Im done with steel shot

[jduckhunter]

Interesting. By slam do you mean all North American species? Curious what would be unique to Florida. I think I have taken everything except the black bellied whistling duck (though could illegally shoot one here at the place nearly every spring.)

I will never go back to steel. Tungsten or Hevi-shot #2 or #4 are deadly on geese and #6 is perfect for ducks. Both far outperform any steel design. In fact, both significantly out perform lead. And I will never trade those lovely full patterns for the gaping holes produced by the large steel shot used on geese.

View attachment 510902

Yes, all North American ducks and geese. I need a Black Belly tree duck and a Fulvous Whistling duck Than I will have all 41 species on the list.

 

[sureshot375]

TSS is worth every penny. I was hammering ducks and geese with 1oz #8 from apex ammo.

 

[woods0824]

The copper plated bismuth from Boss are worth a look as well. Prices are reasonable and it's real step up in performance from steel, though if shots are expected over the decoys I'll still shoot Kent faststeel

 

[Pheroze]

I have recently switched to Kent Bismuth loads. 2 3/4" #4s.

The 3" version is my favourite load. I started by using up some steel BB last week but Kent bismuth is noticeably more effective on geese. Very quickly I found I couldn't make myself load the steel I have left anymore. Using steel has zero appeal for me now.

 

[chase0109]

I completely agree! I do more pheasant then waterfall hunting. But I switched over to boss #5 this season for pheasant with amazing results. Much better penetration and cleaner kills. Was shooting #3 Prairie storm steel prior.
Personally, I’m not a fan of the high velocity steel.

I’ve switched over to bosses 3/5 combo for my snow goose hunting as well. Copper plated bismuth. A little bit more expensive, but way cheaper than TSS. I save that just for turkeys.
Chase

 

[BeeMaa]

I'm not trying to shoot that much farther, I just want what I hit to fold up and not take 3 shots to kill. I think the cost per round evens out if you get clean kills with tss vs taking a few rounds per duck or goose with steel

My experience has been increased distance and fewer shot used with TSS. This is where the savings comes from...fewer shots. I also carry a box of steel shot in the event I need finishing shots.

I did a conservation season goose hunt in SEP 2022 with a friend of mine in NY and did a reasonable job of documenting my findings in the link below. The action picks towards the end of the first page.

https://www.africahunting.com/threads/usa-early-season-fall-goose-hunt-in-ny.70719/

For this particular hunt there were no wounded geese and I consider that an exceptional hunt. In one instance, our shots were taken at 70 yards (verified with a laser rangefinder) at them sitting on the water. For passing shots, I believe the longest was 40 yards. My friend (called IGS) is experimenting with using a SKEET choke for ducks because shot are rarely over 40 yards and he's knocking down the fast movers easily at that distance. He's going to Arkansas for a waterfowl hunt (I believe it's for duck, but could include geese as well) in a couple of weeks.

I'm seriously considering moving from the Federal Black Cloud TSS to the Apex (all TSS) Waterfowl ammo. Using 9 shot for ducks and 7 for geese. For now I'll shoot up what I have and share a box with other hunters so I can watch their faces as the birds drop from the sky like they've never seen before.

TSS will not make you a better shot. What it will do is make your good shots count. Get out and practice at a local clays range and pattern your shotgun with the load/choke combo you plan on using. This will build the confidence you need in your skills and your equipment.

I'm using a Benelli SBE3 and using a Carlson's Black Cloud Long Range (FULL) choke for most of the shooting but I have used a Carlson’s TSS Turkey (TKY) choke to extend the range. Here is an example of a pattern...

 

[503]

My experience has been increased distance and fewer shot used with TSS. This is where the savings comes from...fewer shots. I also carry a box of steel shot in the event I need finishing shots.

I did a conservation season goose hunt in SEP 2022 with a friend of mine in NY and did a reasonable job of documenting my findings in the link below. The action picks towards the end of the first page.

https://www.africahunting.com/threads/usa-early-season-fall-goose-hunt-in-ny.70719/

For this particular hunt there were no wounded geese and I consider that an exceptional hunt. In one instance, our shots were taken at 70 yards (verified with a laser rangefinder) at them sitting on the water. For passing shots, I believe the longest was 40 yards. My friend (called IGS) is experimenting with using a SKEET choke for ducks because shot are rarely over 40 yards and he's knocking down the fast movers easily at that distance. He's going to Arkansas for a waterfowl hunt (I believe it's for duck, but could include geese as well) in a couple of weeks.

I'm seriously considering moving from the Federal Black Cloud TSS to the Apex (all TSS) Waterfowl ammo. Using 9 shot for ducks and 7 for geese. For now I'll shoot up what I have and share a box with other hunters so I can watch their faces as the birds drop from the sky like they've never seen before.

TSS will not make you a better shot. What it will do is make your good shots count. Get out and practice at a local clays range and pattern your shotgun with the load/choke combo you plan on using. This will build the confidence you need in your skills and your equipment.

I'm using a Benelli SBE3 and using a Carlson's Black Cloud Long Range (FULL) choke for most of the shooting but I have used a Carlson’s TSS Turkey (TKY) choke to extend the range. Here is an example of a pattern...
View attachment 511035

Thank you for doing those tests. Does the federal black cloud pattern well for you?

 

[BeeMaa]

Thank you for doing those tests. Does the federal black cloud pattern well for you?

Yes it does but I didn’t take any pictures of it. I feel confident in the BB&7 load on goose (and 3&9 for duck) to 50 yards with a FULL choke.

Passing shots at 40 yards with MOD should have the same results.

My friend will be checking in with his results using a SKT choke in a few weeks.

 

[503]

Yes it does but I didn’t take any pictures of it. I feel confident in the BB&7 load on goose (and 3&9 for duck) to 50 yards with a FULL choke.

Passing shots at 40 yards with MOD should have the same results.

My friend will be checking in with his results using a SKT choke in a few weeks.

Do you find that tungsten likes to be choked down harder?

 

[Pheroze]

Do you find that tungsten likes to be choked down harder?

I used a modified with Kent Bismuth and dropped cleanly the large Canadas that I shot at. However, I bet a full choke this late in the season would have allowed more shots. I passed on a lot of long shots because I had a modified in. I have read that both bismuth and tungsten benefit from tighter chokes.

 

[Mr. 16 gauge]

As someone else has stated, higher velocity steel loads kill better.........we shot a mallard once 13 TIMES after it hit the water and the bird still kept swimming; when we paddled the canoe out to get it, when we got the bird in the boat, and shook it, all you heard were pellets that fell out of it's feathers hitting the bottom of the canoe.
After that, I started looking into reloading steel........I've settled on a handload of 1 oz of #3 steel in a 2 3/4" hull chronys out to 1480 fps. It kills cleanly out to 40-45 yards. This is my "go to" waterfowl load when I am hunting ducks specifically.
Having said that, I am doing more shooting (hunting) with bismuth handloads.....reason being some of the areas that I hunt have ponds that might have a wood duck or mallard loafing on them; if I'm out hunting grouse, and flush a duck, I am perfectly legal to take that bird. The other is a lot of areas are requiring the use of nontoxic shot for ALL hunting, for various reasons (protecting predatory species from lead ingestion, area being managed primarily for waterfowl, etc). A couple of pheasant preserves that I hunt are now requiring nontoxic shot only.......they are concerned about possible EPA problems because of the amount of lead thrown out during their tower shoots.
There are advantages to me using bismuth.......I can reload it in 12, 16, and 20 gauge using regular wads and powders (no 'special' powder, like Alliant STEEL needed, nor thicker plastic wads), I can use it in my muzzleloading shotguns, and I don't need to worry about barrel damage in my guns with thinner barrels, such as my doubles and my Ithaca M37.
With steel, I've found that I needed to go up two shot sizes larger than what I used with lead, and with bismuth, it's one size larger...........I use #6 for most of my upland work, and #4 or #5 for pheasants and waterfowl. For geese, it's #2 or BB.
I've also reloaded and shot birds with tungsten loads.........they kill great, esp. at a distance. But as someone has stated already, do you want a "shoot" or do you want a "hunt"? Hitting birds and watching them sail away to some other unit, the refuge, or somewhere where they can't be retrieved is wasteful and distasteful! Bring 'em in close and shoot 'em in the lips!
One last observation: I don't know what loads the OP was using, but not all steel shotshells are created equal. Before I reloaded steel, I used winchester supremes, 3" shell with 1 1/8 oz of copper plated #2 shot.....and they killed well. The shells I was using in the first part of this post were some that we picked up at Kmart and were just "standard" steel shot loads. At the managed area I hunt a few years back, I found some shells that had dropped out of the pocket of somebody at the boat launch. The brass on the hulls was shiny, so they were just recently lost. They were a mix of a couple of better known manufacturers, and when I cut them open, the shot on the inside was coated with a thin layer of rust, and the powder was damp and caked together. Also, a good percentage of the pellets were not round, but oval and oblong, and appeared to be of various sizes and not uniform at all...........it looked as if the company swept up the rejects and loaded them into a hull!
I guess it's true.........you get what you pay for!
Just my experience and 2 cents.............sorry for the long post.

 

[BWH]

Avid duck hunter here…… I exclusively use BOSS shells and have for several years.before they became all the rage. They simply work. They probably cost 2x the price of the cheap crap off the shelf. However, your kill shots/body count will increase by at least 2x. Well worth it in grand scheme of things. I mean really any extra $10-20 a box????

 

[503]

I've used Kent fasteel, dryloks, hevi steel, fiocchi, blue box etc. Pretty much all of it. Some are bettwr than others but all steel has its limitations. I'd rather spend a few extra bucks and know that if I don't get a bird its my fault, not because of the ammo

 

[Hyde Hunter]

Yes I am TSS fan also. That said you might try Bismuth. The cost is better than TSS and it hits like the lead of old. I am currently using both Bismuth and TSS depending on the hunting

I agree with you Bismuth is the way to go it is better than lead and cheaper than TSS

 

[BeeMaa]

Do you find that tungsten likes to be choked down harder?

I don't think it likes to be choked more, but the smaller pellets make it easier to do so with a more even pattern.

Like most shotgunning, it depends on what you are trying to do. Fast moving passing shots at less than 40 yards...SKT choke. Sitting still at 60 yards...TKY or FULL choke. Between that...MOD choke.

I will take at least 3 chokes with me into the field and adjust my choke for the conditions. I normally start out with my FULL choke and take a MOD and SKT with me. Most of my days at the clays range is spent with the FULL choke in so I can get better at determining leads and break clays more consistently.

One thing I do know is that of all the birds we (myself and IGS) have downed, we are yet to recover a TSS pellet. All have been passing through. No "crunch" in the meat, despite a few pellets that did hit the breasts. The density and speed at which they hit combined with the fact that they are smaller (than typically used steel or bismuth) accounting for these results.

 

[503]

I don't think it likes to be choked more, but the smaller pellets make it easier to do so with a more even pattern.

Like most shotgunning, it depends on what you are trying to do. Fast moving passing shots at less than 40 yards...SKT choke. Sitting still at 60 yards...TKY or FULL choke. Between that...MOD choke.

I will take at least 3 chokes with me into the field and adjust my choke for the conditions. I normally start out with my FULL choke and take a MOD and SKT with me. Most of my days at the clays range is spent with the FULL choke in so I can get better at determining leads and break clays more consistently.

One thing I do know is that of all the birds we (myself and IGS) have downed, we are yet to recover a TSS pellet. All have been passing through. No "crunch" in the meat, despite a few pellets that did hit the breasts. The density and speed at which they hit combined with the fact that they are smaller (than typically used steel or bismuth) accounting for these results.

Thats awesome, I can't wait for next season.... in the mean time I'll try a few on crows and see how far out I can get one. That's my practice since I don't get to the skeet range often. I usually don't change chokes in the field, I pattern and see how shells look at different ranges and shoot accordingly. Or I'll bring another gun if I'm in a blind with a different choke or shell for closer or longer range

 

[BeeMaa]

Thats awesome, I can't wait for next season.... in the mean time I'll try a few on crows and see how far out I can get one. That's my practice since I don't get to the skeet range often. I usually don't change chokes in the field, I pattern and see how shells look at different ranges and shoot accordingly. Or I'll bring another gun if I'm in a blind with a different choke or shell for closer or longer range

My experience with using two shotguns...

On my goose hunt I planned on using my Benelli SBE3 and Browning Cynergy (camo over/under 3.5" chambers) while we were in a blind. The SBE3 was going to be for longer shots with a FULL choke and the Browning would have a MOD over/SKT under (shooting bottom barrel first). Reality...the Browning never left the vault and I used the SBE3 for everything with a few different chokes depending on the set up. It was a good plan, but it just didn't work out.

The Browning Cynergy has been relegated to loaner duty when IGS, my Dad or a friend comes by and we want to hit the clays range. I don't shoot it very well because the gun fit is off for me. I'm considering selling it but not sure yet. BTW - IGS, my Dad and the couple of friends who have used it, absolutely love it. Just not my cup of tea.

 

[503]

My experience with using two shotguns...

On my goose hunt I planned on using my Benelli SBE3 and Browning Cynergy (camo over/under 3.5" chambers) while we were in a blind. The SBE3 was going to be for longer shots with a FULL choke and the Browning would have a MOD over/SKT under (shooting bottom barrel first). Reality...the Browning never left the vault and I used the SBE3 for everything with a few different chokes depending on the set up. It was a good plan, but it just didn't work out.

The Browning Cynergy has been relegated to loaner duty when IGS, my Dad or a friend comes by and we want to hit the clays range. I don't shoot it very well because the gun fit is off for me. I'm considering selling it but not sure yet. BTW - IGS, my Dad and the couple of friends who have used it, absolutely love it. Just not my cup of tea.

Sell it to one of them and get another SBE, runa dif choke and you're all set

 

[BeeMaa]

Sell it to one of them and get another SBE, runa dif choke and you're all set

You looking for a goose/duck O/U?

 

[gizmo]

For ducks and geese I have been using Boss #3/5 mix for the last 2 years. It’s devastating. I’ve shot a few cases of it now and my kill rates have gone up significantly. I’ve even killed several cranes over decoys with it. They did a seasonal run of #1’s of which I got a hold of some. My son and I played clean up on several crane hunts this year and were absolutely dumping them at 70 yards. I really really like it. I’m down to my last little bit for this season. I’ve got a hunt tomorrow and two more before duck season ends. I have a conservation order snow goose hunt in Ark next month which I will likely be out by then. I’m going to have to order more soon.