The 404 Jeffery history and related information

[Paul Raley]

Sad that his son did not want it. Tough to see a gun with that kind of history leave the family.

I suspect that the son did not know what a valuable rifle he had . The way in which my friend acquired the rifle was that he was visiting his local gun shop the one day and the owner of the 404 was also in the gun shop trying to sell the rifle to the shop , the person behind the counter made a stupidly low offer and the owner of the rifle declined ( I suspect the guy behind the counter also didn't know what a treasure this rifle was ) . My friend being an avid hunter and firearms enthusiast realized that this rifle was special ( but he also didn't know how special ) and followed the owner of the rifle out of the shop and made him an offer , deal done , my friend became the proud owner of this special en beautiful rifle .

 

[Gert Odendaal]

Members, although extremely sad, that the children of a rifle owner do not necessary will follow in their father`s footstep`s in regards to inherit all his rifles it is reality...we never own rifles , we are but custodians to great pieces of history or every day tools we love to ply our great trade with...hunting...but it is our responsibility to take care of and use them ...then when the time comes put them in the care of like minded people like yourself..

 

[vette447]

@WAB, Have a friend that is a long time FFL holder but is also an estate appraiser. He has told me many stories about receiving calls from families in which the elder had passed away, and they requested my friend to come and value his gun collection and sell it for them. In many cases the man that died had sons, but they had no interest in the gun collection. These collections would nearly always go to a buyer in Texas. Many of the times they would include whole groups of Purdys and in recent years would go to Gordy's in Houston. It appears that in modern times, it is quite common for well off men to die off and have no children that are even remotely interested in having fine firearms passed down to them.

Along these lines, I recently visited via telephone with a pawn shop in CA that had two very highly embellished Westley Richards rifles brought in by the family of a deceased gentleman and pawned them. I was able to get one of them bought for a friend for a fair price for buyer and seller and passed on the other but it sold for a very fair price as well and is now for sale at a known dealer for 3x the price. This poor guy's highly valuable guns were sold for pennies on the dollar because his family didn't know (or care) what he had. Both rifles also surely had maker's cases and we likely thrown out by the kids. Very sad for the fine rifles and their previous owners.

There are some amazing rifles recently coming up for sale that have been safely stowed away in very impressive collections for decades as these fine collectors pass on. It seems there are fewer and fewer people around that value and appreciate the history of these types of firearms leading to the rifles often selling for pretty fair prices. I hope to try to add a few pieces to my collection as these amazing rifles come up for sale. I would like to hunt with these rifles and try to capture and enjoy some of that fine history as well.

 

[Gert Odendaal]

Along these lines, I recently visited via telephone with a pawn shop in CA that had two very highly embellished Westley Richards rifles brought in by the family of a deceased gentleman and pawned them. I was able to get one of them bought for a friend for a fair price for buyer and seller and passed on the other but it sold for a very fair price as well and is now for sale at a known dealer for 3x the price. This poor guy's highly valuable guns were sold for pennies on the dollar because his family didn't know (or care) what he had. Both rifles also surely had maker's cases and we likely thrown out by the kids. Very sad for the fine rifles and their previous owners.

There are some amazing rifles recently coming up for sale that have been safely stowed away in very impressive collections for decades as these fine collectors pass on. It seems there are fewer and fewer people around that value and appreciate the history of these types of firearms leading to the rifles often selling for pretty fair prices. I hope to try to add a few pieces to my collection as these amazing rifles come up for sale. I would like to hunt with these rifles and try to capture and enjoy some of that fine history as well.

Vette, you are quite correct in your assumptions...it is sad , keep in mind, the original owner did not purchase these rifles to be passed on to his children or family members, he bought and used them for his own enjoyment...as pointed out above , you are just very lucky if your children or family members are interested in your rifles and love rifles and weapons/fire arms...when the time comes and I need to get rid of my rifles I surely will rather sell/give it to forum members that hand it in or get them destroyed since my children are not interested in them to use and care for them...so keep your ears/eyes open when the time comes their will be a 404 Jeffery /.458 Mannlicher Schoenauer /.375 Coggswell&Harrison available to collect or buy it /to be give away for a member who wants them... Please take good care of them if you get them ...and use them a lot , do not let them stand in a safe..

Or the first PH who give me a buffalo bull, scrum cap /dagga boy to hunt will receive the 404 Jeffery when I move on to internal hunting grounds..then I will know my rifles will be used..

 

[Andrew Short]

I recently acquired a 404. I stumbled upon this article last night written by @Von Gruff. Much appreciation to the time and effort you put into this. Thank you sir.

 

[Gert Odendaal]

Von Gruff is the specialist when it comes to the 404 Jeffery calibre rifle , he build one himself and did an incredible lot of research and ballistic testing and bullet castings for the 404 Jeffery..He is one of the most talented persons I have ever come to know over the internet and on forums ..He is a skilled blade-smith as well..

 

[Andrew Short]

Von Gruff is the specialist when it comes to the 404 Jeffery calibre rifle , he build one himself and did an incredible lot of research and ballistic testing and bullet castings for the 404 Jeffery..He is one of the most talented persons I have ever come to know over the internet and on forums ..He is a skilled blade-smith as well..

Specialist indeed, so much information compiled here.
Very talented blade smith and his work is amazing! Going to order an AH EDC for Christmas presents.

 

[Professor Mawla]

I have a curious question . Was RWS offering factory loaded .404 Jeffery ammunition in the 1970s ? I do not recall so . I do remember RWS offering one 10.75x68 mm factory load . It was a 347 grain full metal jacket offering and they were not offering any soft nosed ammunition for the 10.75x68 mm Mauser . They also offered factory loaded ammunition for the 9.3x62 mm Mauser and the 9.3x74 mm R ( Rimmed ) .

 

[deewayne2003]

Professor Mawla - I believe RWS did offer .404 Jeffery ammunition in the 1970s; and while I do not know the manufacture date of the ammunition shown in the post below, it appears to me to be appropriate for the 1970s and I think you will recognize one of the members who posted about Belgian made guns.

Bought an original FN in 404 Jeffery

Hi there, first post here but I have been gathering good info here on this forum for quite a while. I am a 36 years old sportshooter from Belgium (mostly handguns from .22 to 460 S&W Magnum and pretty much everything in between) who has been fascinated with big bore rifles and their hunting...

www.africahunting.com

 

[Professor Mawla]

Professor Mawla - I believe RWS did offer .404 Jeffery ammunition in the 1970s; and while I do not know the manufacture date of the ammunition shown in the post below, it appears to me to be appropriate for the 1970s and I think you will recognize one of the members who posted about Belgian made guns.

Bought an original FN in 404 Jeffery

Hi there, first post here but I have been gathering good info here on this forum for quite a while. I am a 36 years old sportshooter from Belgium (mostly handguns from .22 to 460 S&W Magnum and pretty much everything in between) who has been fascinated with big bore rifles and their hunting...

www.africahunting.com

@deewayne2003
Thank you very much . I see that Major Poton Khan Sir has shared some catalog pages about Fabrique Nationale Mauser Model 98 rifles , on the thread . He is a great man . My former sector commander , elder brother figure and friend . I have always envied that beautiful Belgian 12 bore Magnum box-lock non ejector shotgun of his . The Major even shot a marauding cheetah with it , two weeks ago .

 

[nztimb]

I sent an email to RWS to get the information @Professor Mawla asked about but have not received an answer

 

[arizonajake]

I first shot a .404 Jeffery in a Fahrquarson rifle about 30 years ago and have been hooked. For years, I've been looking for suitable actions at a fair price to build custom rifles. Just last week, I came across a nice 1903 Springfield in .30-06 with a Leupold MK. 8 4X scope, so I am excited that I will soon come across a nice CZ, or Winchester controlled round feed action or beat-up rifle to make into a .404 Jefferey. But then, I may hit the lotto jackpot first or die of old age...

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I first shot a .404 Jeffery in a Fahrquarson rifle about 30 years ago and have been hooked. For years, I've been looking for suitable actions at a fair price to build custom rifles. Just last week, I came across a nice 1903 Springfield in .30-06 with a Leupold MK. 8 4X scope, so I am excited that I will soon come across a nice CZ, or Winchester controlled round feed action or beat-up rifle to make into a .404 Jefferey. But then, I may hit the lotto jackpot first or die of old age...

@arizonajake
On of the best actions to build a 404 on is the P14 or M17 almost a magnum length action straight off. They will even handle the big 505 Gibbs.
Bob

 

[nztimb]

I recieved an answer to my email this morning from the RWS amunition company,

Rumpler Stefan RUAG	2:48 AM (3 hours ago)
to me

Yes, we produced RWS .404Jeffery (10,75x73) during the 1970´s until 2015.
In the beginning we used steel jacket (ingot iron) FMJ RN 26g bullets from our own production and some when later in the 1980´s we used Woodleigh bullets. With this change of bullets we also introduced a 26g soft point bullet.

We hope this information fits your needs.

With best regards

Stefan Rumpler Customer Service

RUAG Ammotec GmbH

 

[Dirtdart]

This is from an old catalog I had laying around.

 

[Justin.]

@Von Gruff you really out did yourself! Very much enjoyed that PH’s experiences regarding caliber choice and the hunters associated with them!

Did make me a little sad to see mention of the CZ line and be reminded what a great rifle we all lost when they discontinued the CZ 550! This article had me researching the cost of one on GB and promptly realizing I’ll continue along with my plans for a custom at those prices LOL!

Speaking of customs..the build you sold was an absolute beauty! Your knives and rifles are more akin to works of art than simple tools! I aspire to own one of those knives when I head to the dark continent! Any chance you could speak on the build components and what you would have kept the same or done differently for that rifle if you did it again?

 

[nztimb]

@Von Gruff you really out did yourself! Very much enjoyed that PH’s experiences regarding caliber choice and the hunters associated with them!

Did make me a little sad to see mention of the CZ line and be reminded what a great rifle we all lost when they discontinued the CZ 550! This article had me researching the cost of one on GB and promptly realizing I’ll continue along with my plans for a custom at those prices LOL!

Speaking of customs..the build you sold was an absolute beauty! Your knives and rifles are more akin to works of art than simple tools! I aspire to own one of those knives when I head to the dark continent! Any chance you could speak on the build components and what you would have kept the same or done differently for that rifle if you did it again?

Thank you Justin. Happy to talk through a knife for your need any time.
As far as the 404 build goes and knowing what I know now I think I would go one barrell profile lighter as there was a slight muzzle bias to the weight which was good for recoil controll but it did interfere with working the bolt from the shoulderbut a 1/2 inch shorter recoil pad made a real difference to that equation.
All other components were as I would do again if I was to build another except I might look at a cocking piece aperture sight instead of the bridge mount

 

[xausa]

This is my .404. I'm still trying to discover who made it. It was originally a .375 H&H and the previous owner had it rebarreled to .404, but sadly did nothing about the magazine and left me to take care of that detail. The maker's name was probably on the original barrel.

The action is an original Oberndorf Magnum action and the only thing I would have changed about it is the Griffin & Howe scope mount, which is quite a bit too high for my taste.
All in all, a very pleasant rifle to shoot.

 

[Justin.]

This is my .404. I'm still trying to discover who made it. It was originally a .375 H&H and the previous owner had it rebarreled to .404, but sadly did nothing about the magazine and left me to take care of that detail. The maker's name was probably on the original barrel.

View attachment 419198

The action is an original Oberndorf Magnum action and the only thing I would have changed about it is the Griffin & Howe scope mount, which is quite a bit too high for my taste.
All in all, a very pleasant rifle to shoot.

What a lovely rifle! Scope does seem a touch high but it’s a looker and that’s what matters LOL!

 

[Justin.]

Thank you Justin. Happy to talk through a knife for your need any time.
As far as the 404 build goes and knowing what I know now I think I would go one barrell profile lighter as there was a slight muzzle bias to the weight which was good for recoil controll but it did interfere with working the bolt from the shoulderbut a 1/2 inch shorter recoil pad made a real difference to that equation.
All other components were as I would do again if I was to build another except I might look at a cocking piece aperture sight instead of the bridge mount

That sounds like a plan!

I wish I had the eyes for iron sights, cursed with glasses and restricted to rifle scopes for my future build LOL!