My Studio VS African Studio A Match Up... COSTS

[Dinsdale]

Dennis, sent you a PM here if you could give it a look, Thanks.

Dan

 

[billc]

royal remember I am not the best at getting my point across and don't break it down like you to who I am talking to sometimes. The style question was directed towards dennis not you and he explained it on his last post at what he feels he does. He states his quality is better and I say in his eyes it is and others may think the same. I am saying to my eyes if I was picking I like others better. That is pretty plain and simple I think. Hell he maybe able to give me the plain simple look I like but I go by what I see.

Dennis not sure if prices have changed but the numbers you listed above do not match your online pricelist. Plus I am still going by your older catalog that read a 30% fee on top of shoulder mount for a pedestal mount plus base also. So if your giving more of a discount and a free mount if over 7 animals you may want to look in to that as you could be costing yourself business.

My break down of cost maybe different from coppersmith as mine went through new York. I paid 400 or 450 to clear crate with the lioness and plains game in crate. Had up to 2 weeks to pick up with no storage charge after that there is a fee. It cleared in 7 days.

I really do not care how it priced out as long as your happy with what you have now. It is really that plain and simple but I am once again giving the side this info above maybe not true in each case is all. Don't read anymore into my comments other then my points are meant to help others just like how your post is doing. The point is if guys do there homework get quotes from dennis or any other shop then pick and a place in SA they like. They will see cost difference for themselves and can decide. It is just another step of planning the hunt and can be done before the hunt even starts.

Now here is my break down by what I know using Dennis's catalog and my bill from relive.Hell just on my giraffe by dennis's catalog my mount would cost 7500 for a pedestal mount and then I have the turned neck which would be a custom pose but I will just use the catalog price of 7500. Then I would still have dip/pack ,some type of shipping charge here and backskin tanning cost to. So say maybe 8500 having done here in the states. I have 5500 with shipping and backskin tanned all in and there is 6 plains game animals in that crate to. By my math that is a saving of 3000. Then add the eland pedestal which is in the crate to and I paid 1250 for would be 2000 here in the states. So now my saving is 3750 plus the 300 to 500 hundred I saved on each of these mounts kudu wall ped , zebra ped ,2 blue wildebeest wall ped and blebuck shoulder mount. My saving on just this one crate is around 5000.00.

I have done plenty of figuring when I decided to have mounts done over there. For the most part it is a wash on saving money if you have under 5 animals or certain kind of animals depending on who you use here in the states. You start getting more animals and bigger animals there is savings to be had and up to each person if and when they think it is worth it.

 

[rookhawk]

@billc

Would you mind sharing the discussed work in another thread? I'd love to see what you got for the savings but it wouldn't be polite for me to ask for them here and hijack Royal and Dennis' thread.

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

Dennis @The Artistry of Wildlife / @Royal27 / @billc,

I don't have a side in this. My personal take is that there's not much to be saved by doing your taxidermy "over there" versus at home. Some for sure, but not a lot and in some cases it may cost more. My biggest concern for why I have had my taxidermy in RSA is that I've just read too many dip/pack nightmares where the hides arrived ruined. But that's just my side of this and I say that knowing that many have had no issues with this process.

So after reading this thread and a bunch of numbers which are posted such that they're a bit hard to follow.....well I think there's an easy way to settle this.

@Royal27 apparently submitted his paperwork to Dennis who essentially provided him a bid as if he were doing the work. It is their conclusion that it would cost no more or less for the entire process if Dennis were doing the taxidermy. And this is taxidermy considered by Dennis' peers to be top notch.

@billc, it would appear you disagree with the bottom line conclusion. So Bill if you're willing would you provide the paperwork stating all costs from beginning to end on your last taxidermy done in RSA to Dennis? And Dennis, would you be willing to perform this exercise again using Bill's info?

If you guys are willing to do that, I'd volunteer to put everything into a spreadsheet and put it into PDF format so that anyone on AH can use this information.

 

[accipiter]

• SSI - $1030
• Coppersmith - $500 (assumed)

Wow! $1,030 to clear a crate?
I paid a little over $500 with Flora & Fauna.

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

Wow! $1,030 to clear a crate?
I paid a little over $500 with Flora & Fauna.

It's not all of what SSI does.

 

[harden]

Price list is Al'carte. Quotes are available anytime. Prices are lower for Pedestals now Bill. Same as Shoulder mounts.
They have forms for just about all of them now, no longer have to be custom made.
You do question my work all the time Bill. You keep saying I think it's the best.
I don't give myself the awards for the quality of my work, The Taxidermy Industry does. That's Other taxidermists.
Phil, no problem with the giraffe might be tough, probably not a savings, but I would like to actually see the crating and shipping bill
Looks like a great crate and shipping price.
Bill if you see the new prices Giraffe are 6500.00 open the file on the page your looking at for my prices , your not being accurate or truthful with your posts. Eland 1800 not 2000.

 

[Royal27]

It's not all of what SSI does.

Like Phil says, they do more. They handle from start to finish contacting your outfitter and making sure your trophies are handled and get from outfit to dip and pack or taxidermist, then to final destination. They also bid shipping as well.

An analogy would be using a gun import service. Can you do it yourself? Yes. Can it be less stress to pay someone else to handle and deal with SAPS? Yes.

 

[Royal27]

If you guys are willing to do that, I'd volunteer to put everything into a spreadsheet and put it into PDF format so that anyone on AH can use this information.

I will send you all of the info so it will all be easy Phil. Most is already in a spreadsheet and will just have to add Dennis' cost. I'm sure Bill has the same type info for his work.

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

Price list is Al'carte. Quotes are available anytime. Prices are lower for Pedestals now Bill. Same as Shoulder mounts.
They have forms for just about all of them now, no longer have to be custom made.
You do question my work all the time Bill. You keep saying I think it's the best.
I don't give myself the awards for the quality of my work, The Taxidermy Industry does. That's Other taxidermists.
Phil, no problem with the giraffe might be tough, probably not a savings, but I would like to actually see the crating and shipping bill
Looks like a great crate and shipping price.
Bill if you see the new prices Giraffe are 6500.00 open the file on the page your looking at for my prices , your not being accurate or truthful with your posts. Eland 1800 not 2000.

I ask in the interest of everyone, and the more data we have the better. This is a tough question to answer and I get asked it often. Multiple side by side comparisons would be helpful and something I can direct people to and not just share my own bits of experience. The variables here are difficult for those even with experience to keep track of and easily the one cost that comes all too often as a surprise.

 

[Royal27]

@billc

Would you mind sharing the discussed work in another thread? I'd love to see what you got for the savings but it wouldn't be polite for me to ask for them here and hijack Royal and Dennis' thread.

Actually, I think it would be great to have it all here. No hijack at all. That is the purpose of this thread, to try and do side by side comparisons. I don't think Dennis will mind at all.

 

[rookhawk]

@Royal27 it's your thread so it's your call. That being said, with the banter back and forth it just begs for critiques of people's taxidermy as the gauntlet has been thrown down. Surely this is just about as personal as making fun of somebody's kids physical appearance?

 

[enysse]

I was at work and said the hell with it, I'll check in on AH.

I will say without doing a cost analysis. That when you do mounts on impala, blesbok, waterbuck and kudu.....costs are going to be similar. The quality in my honest opinion will always be better here in the USA. The tanning is just so much better and they know how to finish mounts, the people doing them here in the USA have better tools and talent to do the work. I hope I didn't step on too many feet and toes but it's just the honest truth, I'm a taxidermy critic and have visited some of the better places around the Midwest. I have not stopped at Dennis's place but it's only a day drive from me.
The taxidermy costs are a lot more for the small critters like red duiker, suni, grysbok to get whole mounted in the USA but the quality is so much better. The cats like serval, civets and caracals look life like when done by a world class taxidermist.
And true bad thing about mounting something in Africa, is it can be damaged by the travel over here to the USA. And I will tell you to get an insurance claim on the damage is very hard. A lot of damage has to be done for it to be worth your wild to put a claim in for the damage.
I know the mounts I had done in the USA looks stunning! Some of the one's I had done in Africa look good, I thought the tanning process must have ruined the capes because I know the capes that were dropped off were in excellent condition. And if you look at the fit and finish with a fine eye it's far from perfect.
So if the costs are close, I know which way I'd go........

 

[Royal27]

@Royal27 it's your thread so it's your call. That being said, with the banter back and forth it just begs for critiques of people's taxidermy as the gauntlet has been thrown down. Surely this is just about as personal as making fun of somebody's kids physical appearance?

Like I have said, to me this is about seeing the costs and letting people see some real total cost comparisons. I get that critiques will come into play as an opinion on quality certainly influences what most of us are willing to pay for work.

In my particular case I believed that there was a significant cost difference between US and African taxidermy. I was wrong. Add it all up and the difference just isn't there. The numbers don't lie.

And true bad thing about mounting something in Africa, is it can be damaged by the travel over here to the USA. And I will tell you to get an insurance claim on the damage is very hard. A lot of damage has to be done for it to be worth your wild to put a claim in for the damage

Great point.

 

[harden]

Quality will have to be considered...It's a comparison and the quality of the work DOES have to be considered. We are not comparing apples to apples. It's about the added shipping and undying costs that make Africa Taxidermy not all the deal it has been talked about for years. Those can make your deal not such a deal.....If your willing to compare and only go with the cheapest then quality of the mounts does not matter and that is personal choice, as far as I'm concerned your going to look at your trophies for the rest of your life, that matters,....Royal case is one and only one. NOT all are going to work out to be less or course, it will be about where you hunt in Africa, who does the dip pack, who does the clearing, who does the shipping, what port of entry you use, distance to tannery from port of entry. Lots of factors...This case will not mean your will but I will try for my clients.

 

[K-man]

Quality will have to be considered...It's a comparison and the quality of the work DOES have to be considered. We are not comparing apples to apples. It's about the added shipping and undying costs that make Africa Taxidermy not all the deal it has been talked about for years. Those can make your deal not such a deal.....If your willing to compare and only go with the cheapest then quality of the mounts does not matter and that is personal choice, as far as I'm concerned your going to look at your trophies for the rest of your life, that matters,....Royal case is one and only one. NOT all are going to work out to be less or course, it will be about where you hunt in Africa, who does the dip pack, who does the clearing, who does the shipping, what port of entry you use, distance to tannery from port of entry. Lots of factors...This case will not mean your will but I will try for my clients.

Absolutely quality is a consideration. It is in almost anything from meals to vehicles to hunting. I don't know anyone who doesn't look at the quality of animals when booking a hunt, or the quality of lodging, even down to the quality of the meals. This of course applies to the quality of taxidermy. Some people are just looking for "production" work and if that is your goal then that is fine. Some trophies deserve the extra touch that makes them look alive. Dennis's work is judged by hunters but also his peers.

 

[Ryan]

10 years ago I had my first good talk with a guy who had hunted in RSA and broke down the math how he saw it. He said dip and pack with work done here would initially be less cost but the work here would be more. Everything done there and shipped back had cheaper cost of work but higher shipping costs. In the end it would be approximately equal in cost but the African work would be all done faster. I'd agree and this shows it too. l'm in Alaska so the taxidermists have me over a barrel with charges but shipping adds up even more for completed work from over there. Again, a wash. From my experience tanning and skull mounts are a lot cheaper over there. As for head mount work over there, I have three heads done in Namibia by Hunter's Pride that are two years old that I'm currently looking at. It's good work and holding up fine, equal to the larger more production minded place in Anchorage. The four skulls on plaques are great too. I've seen good work done here and there and I've seen bad done here and there, you have to do your homework.

 

[Dudders]

I hope you don,t mind me asking royal but what is the tanned buffalo scrotum for ?

 

[gizmo]

Guys, I'll tell ya I got the invoice from Denis and it was almost 2k less than what I expected. I was stunned. Denis will treat you right and fair. He's not going to gouge you. As a matter of fact we've been working on how to get all of my non preference taxidermy from my business to him plus he is now my personal taxidermist. You are certainly in good hands with him.

 

[Royal27]

In the end it would be approximately equal in cost but the African work would be all done faster.

This is a great point I'll turn into a question.

@The Artistry of Wildlife , assuming that all trophies made it to D&P on June 1, of last year what is your estimate of when they would have delivered from you? Assume no rush order and that I told you I was in no particular hurry. That's what I did last year and my trophies should be here by end of July give or take.

I hope you don,t mind me asking royal but what is the tanned buffalo scrotum for ?

It seemed like the thing to do at the time!

I'd wanted to get a draw string bag made out of it, but was then told it was too thick and tough to do. So, it will likely end up on a shelf, or perhaps on a plaque of some type.