 

[RyanPalmer]

Quality tracking dogs are worth gold. I would estimate that we lose 1 per 100 animals due to our extensive use of dogs down here.
It amazes me when my American hunters tell me that using blood tracking hounds in their state is illegal. I simply cannot see a good argument for such a law.

That’s the problem, there isn’t any good argument. Feelings and ballot box biology trump logic and actual science. It’s depressing.