Hunting 14' Crocs In South Africa?

[Hunt anything]

The classic charade that was often sold to clients before the import Nazis took over, was the lion that had "come over" from Botswana and was causing regrettable havoc among the locals. For a suitable fee, the client could seize this once in a blue moon opportunity to take this "wild" nuisance lion.

And it is beyond extremely unlikely that a 14 foot croc is going to mysteriously appear in a stock tank in the middle of the Limpopo - about like me seeing one this morning out back in the San Gabriel.

Big lizards can show up anywhere at anytime, the half acre stock pond behind my house had an 11 or 12 foot alligator in it for about a week last summer and I live 2 miles from the magnolia river and about a mile from mobile bay. People often post pictures of alligators on a walk about in the fields so they travel more than many people think. And before anyone says I exaggerated the size I worked with a nuisance alligator trapper in the late 90’s and got fairly good at judging them.

 

[Red Leg]

Big lizards can show up anywhere at anytime, the half acre stock pond behind my house had an 11 or 12 foot alligator in it for about a week last summer and I live 2 miles from the magnolia river and about a mile from mobile bay. People often post pictures of alligators on a walk about in the fields so they travel more than many people think. And before anyone says I exaggerated the size I worked with a nuisance alligator trapper in the late 90’s and got fairly good at judging them.

Actually no they can't.

Yes, they can move between ponds/marshes etc in their natural environment. But they can't and don't show up "anywhere at anytime." For instance, you will not find one in high desert brush country twenty miles from the nearest water -much less fifty or sixty. The same is true of an alligator. I should note that I grew up in south Louisiana and live in Texas. I doubt if you can tell me much about gators that I don't also know. I also have been around the 5800 square miles of the Limpopo province just a bit. A whole bunch of it is a very long way from the Limpopo River - particularly from a croc's perspective. And the Limpopo is hardly the only Province where these pesky lizards are found occupying stock tanks available to be "hunted."

A croc in a stock tank in 99% of South African game ranches that would have one (not the river by the same name and not a ranch with an open Limpopo riverine bank) did not get there by taking a walk about. It would be the same as finding a gator sunning himself at a tank on a high fence Hill Country game farm. Yes, we have gators in Texas, but none can or would hoof it to such a location.

Fortunately, most operators in South Africa run an honest business. However, over the years more than one client has been offered to take a "problem" hippo or croc from a tank (pond) a long long way from any natural habitat.

 

[revturbo9967]

The wealth of knowledge on this forum, being from good and bad experiences is what makes this place a priceless tool in the safari planning stage.

 

[Philip Glass]

Kevin you are correct of course. The problem i have is all the lies trying to claim it is something (real wild hunting) that it is not. Nothing at all wrong with put and take if that is what the client signed up for. But when it is sold as a real wild hunt, and then dearly defended as such.... that is too much for me to take. I honestly think some Outfitters, PH's and even clients are so far into their own BS that they cannot even recognize the truth anymore.

I agree Bob. I feel sorry for the guy who just Doesn’t know what he is getting.

 

[Hunt anything]

Actually no they can't.

Yes, they can move between ponds/marshes etc in their natural environment. But they can't and don't show up "anywhere at anytime." For instance, you will not find one in high desert brush country twenty miles from the nearest water -much less fifty or sixty. The same is true of an alligator. I should note that I grew up in south Louisiana and live in Texas. I doubt if you can tell me much about gators that I don't also know. I also have been around the 5800 square miles of the Limpopo province just a bit. A whole bunch of it is a very long way from the Limpopo River - particularly from a croc's perspective. And the Limpopo is hardly the only Province where these pesky lizards are found occupying stock tanks available to be "hunted."

A croc in a stock tank in 99% of South African game ranches that would have one (not the river by the same name and not a ranch with an open Limpopo riverine bank) did not get there by taking a walk about. It would be the same as finding a gator sunning himself at a tank on a high fence Hill Country game farm. Yes, we have gators in Texas, but none can or would hoof it to such a location.

Fortunately, most operators in South Africa run an honest business. However, over the years more than one client has been offered to take a "problem" hippo or croc from a tank (pond) a long long way from any natural habitat.

Sorry I wasn’t saying an alligator or croc would show up in the middle of the kalahari but they will show up anyplace within their natural range.

 

[Zambezi]

If you want a wild croc surely your first question to ask is "will I be shooting this croc next to a river/lake or a pond?"

99% of the time wild crocs are in rivers or lakes. If you are hunting a croc in a pond then you haven't done your due diligence or you are being shafted. Make sure you ask the right questions and get clear answers!

Also check out the range where this species is generally found. If you are being offered a 14+ foot croc in the cold areas of the Western Cape then you have to be listening to your internal warning bells.

 

[Red Leg]

Sorry I wasn’t saying an alligator or croc would show up in the middle of the kalahari but they will show up anyplace within their natural range.

And I didn't say a thing about the Kalahari did? My point is the vast majority of the Limpopo Province is not part of a crocodile's "natural range." If a client is being offered an opportunity to take one in the on a game farm in an impoundment he can be sure it was stocked there to be "hunted."

That is true of lots of game animals on game farms and game ranches - so no harm, no foul. So long as it is not represented as something it isn't.

 

[Hunt anything]

Red Leg I agree my point was only that animals travel, we even had a sperm whale show up in Mobile bay last summer,

 

[MarkB]

As the hunter from 8000km away one must put trust in an outfitter when booking. If I ask in writing about the croc hunt, specifically will we hunting on a river, placing bait and use a blind (as on TV), stalking during warm hrs for crocs sunning, then plan stalk when found? Answer in writing= yes all those hunt styles will be used. Answer is not really BS, but leads hunters to think croc is not in a 20 acre pond inside a DG fence miles from natural water. The pond/dam never even entered my mind as a question as we saw many crocs in oxbow puddles off rivers in Zim. My mistake=I left out the question, is the croc from a farm? That will now be one of my first questions for every future SA hunt.

In the end I got the size croc I wanted, just hunted somewhat in a manner I did not expect or really want. Seeing the other 6 croc skins in the salt shed drove that nagging question to a confirmation.

For me I want honesty in my answers, don't care how hard the answer will be, then I decide if I can proceed. That's all.

Now my dilemma is when I see others on here posting their questions and I see a response I know is pure BS what do/should I do? Don't want any pissing contest at same time I do think all hunters booking deserve the truth.

MB

 

[ActionBob]

As the hunter from 8000km away one must put trust in an outfitter when booking. If I ask in writing about the croc hunt, specifically will we hunting on a river, placing bait and use a blind (as on TV), stalking during warm hrs for crocs sunning, then plan stalk when found? Answer in writing= yes all those hunt styles will be used. Answer is not really BS, but leads hunters to think croc is not in a 20 acre pond inside a DG fence miles from natural water. The pond/dam never even entered my mind as a question as we saw many crocs in oxbow puddles off rivers in Zim. My mistake=I left out the question, is the croc from a farm? That will now be one of my first questions for every future SA hunt.

In the end I got the size croc I wanted, just hunted somewhat in a manner I did not expect or really want. Seeing the other 6 croc skins in the salt shed drove that nagging question to a confirmation.

For me I want honesty in my answers, don't care how hard the answer will be, then I decide if I can proceed. That's all.

Now my dilemma is when I see others on here posting their questions and I see a response I know is pure BS what do/should I do? Don't want any pissing contest at same time I do think all hunters booking deserve the truth.

MB

Pretty much how my lion hunt went down. Although I probably asked more questions.

I love a lot of things about RSA. Quality of camps and even roads tends to be very good. Many non hunting things to do, easily accessed and low cost. I have driven myself on 3 different side trips and hundreds of miles each. English is widely spoken. Services such as gas stations, hotels, shopping, PUBLIC RESTROOMS @Just Gina all readily available, especially compared to other African countries.

I love hunting the little critters and night critters in RSA. However I have evolved to having a strong preference to hunt larger and especially Dangerous game elsewhere, primarily because of the general high level of BS.

 

[MarkB]

Your lion fiasco would leave me jaded I am sure. My lion hunt was exactly how stated, CBL and costed accordingly. But I was fully aware before sending deposit on what it was and OK with that. I want same from all hunts=honesty.

Yes all buffalo I have hunted or seen were spooky, cunning and great hunts. In SA they approached the truck looking for bananas on many properties we hunted. Eye opening, no Buff hunting in SA for me, sort of feel bad for the hunters who hunted buff on those same properties. Yet I must complete big 5 with a SA dart rhino hunt. Again I know before the hunt, that's all I ask.

MB

 

[Bos en Dal SAFARIS]

It hurts reading these type of posts, but i guess that is what humanity has come to!!! Yes you can get 14' crocs in SA and yes you do get wild croc hunts in SA as well. But there are a few individuals that keeps on F$$ng up our industry. Honesty takes one far in the world. Yes i have had clients not book croc or lion hunts with me because they did not like what i told them, but i have always told them the truth. Thats why i believe every hunter ever hunted lion, croc or any other species with us have been "happy" with the hunt coz they knew what they were getting. Unfortunatley there are individuals out there that will tell you what you want to hear in order to seal the deal, and then on the hunt they paint this picture for you of a wild hunt.
I guess it comes down to references, ask for details of people that has done a similar hunt with the operator you are looking into hunting with to get 3rd party opinions. Sorry for those that fell victim to this, and i just pray that these type of stories will end and that it is not our industry in SA that comes to an end due to this

My personal best
Gerrit

 

[ActionBob]

Your lion fiasco would leave me jaded I am sure. My lion hunt was exactly how stated, CBL and costed accordingly. But I was fully aware before sending deposit on what it was and OK with that. I want same from all hunts=honesty.

Yes all buffalo I have hunted or seen were spooky, cunning and great hunts. In SA they approached the truck looking for bananas on many properties we hunted. Eye opening, no Buff hunting in SA for me, sort of feel bad for the hunters who hunted buff on those same properties. Yet I must complete big 5 with a SA dart rhino hunt. Again I know before the hunt, that's all I ask.

MB

Fortunately I have been blessed and took another lion in Tanzania As well as buffalo and took a buffalo in Zim 2 days after my elephant. Great hunts in truly wild circumstances. Aa was my Mozambique leopard. The rhino is what it is and I shopped hard for the best situation I could find in that. With a written clause that I could back out for day fees only if I felt it was not up to par.

 

[ActionBob]

It hurts reading these type of posts, but i guess that is what humanity has come to!!! Yes you can get 14' crocs in SA and yes you do get wild croc hunts in SA as well. But there are a few individuals that keeps on F$$ng up our industry. Honesty takes one far in the world. Yes i have had clients not book croc or lion hunts with me because they did not like what i told them, but i have always told them the truth. Thats why i believe every hunter ever hunted lion, croc or any other species with us have been "happy" with the hunt coz they knew what they were getting. Unfortunatley there are individuals out there that will tell you what you want to hear in order to seal the deal, and then on the hunt they paint this picture for you of a wild hunt.
I guess it comes down to references, ask for details of people that has done a similar hunt with the operator you are looking into hunting with to get 3rd party opinions. Sorry for those that fell victim to this, and i just pray that these type of stories will end and that it is not our industry in SA that comes to an end due to this

My personal best
Gerrit

Stay the course Gettit! Honesty and good business comes home to roost eventually. As does the opposite.

The problem with references is that a lot of hunting clients want to believe, or just keep their eyes shut. One clients idea of a great hunt may be a disappointment or a sham to another.

I have nothing against the guys who are happy with put and take... facing facts, a large portion of people prefer it. It's easy, lower cost, fits short timetables, comfortable and safer. Simifies travel and lesses any misery from getting there. Personally I like the sense of accomplishment, as long as I am able. Sometimes even if I'm really not the most able On my mountain goat hunt, it went from physically exhausting, to mentally clawing my way up those rocks, to a religious type belief i was going to do it. It was similar at least one or two days of my elephant hunt. When I tried to describe that, some guys reply they are sorry it was so rough. Others get it that the challenge makes it so extra special and rewarding. At least when it is real.....

 

[WAB]

OK, I’m going to ask the dumb question, if you want a 14’ croc why would you hunt it in South Africa? If you want a chance at a big ele you go to Bots or a few spots in Zim. If you want a big croc you likely go to Zambia or Mozambique. You certainly don’t go to South Africa.

 

[revturbo9967]

OK, I’m going to ask the dumb question, if you want a 14’ croc why would you hunt it in South Africa? If you want a chance at a big ele you go to Bots or a few spots in Zim. If you want a big croc you likely go to Zambia or Mozambique. You certainly don’t go to South Africa.

I think because people think it’s a lot more work/money to go to a neighboring country then SA.

 

[375Fox]

OK, I’m going to ask the dumb question, if you want a 14’ croc why would you hunt it in South Africa? If you want a chance at a big ele you go to Bots or a few spots in Zim. If you want a big croc you likely go to Zambia or Mozambique. You certainly don’t go to South Africa.

Hunters who have cost and time restraints I can understand, but unfortunately there are many “hunters” who put a higher value on the kill/guarantee over the experience. The croc “hunter” in the movie trophy being a prime example of this.

 

[ActionBob]

OK, I’m going to ask the dumb question, if you want a 14’ croc why would you hunt it in South Africa? If you want a chance at a big ele you go to Bots or a few spots in Zim. If you want a big croc you likely go to Zambia or Mozambique. You certainly don’t go to South Africa.

If you go back and read the opening post, it reads like the OP was asking if a 14' farm raised croc is available. As in he may just rather go shoot one in SA. He references lion breeding, and avoiding the cost and hassle of traveling to places such as Tanzania.

 

[ActionBob]

Hunters who have cost and time restraints I can understand, but unfortunately there are many “hunters” who put a higher value on the kill/guarantee over the experience. The croc “hunter” in the movie trophy being a prime example of this.

I have to disagree that the drunken croc shooters in the movie are a prime example. I think that is the worst example. A lot if hunters do want that canned type of deal. Hopefully most make the best of it rather than the worst....

 

[Red Leg]

OK, I’m going to ask the dumb question, if you want a 14’ croc why would you hunt it in South Africa? If you want a chance at a big ele you go to Bots or a few spots in Zim. If you want a big croc you likely go to Zambia or Mozambique. You certainly don’t go to South Africa.

I think it is because there are different clients with different motivations. And crocodiles aren't the only quarry that fit that description. I think @ActionBob has it correct. If he will allow me a little more extrapolation, I think we are talking about three different clients. It is likely we can all be one of the three depending upon species, budget, or our due diligence.

Let's stay with crocodiles for a moment. There are indeed clients who are perfectly happy to pot a 14' animal during their stay at a lovely lodge somewhere in commercial power supplied South Africa. An outfitter with a suitable impoundment would be foolish not to offer such opportunities. As long as the client and outfitter or honest with one another, no problem. The client might have to pardon folks like me who likely would be underwhelmed by the tale of the hunt, but that is a different set of issues.

The second client is the one who doesn't yet know any better. He grew up reading Ruark, Hunter and Hemingway and in his heart of hearts at least hopes to see the shade of the Serengeti when he arrives in the Limpopo, Eastern Cape, or Namibia. Usually the exotic animals, professional guide with the exotic accent, and replica East African tent camp (though with ensuite shower and facilities) is sufficient to keep the illusion going. When I was that client, I was fortunately in the very professional hands of Nick Nolte and Dirk de Bod. Any outfitter who takes advantage of such exuberant naivete deserves a bit of exposure.

The third is the client who has been bamboozled. In my case it was the eland, buffalo, sable safari in the Caprivi where the allotted sable had been dead three weeks before my arrival. It really didn't make that much of a difference, but knowing it ahead of time would have made the likelihood of a return safari with that outfitter far more likely. The positive was that my personal due diligence has become far more thorough.

We can substitute sable, lechwe, lion, etc etc into the formula, and I suspect most of us bounce a bit from profile to profile. For me a contrived lion, croc, or hippo are all the same thing. Not interested and not really interested in hearing about it. Yet, I have been perfectly happy hunting antelope among captive breeding populations. My personal hypocrisy is unapologetically selective.

The one general trend that I think I have noticed among African hunters is that the more they pursue game on the the continent, the more important the real rather than contrived experience becomes - even if it means more savings and fewer hunts.