Politics

[wesheltonj]

I am seeing lots of social media posts of interviews with the former Shah of Iran and the Crown Prince. Change is in the air.

 

[Hunt anything]

Must be the shahs son , he lives in Potomac, Maryland.

I am seeing lots of social media posts of interviews with the former Shah of Iran and the Crown Prince. Change is in the air.

 

[Rocked and Loaded]

Arnold was a pretty meh governor (though I can say much worse about every CA governor since…) but he hit the nail on the head here.

 

[Hunt anything]

Arnold was a pretty meh governor (though I can say much worse about every CA governor since…) but he hit the nail on the head here.

I do believe those dingbats swallowed their tongues and couldn’t reply.

 

[375 Ruger Fan]

375 Ruger, why would the U.S. or Israel consider any demands from Iran? What would we agree to.

The US and Israel are in the position to dictate terms to Iran. There is a big difference, in my opinion, between that and unconditional surrender.

Lincoln and Grant were in a position to dictate very punitive terms to the South at the end of the Civil War. Instead, they gave terms that allowed the South to maintain their dignity (keep their horse, etc) and start the healing process.

 

[Hunt anything]

The MOP bombs that they’re talking about using on the underground nuke centers. I know they are said to weigh 30,000 pounds. How big is the actual warhead?

 

[Altitude sickness]

The US and Israel are in the position to dictate terms to Iran. There is a big difference, in my opinion, between that and unconditional surrender.

Lincoln and Grant were in a position to dictate very punitive terms to the South at the end of the Civil War. Instead, they gave terms that allowed the South to maintain their dignity (keep their horse, etc) and start the healing process.

Yes they did. The Civil War has zero parallels to the terrorist regime of Iran.

Hezbollah at Irans behest and others have been killing innocents for decades.

Grant and Lee fought with rules with uniforms. With exception of possibly Sherman they followed basic rules of war.

General Sherman should have been charged with war crimes against combatants in the south and the Lakota.

 

[Altitude sickness]

Iran deserves no Quarter

 

[RLD]

Yes they did. The Civil War has zero parallels to the terrorist regime of Iran.

Hezbollah at Irans behest and others have been killing innocents for decades.

Grant and Lee fought with rules with uniforms. With exception of possibly Sherman they followed basic rules of war.

General Sherman should have been charged with war crimes against combatants in the south and the Lakota.

Except that the whole concept of war crimes was very much in its infancy then.

 

[P-J]

The MOP bombs that they’re talking about using on the underground nuke centers. I know they are said to weigh 30,000 pounds. How big is the actual warhead?

"The warhead assembly contains 4,590 pounds (2,082 kg) of AFX-757 and 752 pounds (341 kg) of PBXN-114, for a total explosive payload of 5,342 pounds (2,423 kg)"

GBU-57A/B MOP - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[skydiver386]

I am seeing lots of social media posts of interviews with the former Shah of Iran and the Crown Prince. Change is in the air.

Hard to gauge how much support any member of the Pahlavi family has within Iran right now. More than the jackwagons in charge right now in any case

 

[SaintPanzer]

Trump seeking "Unconditional Surrender" of Iran. Who does he think he is? U.S. Grant? Many historians believe FDR's unconditional surrender demand on Germany prolonged WW2. Back in the olden days, countries sued for peace, agreeing to terms.

Trump Seeks 'Unconditional Surrender' of Iran

'We know exactly where the so-called 'Supreme Leader' is hiding'.

www.rigzone.com

I'm just idly curious. What possible conditions could Germany negotiate? Which would have been acceptable?

 

[rookhawk]

The MOP bombs that they’re talking about using on the underground nuke centers. I know they are said to weigh 30,000 pounds. How big is the actual warhead?

I don't know about the payload, but I did a bit of reading on the MOP and there were quotes from US military that the MOP may not work for the Iran nuke sight. The report said they'd at minimum need to deploy two of them back to back hoping to get deep enough.

Since we're the only ones that have the MOP or a bomber capable of deploying it via stealth, such a mission would bring the USA right into the Iran hostilities. It will be the worst of both worlds if we try to MOP the nuke site, get drawn into the conflict directly, AND we fail to achieve mission objectives.

@Red Leg do you have anything to elaborate on the feasibility of this weapon for the proposed mission?

 

[Rocked and Loaded]

Hard to gauge how much support any member of the Pahlavi family has within Iran right now. More than the jackwagons in charge right now in any case

Probably more shahists in the US than the Iranian opposition. I’d expect the opposition in Iran to be somewhere between a gentler Islamic state and a secular republic.

I believe the shah and many of his supporters fled the country so there wouldn’t be a lot of them left there.

 

[skydiver386]

What has really mystified me is why Israel has not developed a system to take out Iran's deep bunkers.

It's not like they started planning this thing yesterday.

The only large aircraft they have capable of lifting the munitions required is the C-130, which isn't the best bomber platform.

Daisy Cutters and other bombs have been dropped from the C-130, but a large, slow cargo aircraft would be the last thing I'd want to fly in that airspace.

So with my thinking cap on, either Israel has something up it's sleeve we don't know about yet, or they were counting on the U.S. to do the job.

 

[Altitude sickness]

I guessing Trump is still playing Japans role during negotiations with the U.S. just before Pearl Harbor.

I guessing trump is dangling shiny objects in public. While Israel is on the ground. Either using Cyber methods or has Mossad destroying the facilities by other means.

Then if those current operations are not successful. The B2’s will “MOP” up the remainder.

 

[mdwest]

I don't know about the payload, but I did a bit of reading on the MOP and there were quotes from US military that the MOP may not work for the Iran nuke sight. The report said they'd at minimum need to deploy two of them back to back hoping to get deep enough.

Since we're the only ones that have the MOP or a bomber capable of deploying it via stealth, such a mission would bring the USA right into the Iran hostilities. It will be the worst of both worlds if we try to MOP the nuke site, get drawn into the conflict directly, AND we fail to achieve mission objectives.

@Red Leg do you have anything to elaborate on the feasibility of this weapon for the proposed mission?

Im not an expert by any stretch... but have been talking to some senior USAF guys that know and understand how the platform works..

there's a reason the B2 actually carries 2 of these munitions.. its not so they can hit 2x targets.. its for exactly what you're describing.. they drop the first one on the target.. and then dump the second one in the hole created by the first MOP, thereby penetrating deeper..

the munition itself is a lot more complex than most understand.. its not just a big, heavy charge with a time delay on detonation.. it actually works in phases (very rapid phases) to clear space while its still penetrating and essentially creates a clean tunnel/channel all the way to the actual target... which then can be hit over and over again until the desired depth is reached..

Its got limitations.. but from what I understand the Iranian complexes arent outside the MOP capabilities.. deployed correctly it can get deep enough and they can take out the complex with just one sortie (although if I were a betting man, they'd be flying a 2-4 ship sortie and would be hitting the complex at multiple places to ensure absolute and complete destruction to the point that there is no way to ever repair the facility)..

 

[Altitude sickness]

I wonder exactly what operation or target Israel was hitting during the chaos of people fleeing Tehran.

Trump warned everyone to evacuate. It was obviously to give cover to a larger operation on the ground.

Redirect Notice

 

[Brent in Az]

I wonder if Iran is trying to move the contents of the underground uranium facility to a safer location?
Satellite imagery would confirm that.

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

On a side note as a would be pilot I wish I were......can you imagine piloting the aircraft at the very moment it suddenly became 30,000 pounds lighter with dropping the first bomb? And assuming that if the loaded with two bombs, each at the same distance from the front to back center line of the aircraft, what the increase in torque to the one side would be like?

And then repeat the process some short time later with the dropping of the 2nd? Not too many pilots in this world have experienced that I'd have to guess.