Multi-rifle advice

[Ray B]

Oh for the days before DB Cooper when we could have our rifles as carry on.

 

[Rell]

I’ve taken a 450-400 or 9.3x74r or 500 on maybe ten trips. I have always brought a 9.3x62 or 375 along as well but have never used the on DG when I have the double.

Now I only bring a double, or it I’ve with it a bunch and get a good little break down travel case.

Don’t overlook PG though, kudu, eland, and bushbuck are really really fun to hunt. Maybe only acknowledge they exist after you take your buff (or better yet two) and the cull ele. But spend any time at the end of a trip, rifle in hand, looking for a spectacular spiral horn!

 

[Nevada Mike]

another reason I don’t own a rifle that doesn’t have quick detach scope mounts. Scopes are always in my carry on. Better than unpressurized in the belly of the plane at subzero temps and 44,000’.

update: I’m informed on large planes, belly is pressurized, but may or may not be heated. I’ve certainly recovered Ice cold baggage in the tropics. Still carry my scopes on the plane with me.

Good idea! having a small case to carry each in is also a good idea, IMO. Would be useful if the scope was removed while hunting.

 

[rookhawk]

Good idea! having a small case to carry each in is also a good idea, IMO. Would be useful if the scope was removed while hunting.

@Nevada Mike The Europeans have done this for almost a century with their claw mount optics. They have a leather case that looks like an old leather bino case. They will pull their scope right off the gun and put it in there at will.

For my purposes, I wrap my scopes in shemaghs to pad them and they are always on my person on the plane. When I get to camp, I rejoin my quick-detach optics to their rifles.

In practice as a client, I hunt dangerous game with optics. The second I take my shot, I'm pulling my scope off and handing it to the first tracker that is over my shoulder. I'm recovering game with iron sights, always. I want to shoot that second shot instinctively during a charge just as if the rifle is a shotgun.

 

[Nevada Mike]

@Nevada Mike The Europeans have done this for almost a century with their claw mount optics. They have a leather case that looks like an old leather bino case. They will pull their scope right off the gun and put it in there at will.

For my purposes, I wrap my scopes in shemaghs to pad them and they are always on my person on the plane. When I get to camp, I rejoin my quick-detach optics to their rifles.

In practice as a client, I hunt dangerous game with optics. The second I take my shot, I'm pulling my scope off and handing it to the first tracker that is over my shoulder. I'm recovering game with iron sights, always. I want to shoot that second shot instinctively during a charge just as if the rifle is a shotgun.

Over the course of my life I have shot, in hunting and at targets, over well over 100,000 rounds (my estimate) with a shotgun. Accordingly, I am much more at home without an optic at any reasonable range. When I was much younger, I shot an iron sighted .22LR target rifle in competition as well. So having a 'naked' rifle in certain situations is somewhat reassuring to me. But for most situations and my older eyes, I now shoot with a scope, usually on QD mounts.

 

[Philip Glass]

I would go with both. After two PG safaris, I am in same status of planning - to go when my job schedule and travelling regulations allow.
The way how I would use these two rifles of yours: 404 scoped, bolt action, use first for acurate first shot. If the situation dicatets to look for (wounded) buff in the bush, switch to double rifle.
In case the hunting area is bush and first close shot is required first rifle to use is double rifle, on open sight.
For DG that you have planned, you have perfect set.

Why do so many of you guys say things in your posts like “where travel regulations allow”?
Southern Africa has been open to hunters for well over a year now and Tanzania longer than that!
Why the continued pessimism here on AH?
There are no travel regulations keeping American hunters from hunting Southern Africa! Indicating otherwise is misinformation and bad for the safari industry.
Regards,
Philip

 

[Philip Glass]

Prior to accessing this site I had little interest in hunting Africa. Now it's not only a possibility, it's a probability- once the travel bans are banned. but I have a question. The rifles that I would be taking are a 470 double (open sights) and/or a 404 J bolt action with 1-4x scope. the game I would want would be a Cape buffalo and possibly a cull elephant. No particular desire for soft skinned game. the areas would be southern Africa depending on which country had the least hassle at the time. So the question is: would those two rifles be redundant or would it be an advantage to take both. the 470 would go for sure- the 404 could stay at home.

You should take the double and a .375 Or .300.
You admit you had no interest in hunting Africa before you found AH yet you are planning a safari and saying you won’t hunt any thin skinned game? I am certain once you set foot on the dark continent your life will change. Your priorities will change and I predict you will want to hunt more than just a Buffalo. Then you will need another gun suitable for the PG you currently don’t desire.
Regards,
Philip

 

[Rell]

Why do so many of you guys say things in your posts like “where travel regulations allow”?
Southern Africa has been open to hunters for well over a year now and Tanzania longer than that!
Why the continued pessimism here on AH?
There are no travel regulations keeping American hunters from hunting Southern Africa! Indicating otherwise is misinformation and bad for the safari industry.
Regards,
Philip

Getting guns into Africa is a royal pain in the posterior. Time, stress, hassle, cost, bribes and charging regs are a massive hurdle! Then there’s ammo rules changing or being changed by idiots all over Africa with no prior warning.

I’ve given guns to 3 of my PHs in Cameroon, Moz and RSA to avoid traveling with them.

It’s not misinformation it’s reality and outfitters and PHs mostly try and put positive spin on it, but it sucks hairy shit covered donkey balls. I still do it once or twice a year but let’s not pretentend it’s handled like a first world country would with uniform regulations and enforcement.

 

[SFRanger7GP]

I guess I have been lucky when traveling with guns to Africa. The biggest harassment I get is from our own CBP agents. Disclaimer: I always use one of the expediter services that specializes in getting your guns through smoothly. Worth every cent to me. If they had it in the US, I would use it here.

Safe travels and Happy Christmas!

 

[Rare Breed]

Prior to accessing this site I had little interest in hunting Africa. Now it's not only a possibility, it's a probability- once the travel bans are banned. but I have a question. The rifles that I would be taking are a 470 double (open sights) and/or a 404 J bolt action with 1-4x scope. the game I would want would be a Cape buffalo and possibly a cull elephant. No particular desire for soft skinned game. the areas would be southern Africa depending on which country had the least hassle at the time. So the question is: would those two rifles be redundant or would it be an advantage to take both. the 470 would go for sure- the 404 could stay at home.

Just my opinion from my first two safaris and soon will be on my third. I wanted and have been rewarded with the experience of taking on this years hunt a Buffalo and 4 PG all with my double all within 50 yards. However on my first safari which was a PG only hunt only a scoped rifle would have worked. I am going on my third hunt going after a second Buffalo and a tuskless elephant. I am taking my 450-400 DR for those two. I also am hunting a bushbuck so am taking my John Rigby 275 for that one. Given you are only hunting the two DG you would only need your 470 in my opinion. Why take the other one if you are not going to hunt PG as well

 

[Rare Breed]

You should take the double and a .375 Or .300.
You admit you had no interest in hunting Africa before you found AH yet you are planning a safari and saying you won’t hunt any thin skinned game? I am certain once you set foot on the dark continent your life will change. Your priorities will change and I predict you will want to hunt more than just a Buffalo. Then you will need another gun suitable for the PG you currently don’t desire.
Regards,
Philip

+1

 

[Neil Molendyk]

You should take the double and a .375 Or .300.
You admit you had no interest in hunting Africa before you found AH yet you are planning a safari and saying you won’t hunt any thin skinned game? I am certain once you set foot on the dark continent your life will change. Your priorities will change and I predict you will want to hunt more than just a Buffalo. Then you will need another gun suitable for the PG you currently don’t desire.
Regards,
Philip

Philip Glass speaks the truth. Words of wisdom and experience. I have travelled that same road

 

[Tanks]

Getting guns into Africa is a royal pain in the posterior. Time, stress, hassle, cost, bribes and charging regs are a massive hurdle! Then there’s ammo rules changing or being changed by idiots all over Africa with no prior warning.

I’ve given guns to 3 of my PHs in Cameroon, Moz and RSA to avoid traveling with them.

It’s not misinformation it’s reality and outfitters and PHs mostly try and put positive spin on it, but it sucks hairy shit covered donkey balls. I still do it once or twice a year but let’s not pretentend it’s handled like a first world country would with uniform regulations and enforcement.

Actually, most of the hassle is on this side as I have to make a trip downtown to get my rifles' 4457s. That is hours including the drive time.

Yes, one has to fill out the paperwork for the airline and the destination country but that takes minutes. I use a travel agent (hello @TRAVEL EXPRESS ) so I don't have to deal with the details.

Depending on the country I will have an expediter to get me through the customs. It was $20 each way at Zimbabwe this past year. Other countries can be $100 or so.

 

[375Fox]

Getting guns into Africa is a royal pain in the posterior. Time, stress, hassle, cost, bribes and charging regs are a massive hurdle! Then there’s ammo rules changing or being changed by idiots all over Africa with no prior warning.

I’ve given guns to 3 of my PHs in Cameroon, Moz and RSA to avoid traveling with them.

It’s not misinformation it’s reality and outfitters and PHs mostly try and put positive spin on it, but it sucks hairy shit covered donkey balls. I still do it once or twice a year but let’s not pretentend it’s handled like a first world country would with uniform regulations and enforcement.

Spreading this about bringing a gun into South Africa is misinformation. Use a travel agent, get a pre-approved rifle permit, and it’s as simple or as difficult as any normal travel will be. There are no massive hurdles to overcome, a couple hundred dollars to ensure your trip goes smoothly yes, but it’s organized and known in advance. Zimbabwe and Namibia are even easier, permits are free and issued on arrival. It’s unfortunate how many people don’t bring their own rifles because they are concerned before they’ve ever tried. Cameroon I’m sure you have a point, but that’s not where the first time hunter afraid to bring his own firearms is going.

 

[Rell]

Spreading this about bringing a gun into South Africa is misinformation. Use a travel agent, get a pre-approved rifle permit, and it’s as simple or as difficult as any normal travel will be. There are no massive hurdles to overcome, a couple hundred dollars to ensure your trip goes smoothly yes, but it’s organized and known in advance. Zimbabwe and Namibia are even easier, permits are free and issued on arrival. It’s unfortunate how many people don’t bring their own rifles because they are concerned before they’ve ever tried. Cameroon I’m sure you have a point, but that’s not where the first time hunter afraid to bring his own firearms is going.

I’ve done 12 safaris in RSA and it’s always been a time waste and hassle even with an agent. Getting the guns cleared in the USA is time consuming and stressful. Picking the guns up in international arrival, signing for them, getting the rest of your baggage, then bringing the guns to the domestic check point, then bringing the guns to the gate in domestic gate area is a giant time consuming hassle. I’ve had to pay bribes more then half the time and someone is always trying to show you down.

Mozambique … come on, an extra hour and an extra $40 and some bullshit with them inspecting baggage for the third time. Done this 4 times and never been hassle free.

Cameroon, you don’t want to know …. 3 hour process and you have to bribe separately the baggage handlers, police, military and customs people. Sucks!

Ethiopia, I’ve only done twice and no one would take a bribe but it took me over two hours each time and that’s with a fixer.

Zimbabwe was actually quite easy, a handful of $5 bills and I was out in 20 minutes.

When I can I now fly with a back pack and small carry on duffle. Guns have been left in my three primary countries and it’s easy and hassle free.

Most of the outfitters I use now have or are building batteries of hood “rental” guns to avoid this. My buddy at Crusader Safari has a half dozen rifles from Hill Country Rifle with Swarovski scopes! If you are going for plains game, this is the way to go. DG …. Yeah I’ll go through the hassle and stress if I’m not hunting with a friends I’ve left guns with in the past.

 

[Red Leg]

Getting guns into Africa is a royal pain in the posterior. Time, stress, hassle, cost, bribes and charging regs are a massive hurdle! Then there’s ammo rules changing or being changed by idiots all over Africa with no prior warning.

I’ve given guns to 3 of my PHs in Cameroon, Moz and RSA to avoid traveling with them.

It’s not misinformation it’s reality and outfitters and PHs mostly try and put positive spin on it, but it sucks hairy shit covered donkey balls. I still do it once or twice a year but let’s not pretentend it’s handled like a first world country would with uniform regulations and enforcement.

Really? You and I have had very different experiences. I have never had issues clearing customs anywhere I have been in Africa. I haven't hunted in South Africa much, but I used an expeditor - painless and fast; every trip to Namibia was totally stress free; and in Mozambique and Zambia my PH and/or outfitter will have everything arranged and we have always breezed right through. I admit I have had luggage misplaced in Johannesburg for several days while in transit, but I plan to keep taking clothes with me as well as my rifles.

I'll admit dragging a rifle to US customs for the 4457 is an inconvenience, but we are usually at the airport anyway picking up family or guests sometime prior to an international hunt. On the other hand, departing and arriving in the US has generally been very easy and stress free. An exception was Washington Dulles.

I do take your approach with respect to hunting Europe. This has nothing to do with traveling with a rifle per se, but those hunts are usually in conjunction with a couple of weeks playing tourist with my bride. Travelling around the Eurozone with riffle or shotgun can cause complications. But Africa? Part of the fun is using just the right rifle.

Glad you didn't get in trouble gifting guns. One of these days, customs will note you left with one and it didn't return. Those export laws can be unforgiving.

 

[Rell]

I had all three rifles imported legally into all three countries. You gifted the guns stateside and then send to a gun shop/expodoter in the destination country. Have your PH get the gun from the store and put on his permit.

I’m way to man pretty to go to jail!