IMPORTANT: Immediate Changes to South African Firearm Registration Guidelines for American Hunters

From where I fly from it adds way too many hours and hassle to connect. Going thru Chicago with a rifle...lucky if it does not end up on the south side for Saturday nite entertainment, not worth to me to deal with Ohare and layover in Doha. I will just deal with SAPS


This is simply not the case. Ohare Chicago is very easy to travel though with rifles. I've done it dozens of times. TSA is familiar with process, emirates is familiar with the process.

As to lay overs, the hub is in Dubai, not Doha, Qatar. Dubai airport is the safest, most affluent, most beautiful airport in the world.

Lastly, emirates takes rifle handling seriously. There are people at the gate waiting for you. When you try to board they say "Mr. x is boarding the plane, you are authorized to load his rifles on the plane". They reply back 30 seconds later "done" and they then let you board. That's how they roll in Dubai. You will not lose your rifles connecting in Dubai.

The real benefit is avoiding SAPS if trying to land at a different ultimate destination.
 
Not really correct. A receipt would do it as well. And so would an older 4457. It doesn't need to be issued right before the trip.

And if it was truly to check proof of ownership why isn't the 4457 checked physically anytime an American enters the country?


Thanks Dave!

I wasn't trying to put you on the spot, but you're the most connected outfitter I know when it comes to PHASA.

And I agree on involvement. You have to work to change what you don't like! :)

No worries . Apologies if it came out too strong. We're on it. But trying to deal with incompetence is difficult
 
No worries . Apologies if it came out too strong. We're on it. But trying to deal with incompetence is difficult

Totally understand. :)

And I deleted the first part of my response but you were too fast. I had typed it this morning , then decided it didn't matter and didn't post. Then, posted and n accident when I responded to you. Oops!
 
Robert the South African government needs proof of ownership that you are really the owner of said firearm. Because USA citizens are in the lucky position of not having a license for every rifle they own the only way USA citizens can prove ownership is with the 4457 Customs form.
Hope it helps.
Sincerely
Hans de Klerk

Good Day Hans,
You are correct that 4457 represents ownership. There is absolutely no dispute there.
My point is to bring awareness and understanding to address the issue of an expiration date of a US government form. We have re-confirmed with US Customs Border Patrol that both dates on the 4457 (as is also with other government documents) merely is an emblem of review and compliance of the document itself. The 4457 has not changed in substance or this would be a different conversation.
Please note that the OMB No. 1651-0010 (above the date of expiration) and the CBP Form 4457 (6/92) on the bottom right of the form has not changed at all. Perhaps CBP needs to do a better job to clarify but as of today, there is nothing published for change in the CBP process of utilizing the same 4457 that has been stamped and used for decades (unless ownership of a firearm has changed and needs updating).
The fact that South Africa SAPS is no longer accepting the 4457 that has an expired date is the issue born most likely out of not understanding it's meaning and it is fueling the fire on hunters by making things more difficult to comply with....why?
The fact is that the 4457 is a valid document for as long as the firemarm(s) is owned by the barer of that document. I offer a copy of my very own 4457, expiry date 2009, stamped by CBP in 2014. So, if the form is valid with our government, why is SAPS not satisfied?
I am escalating this issue because it is an undue burden on the hunter to now have to drag their fireams back to the airport (which is in many cases quite far) to appease SAPS in getting a new 4457 when the old one is still valid and used by other countries. You can see the declining trend with hunters to RSA especially this year Perhaps you can help by escalating this from your side. We are trying make it easier for hunters to come to South Africa to enjoy the experience without the hassle.

Best
Robert
4457.jpeg
 
I also agree, whatever we can do to help change the situation by getting involved and urging organizations such as SCI, DSC, NRA etc to work with SA authorities to fix the situation is the only way we will see change.
Has anyone ever had a Customs official check their firearms serial numbers against the stolen guns database when getting a 4457? I can't say that I recall them doing that.
I went last week and both my rifles were checked against the stolen database
 
Simplify the process.....SAPS accept the 4457 regardless of issue date to expiration as long as serial number coincide with the actual firearm and the name of the owner matches the 520 and passport. Now a simple explanation from customs to SAPS upper beauracracy regarding the details in question that the dates of issue and expiration are no consequence to them, but for convenience of our OMB. Now who do we know that can get this started. First step would be SA consolate in Washngton DC. A simple fix.
 
I am going to a CIC USA delegation meeting in NYC. tomorrow, I know The NRA and SCI will be there.
I will bring this up and with some luck, they will get off there AZZ and do something......
 
SCI update 3/27/17

ALERT UPDATE: South Africa Will Accept Form 4457s Without Expiration Dates Only If They Are Issued in 2017

SCI has been informed by the Professional Hunters Association of South Africa (PHASA) that the South African Police Service will accept U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) Form 4457s without expiration dates only if they are issued in 2017.

Last week, we alerted you that PHASA had notified us that the South African Police Service’s Central Firearms Desk had announced that they would no longer accept United States Department of Homeland Security Certificates of Registration, commonly known as CBP Form 4457s, if the date in the top right hand corner of the form had expired.

SCI received many questions from members who are in possession of Form 4457s that have no expiration dates. SCI learned that CBP has been issuing at least two different types of Form 4457s. At local offices (e.g., in airports), CBP officials have been issuing Form 4457s without expiration dates, but the Form 4457s downloadable from the CBP website bear an expiration date in the upper right hand corner.

SCI’s Hunter Advocacy Department contacted PHASA for clarification about how South Africa would treat Form 4457s that have no expiration date. PHASA advised us that the South African Central Firearms Control Register will only accept Form 4457s without an expiration date if the form was stamped in 2017.

PHASA acknowledged that South Africa has previously accepted forms without an expiration date and stamped prior to 2017. However, PHASA’s communication with the Central Firearms Control Register confirms that, effective immediately, South Africa will no longer accept those forms.

Many SCI members have correctly notified us that CBP has allowed those traveling with firearms to use the same Form 4457 on multiple occasions. However, South Africa is not bound by U.S. practices and has the ability to apply rules and restrictions that are different than those imposed by the U.S.

The new Form 4457 can be found online here. SCI members with questions about the process for obtaining a valid Form 4457 should contact the Customs and Border Protection Information Center directly. The CBP Info Center is open Monday-Friday between 9 a.m. and 4 p.m. Eastern time. You can ask your question via email or by calling (877) 227-5511. If you are outside the U.S., you must call 1 (202) 325-8000.

Those needing additional assistance may contact SCI’s Office of Hunter Advocacy at (202) 543-8733 or may email hunteradvocacy@safariclub.org.

SCI also encourages members to defer to PHASA’s recommendations and their travel protocols when hunting in South Africa. PHASA recommends hunting clients pre-apply, through a reputable, registered meet-and-greet agency, for temporary import/export of firearms and/or transit permits.

SCI recognizes that this new information from South Africa poses new obligations for hunters who wish to travel with their firearms. SCI will continue to work on this issue to independently confirm this new information from South Africa and to hopefully find ways to lessen the burden on U.S. hunters planning travel to South Africa.
 

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HELLO....... WHAT CHANGED.......

SO WHAT HAPPENS IN 2018 ????????
NEW 4457 ???????
 
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Robert, thank you for your efforts on our behalf.
And yeah, I'm guessing new 4457's in 2018 unless something is changed.
Best of health.
 
Robert, thank you for your efforts on our behalf.
And yeah, I'm guessing new 4457's in 2018 unless something is changed.
Best of health.
Thank you....it ain't over till it's over.......
 
It's almost as if there is a "screw the white outfitter/farmer" protocol being driven by some members of the ANC. These regressives feel the whites are making too much money, they don't like it and they'll do whatever it takes to ruin their industry. Ironic it hurts a larger number of non whites than whites.
 
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I returned home Friday from Zim via jnb. For my overnight in joberg I had to get SAPS and took invite letter and 4457. On entry back home in Atlanta just 4457. I didn't notice any changes or anything additional.
 
I returned home Friday from Zim via jnb. For my overnight in joberg I had to get SAPS and took invite letter and 4457. On entry back home in Atlanta just 4457. I didn't notice any changes or anything additional.

@Hmaxwell ,

Welcome to the forum!

Did SAPS look at your 4457 at all? Curious as of they didn't it seems to support my theory that they are only checking on a pre-approval, unless of course you already had a pre-approval.
 
I didn't have preapproval just paperwork in hand. I gave them a copy of my invite letter and a copy of 4457. The lady processed it, the gun showed up, checked serial # and was on my way.
 
The 4457 I used this past couple of weeks was like the top one Robert showed and was from 2015. No expiration date on it.
 
Robert the South African government needs proof of ownership that you are really the owner of said firearm. Because USA citizens are in the lucky position of not having a license for every rifle they own the only way USA citizens can prove ownership is with the 4457 Customs form.
Hope it helps.
Sincerely
Hans de Klerk
My question to that would be why would the SAPS folks really care who the actual owner of the firearm is, what's it to them? Are they going to call our CBP guys to see if the form is not dummied up? I can download the forms from the net, fill it all in, sign and make some little red stamp to make it look official. Who at the SAPS desk is going to know the difference or care? Just a thought.
 
My question to that would be why would the SAPS folks really care who the actual owner of the firearm is, what's it to them? Are they going to call our CBP guys to see if the form is not dummied up? I can download the forms from the net, fill it all in, sign and make some little red stamp to make it look official. Who at the SAPS desk is going to know the difference or care? Just a thought.

One word.

Bureaucracy
 

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