Who likes the 7X57

[Deleted member 74105]

This Paul Mauser guy was very fond of it, and then this John Browning guy got 757 envy and developed the ever so slightly improved 30-06. Both are fine for PG and most hunting in NA (would be a fine antelope/deer/sheep/goat/b. bear/elk/moose rig in MT with the right bullet selections-i.e. 140s for everything excepting elk/moose or 160ish for everything!) Shot placement is everything. LOVE the 7x57 Ackley Improved!!

Those guys were good!

 

[Milan]

Hi, if You are really curious about this ...

- Allure can be found on many things. ... some You might find in this article:

8x57 Mauser Rifle Cartridge

- Next the comparison when looking for all-around cartridge:

ALL-AROUND RIFLE CARTRIDGES

You will find that only wide availability in NA and various types of rifles disqualifies 8x57 from being among all-around cartridges.
From US hunter POV - having something extraordinary might be nice ....

Therefore what is so great? ... well, not much .... but You can say pretty much the same about any all-around cartridge .... this is all the discussions with "xxx can do everything xxx does"

View from my side of the pond:
In central Europe the 8x57s are quite popular .... why? ... dont know for sure
I guess it may be kind of historical inertia (bringing rifles from war back home - need new ammo - need new rifle for the ammo) ...., patriotism (Germany, etc.), .... and plain functionality (in Europe it is true all-around cartridge).

But practically:
In Czechia the european wild boars are (by miles) the most hunted specimen.
I would dare to say, that 8mm is mostly preferred option for this task than 7mm.
8x57 JS has more energy and larger diameter than 7x57. Also ammo variety is wider for the 8mm.
Most of the boars are hunted on short distances (less than 100 meters) - so You dont need high MPBR and laser trajectory flying bullets.
What You need is standard mauser action length with cheap ammo with enough power to bring down even huge, full bodied boar in his mud plastered tough fur armor .... and that happens to be 8mm mauser ... (among others, of course)
Also it is said (cannot say right or wrong) that 8mm heavy slow bullets are more "gentle" on the meat so less meat is wasted. Generally it is said that 30-06 (in this scenario) is true "smasher" of the meat (compared to 8x57) ... but I believe it is the problem of using lighter, faster bullet in springfield. ....

Maybe new thread could be made to ask 8mm users what do they about it the most?
I would like to know too.

Technical: 8x57 JS usually carries 10 % more energy than JRS (just to have everything "in ordnung" ).

I agree. Here in NA it is that people are used to what worked here - .270, 30-06, .300WM, 7mm WM, etc. so nobody ever bothered bringing in or making much of the 7x57 or 8x57 ammo. In Canada, we had more of the east block ammo available in addition to military surplus from all over Europe. Years ago we shot 8mm Mauser a lot, even on gophers as we used cheap military WW2 surplus ammo and S&B or PRVI. 7x57 surplus was still around at that time but not as plentiful. Also not as many rifles around. Being young and wanting bigger bang and being poor students we sprang for the 8x57 instead.

In hunting, my brother used 8x57 on deer and moose, everything falling dead. My dad used 30-06 and same results. I used .338WM and same results, maybe more dramatic but also more recoil. I'm now back to 30-06 and 7x57. Both seem to kill deer well, the 7x57 hitting harder than I ever imagined it would. 8x57 I still have to try to hunt with. But these days surplus ammo is hard to find, so is factory ammo and factory ammo is weak. Norma and RWS are awesome but expensive and not widely available. So reloading is the way to go.

In Czechia people seem to mostly use 7x64 if they talk about 7mm or 8x57 if they talk about 8mm.
In Poland I see people using 30-06 a lot which in Czechia was considered a big boomer. Last time I visited a gun shop there and asked about a 30-06, the guy behind the counter said: "Why would you need Springfield? What are you hunting? Bears?" and laughed at me.

Your conclusion on 8mm being better on boar I have heard before but fail to see why a 7x57 with bonded bullet would not do just as well. Especially at shorter distances. I really would like to try and compare these in practice. Maybe when I visit Czechia we could hook up for a boar hunt?

 

[Pavel U]

I agree. Here in NA it is that people are used to what worked here - .270, 30-06, .300WM, 7mm WM, etc. so nobody ever bothered bringing in or making much of the 7x57 or 8x57 ammo. In Canada, we had more of the east block ammo available in addition to military surplus from all over Europe. Years ago we shot 8mm Mauser a lot, even on gophers as we used cheap military WW2 surplus ammo and S&B or PRVI. 7x57 surplus was still around at that time but not as plentiful. Also not as many rifles around. Being young and wanting bigger bang and being poor students we sprang for the 8x57 instead.

In hunting, my brother used 8x57 on deer and moose, everything falling dead. My dad used 30-06 and same results. I used .338WM and same results, maybe more dramatic but also more recoil. I'm now back to 30-06 and 7x57. Both seem to kill deer well, the 7x57 hitting harder than I ever imagined it would. 8x57 I still have to try to hunt with. But these days surplus ammo is hard to find, so is factory ammo and factory ammo is weak. Norma and RWS are awesome but expensive and not widely available. So reloading is the way to go.

In Czechia people seem to mostly use 7x64 if they talk about 7mm or 8x57 if they talk about 8mm.
In Poland I see people using 30-06 a lot which in Czechia was considered a big boomer. Last time I visited a gun shop there and asked about a 30-06, the guy behind the counter said: "Why would you need Springfield? What are you hunting? Bears?" and laughed at me.

Your conclusion on 8mm being better on boar I have heard before but fail to see why a 7x57 with bonded bullet would not do just as well. Especially at shorter distances. I really would like to try and compare these in practice. Maybe when I visit Czechia we could hook up for a boar hunt?

Well I believe we could spend hours, days maybe weeks talking about this topic .... and still get no definite answer Still (being a guncrank) I believe it would be worth it
So only some of the thoughts:

In Czechia people seem to mostly use 7x64 if they talk about 7mm or 8x57 if they talk about 8mm.

You are right - in bolt action rifles - 7x64 seems (to me) to be getting upper hand. Still among many hunters there are still plenty of combination guns - in that case they would more probably mean 7x57R.

In Poland I see people using 30-06 a lot which in Czechia was considered a big boomer. Last time I visited a gun shop there and asked about a 30-06, the guy behind the counter said: "Why would you need Springfield? What are you hunting? Bears?" and laughed at me.

Yes, it is considered as such. "stronger" calibers are not that widely popular, especially among the "old breed". - Hell, man - I even saw one of "these guys" two weeks ago shooting at quite a large boar with his 16ga shotgun ... and not with slug (and he had them by himself!), but with 7mm buckshot
Still 30-06 is quite popular - My personal small statistic would say that (especially among younger hunters) distribution of calibers is (from most to least): 1) 308 2)8x57 3)30-06 4)7x64 then others.

Your conclusion on 8mm being better on boar I have heard before but fail to see why a 7x57 with bonded bullet would not do just as well. Especially at shorter distances.

Mee too. With proper bullet any caliber can reach far beyond its usual "area of operation". Friend of mine hunts even red deers and 100 kilograms boars with .243 Win. The boar was shot "right behind the ear".
BUT
I am strong proponent of "use enough gun" mindset. So maybe I am a bit biased here
And believe me: when my friend was extremely lucky that the shot was perfect and he didn't have to track him in the thick bushes and repell charging boar with .243 Because sometimes wounded boars tend to hide in thick bush, lie and wait for anybody who comes for them .... there are occasionaly severe injuries or even death.

Other POV: Most of the hunters in Czechia are old breed and want to save money - therefore they usually use cheap ammo (as well as rifles) so more power could be a significant factor of success. Just look at in Czechia extremely popular S&B 7x57 and 8x57 data - 8mm has (almost 900 joules more energy). S&B has made a great progress in last years but (as I heard) in the older days quality of their bullets was poor - especially SP. So either You could take poor bullet in 7x57 140 grain with 2 900 joules, or 8x57 196 grain with 3 900 joules ... would would You choose?

I really would like to try and compare these in practice. Maybe when I visit Czechia we could hook up for a boar hunt?

I like the idea
Hadn't done anything like this before, so first I would have to find out what does it take to have a foreign hunter on visit. As You probably know - there are different types of hunting properties with different rules applied. But in general it is of course possible and it is being done.
Just be aware: since our properties are quite small, there is always significant chance, that the animals may be outside of our property - especially wild boars roam tens of kilometers searching for food.

 

[Milan]

Well I believe we could spend hours, days maybe weeks talking about this topic .... and still get no definite answer Still (being a guncrank) I believe it would be worth it

Agreed. Hopefully we will one day, say over a beer or rum. Or both. Just talked to my brother and apparently I made his head hurt. Maybe I talk too much when it comes to guns.

You are right - in bolt action rifles - 7x64 seems (to me) to be getting upper hand. Still among many hunters there are still plenty of combination guns - in that case they would more probably mean 7x57R.

Yup. That was the gist I got. &x64 in repeaters, 7x57R in break actions.

Still 30-06 is quite popular - My personal small statistic would say that (especially among younger hunters) distribution of calibers is (from most to least): 1) 308 2)8x57 3)30-06 4)7x64 then others.

Ha. Forgot about the .308. It makes sense. So I agree with the order.

Other POV: Most of the hunters in Czechia are old breed and want to save money - therefore they usually use cheap ammo (as well as rifles) so more power could be a significant factor of success. Just look at in Czechia extremely popular S&B 7x57 and 8x57 data - 8mm has (almost 900 joules more energy). S&B has made a great progress in last years but (as I heard) in the older days quality of their bullets was poor - especially SP. So either You could take poor bullet in 7x57 140 grain with 2 900 joules, or 8x57 196 grain with 3 900 joules ... would would You choose?

Agreed. Forgot about old-breed but mainly about the ammo. Here we only have S&B FMJ or SPCE and FMJ is illegal for hunting. Plus 7x57FMJ is not found much anymore (some PPU and that's it). A hunter I know in Czechia does not like the SPCE bullets in 8x57 as doing too much meat damage. But in the power level scenario you describe, it's a no-brainer.

I like the idea
Hadn't done anything like this before, so first I would have to find out what does it take to have a foreign hunter on visit. As You probably know - there are different types of hunting properties with different rules applied. But in general it is of course possible and it is being done.
Just be aware: since our properties are quite small, there is always significant chance, that the animals may be outside of our property - especially wild boars roam tens of kilometers searching for food.

I happen to be a citizen. So maybe it would work easier. Mainly I'd like to get my own license for both guns and hunting in Czechia. Missed an opportunity to do the exam years ago and now have been kicking myself for that since. In the worst case I like to just tag along with binos too. Where are you located, by the way, if you don't mind me asking.

 

[IvW]

7x57mm is a great caliber.....it kills everything I have ever pulled the trigger on.....one of the perfect calibers ever designed.....

 

[F. Vaccaro]

View attachment 445304
My 7x57 "Elephant killer"

HWL

That is a beautiful 7X57! Very handy, a little heavier than they look though, still not too heavy.