What is next after .375 in bolt action Rifle?

[Nic7-300wsm]

Interesting question. Kinda like "What's the better car Aston Martin DB9 or Bentley GT?"
Question would be: What are you going to hunt with a larger calibre, or why do you want one? My wife asks me the same question; Why do you want another gun? My response is "Because I don't have that one!" I like sleeping on the couch...it don't bitch at me or talk back
All listed above choices are good and yes there will be considerable "thump" at both ends. My preference is the 450 Rigby. CZ makes a decent 450 Rigby rifle. It's not going to win any awards for being "fashionably pretty" but what ever it hits doesn't get up as long as you do your part. You can also have your own custom built version using a 416 Rigby as a donor rifle. 416 Rigby; there's another good calibre that has been around for ever. The 450 is basically a 460 Weatherby minus about 5%. The major advantage is that it operates at much a lower psi than let's say a 460 Weatherby, or a 416 Rem Mag etc. So there is a less of chance that a case will "stick" in the chamber in a high heat & humidity situation. This would be bad if your quarry has a tendency to eat you, or stomp you into a little greasy spot.
Again it's all up to personal preference. Depending on where you live certain gun stores will let you "try out" an cannon or two to see what you prefer.
A buffet of choices! You could get one of each...........
I couldn't decide at my buffet so I got a 416 Rigby, 404 Jeffery, & 450 Rigby.....burp...pretty good. Dessert may include a 577 Tyrannosaur T-Rex. Not sure if I have room yet....Kinda full

If you need a good explanation to get the new gun and don't want to end up on the couch, I have plenty of good reasons (can write a book...maybe not such a bad Idea..."Explain to your wife why an additional gun in one minute!")
I do fancy the .450 Rigby (not afraid of the thump), so maybe I will start there....

 

[Nic7-300wsm]

The animals are not any tougher than they were 50 years ago. 458 Lott is a lot of gun. 416 Rigby is about perfect for short and long range.

I don't really know about that, some of these warthogs can be very dedicated on ripping you to threads and don't like dying easy, bullets smaller than .30 seem to bounce of their hides like air gun pellets from and elephants behind!! You really do need a lot of gun to hunt them with...
Only joking, I know that I can hunt anything with my .375 H&H and cleanly and ethically dispatch any animal with it, but I just want to have something bigger, much bigger than .375 so that's why i haven't considered the .416, just to close to .375 (love the caliber and will eventually get one)

 

[Amon458]

Im still waiting to receive my .585HE so I cant really recommend it but if you do some research on it you should see it looks like a load of fun.

 

[Ado]

The animals are not any tougher than they were 50 years ago. 458 Lott is a lot of gun. 416 Rigby is about perfect for short and long range.

I agree the animals are not tougher...

Yet our bullets are better, velocity is quicker, aiming is improved!

How on earth then are calibers that were fine when introduced are now considered marginal for the same game?

This I just do not get...

Ado

 

[Petrus Geldenhuys]

I would suggest the 416 Rigby for the 400gr class points and a 458 lott for the 500gr class.

 

[Gert Odendaal]

Nic7-300wsm
It depends entirely what you will hunt in the near future...if you are going to hunt Elephant get `n .500 Jeffery of .505 Gibbs...that is if you are going to hunt ten or twelve or fifteen elephants ...at least then you used the rifle optimally...if you want to hunt buffalo or any other dangerous game /plains game animals...you really do not need more than `n 404 Jeffery...you will be more than satisfied...there are members /hunters whom possess a .500 Jeffery a .458 Lott and a .416 Rigby ...and they still tell you they wish they had a 404 Jeffery..the 404 Jeffery is the all time great classic hunting rifle with a "soul"......

 

[enysse]

Unless I was a PH a 416 Rigby, 404 Jeffery or 416 Rem is perfect for a everyday big bore. You can hunt plains game and big game with confidence. The larger you go, it becomes a specialized rifle. I do own a 458 Win and that is plenty, if I can't kill it with that rifle I need to go back to the range, because I have problems not the rifle. I didn't buy the 458 Lott because to me, I didn't need that much power. Accuracy is usually final. The 458 Win got a bad reputation with inferior bullets, with the bullets they make today it is fine caliber that people put down for really no good reasons other than they can go bigger.

 

[Nic7-300wsm]

Nic7-300wsm
It depends entirely what you will hunt in the near future...if you are going to hunt Elephant get `n .500 Jeffery of .505 Gibbs...that is if you are going to hunt ten or twelve or fifteen elephants ...at least then you used the rifle optimally...if you want to hunt buffalo or any other dangerous game /plains game animals...you really do not need more than `n 404 Jeffery...you will be more than satisfied...there are members /hunters whom possess a .500 Jeffery a .458 Lott and a .416 Rigby ...and they still tell you they wish they had a 404 Jeffery..the 404 Jeffery is the all time great classic hunting rifle with a "soul"......

Hi Gert

I 100% agree with you on the 404 Jeffery, it has soul!! But like the .416 Rigby it is close to the .375 H&H. Maybe I should just re-think this plan... I want something BIG, but also want to shoot with it regularly and as I thought, there are enough different opinions out there as to the right caliber. A South African legend, Dr. Lucas Potgieter once said to me that no matter what you are going to shoot, everything has been killed with calibers from 7mm up, including elephant (Pandoro Taylor used 7x57 on many elephants). Choose the gun that talks to your heart, you need a "soul" gun. The .404 Jeffery has been such a gun, I just wanted a really big bore....
Think I will follow my heart and get the .404 and if time permits later in my life, get something else.

 

[bassasdaindia]

nick , the 4's ( 416 and 404 ) are so enjoyable to shoot .

I don't agree that they are similar to the 375.

 

[Gert Odendaal]

Gentleman, I beg to differ from your statement...there is no way the .375 H&H Magnum can be viewed as "too near" the 404 Jeffery..I own both ...I can assure you there is a vast difference between these two calibers...the only feature that may bind these two calibers as "near " to each other is the recoil...the 404 Jeffery has a mild recoil..a slow push and can be consider as milder as the .375 H&H Magnum...that is about it...the .375 H&H Magnum can give you a thump if you do not shoot big caliber rifles regularly..especially with a 300 gn bullet and ill designed rifle stock...

( I do know that John "Pondoro Taylor did view the .375 Holland&Holland Magnum as a magical caliber that he used to shoot seven eland with one shot , while he shot through a six inch branch before the bullet entered the first eland and shot right through all seven eland walking in a very straight line behind each other...)

If you really want to get as much power as possible from the 404 Jeffery..load it with a 450 gn bullet ( Norma) and shoot it at 2300f/s...then you have all the power you need....

You will never be disappointed when purchasing a 404 Jeffery..it is a rifle with soul, a great pedigree and history....

Regards

Gert

 

[Velo Dog]

nick , the 4's ( 416 and 404 ) are so enjoyable to shoot .

I don't agree that they are similar to the 375.

I totally agree with you that the .416 and/or .404 are definitely not similar to the .375 H&H.

Fact is, my wimpy shoulder cannot tell the difference in recoil between 400 grain factory loaded .416 Rigby ammunition and 500 grain factory loaded .458 Winchester ammunition.

(I confess to usually loading my .416 down to around 2200 fps for that reason)

 

[Shakey]

If you're going to exclude doubles, why bother looking beyond the .375 H&H? If doubles truly are off the table for you and you must move beyond the .375, the .416 is a wonderful combination of SD, momentum and effective range.

 

[tarbe]

Northfork Technologies makes a wonderful .423 340 grain bonded bullet that would be suitable for Elk, Moose and PG in Africa up to Giraffe.

They also make 380, 400 and 430 grain bonded bullets that will do the smaller stuff, but also take you to Cape Buffalo.

They also make Flat Nose and Cup Point solids to 430 grain that will take you to Elephant (SD of the 430 grain is .343).

What more could a man need??

 

[Gert Odendaal]

Northfork Technologies makes a wonderful .423 340 grain bonded bullet that would be suitable for Elk, Moose and PG in Africa up to Giraffe.

They also make 380, 400 and 430 grain bonded bullets that will do the smaller stuff, but also take you to Cape Buffalo.

They also make Flat Nose and Cup Point solids to 430 grain that will take you to Elephant (SD of the 430 grain is .343).

What more could a man need??

My sentiments exactly ....you just need a 404 Jeffery to use it with these brilliant bullets,,,then even an Elephant bull is not safe anymore....

 

[enysse]

I agree the 375 H&H and the 416 Rigby, 416 Rem and 404 Jeffrey are very different. The 375 H&H can shoot a 300 grain bullet with ease. The 416 Rigby, 416 Rem and 404 Jeffrey can shoot a 400 grain bullet with ease and the recoil is quite increased from the 375 H&H. Now if you move to the 458 Lott and 500 grain bullets.....I guarantee you will see quite an increase in recoil and power. Accuracy is always final with the right bullets. The 375 H&H is a gentlemen's gun, recoil is not bad, the 416 Rigby, 416 Rem and 404 Jeffrey take a little effort to shoot straight but the 458 Lott is whole new ballpark if you ask me (gun fit would be very important).

 

[shuter]

For me, it went: New Win M70 .375 H&H, .450/.400 NE in a Ruger #1 Boddington, and most recently a Ruger RSM in .458 Lott. Based on your initial post, I'd say get a Lott. I love the .450/.400, but the Lott is a true "big bore"; bullets are many, varied, and widely available; and recoil in the right rifle is tolerable from field positions. Haven't shot mine a lot yet but love it so far.

If you can't find an RSM (assuming you'd want one), I'd call Wayne at American Hunting Rifles and commission him to build you one on a CZ550 action with his #2 package. Very reasonable, and I'm told excellent work. He's also a very responsive guy to deal with from my experience thus far. He can provide the barreled action for the project as well.

Good luck!

 

[AZDAVE]

Like many here my preferred rifle is a double, you can get into a merkel or chapuis in the 10K range. 450/400. In a bolt gun just stay with the classics 7x57, 9.3x62 and a 404 Jeff and you can hunt anywhere on the planet. Lot would depend on if you want to stay with a long action or magnum action. You have some great advice listed above for many hours of researching the perfect big bore to go with the mid bore 375. Also don't worry about scratching nice wood as it can always be restored back to "I would never take it to the woods beauty" with just a little work. Life is to short to hunt with ugly guns

 

[Witold Krzyżanowski]

416 !

or 404Jeffery!
Witold

 

[bassasdaindia]

or 404Jeffery!
Witold

I agree

 

[matt85]

im late to this debate and I can see people are already pushing the small bores on ya . ignore all these others voting for tiny little cartridges that only start with .4xx and move to something .5xx and up!

the 500 Jeffery or the 505 Gibbs are excellent cartridges! im partial to the 505 Gibbs myself as I like the case design and the extra case capacity gives room for increased power. or if you really want something with some power then the 585 HE or even the 600 OK will jiggle a filling or two. AHR will make you a nice working rifle in any of these big cartridges for around $7000 (they are currently building me a 505 Gibbs).

I personally think the recoil of the 505 Gibbs is both manageable and enjoyable at the range. shooting 10-15 cartridges in a sitting is easy and at least for me produces no negative side effects. the only real limit for me at the range is my budget. the down side to these big rifles is the cost of ammunition! (you better hand load)

note: if you MUST have something smaller then a 50 cal then my vote is for the 458 Lott or the 450 Rigby.

-matt