Good Gun Deals This Week

[RR 314]

I edited my post. There is no 450 ne 3 1/2”. They erred

I didnt go back and review, but recall the listing stated the gun had more than one barrel.

 

[Wishfulthinker580]

I didnt go back and review, but recall the listing stated the gun had more than one barrel.

It does say 27” barrels. I’d say it’s another mistake. Maybe habit from typing up ads for doubles or another case of copy and paste

 

[ET1775]

I'm not a 450 expert, my knowledge starts and ends in that it was banned around 1900 to prevent uprising in India and the Sudan and as a consequence, Joseph Lang invented the 470NE to circumvent the British ban on 45 cal.

What I find odd, and perhaps an expert can correct me, is that the ad states its a 450 Nitro Express 3-1/2" in one section, and a 450 No. 2 elsewhere. Aren't those completely different calibers?

I am no expert but the 450 No. 2 and the 3-1/2" are synonymous. Same caliber as no other .450 has that length case.

There is, I recently learned a 450 No 2 Musket but that cartridge is not 3-1/2" long. And is technically the "500/450 Musket No. 2," a BPE cartridge.

 

[Wishfulthinker580]

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/994284772

 

[Wishfulthinker580]

These look a little interesting. Wonder what recoil is like

ULA MODEL 20 BOLT ACTION MUZZLELOADER .50 CAL TALLEY RINGS & 25" BARREL - Bolt Action Rifles at GunBroker.com : 991325781

Buy ULA MODEL 20 BOLT ACTION MUZZLELOADER .50 CAL TALLEY RINGS & 25" BARREL : GunBroker is the largest seller of Bolt Action Rifles Rifles Guns & Firearms All: 991325781

www.gunbroker.com

ULA MODEL 20 BOLT ACTION MUZZLELOADER .50 CAL TALLEY RINGS & 25" BARREL - Bolt Action Rifles at GunBroker.com : 991325778

Buy ULA MODEL 20 BOLT ACTION MUZZLELOADER .50 CAL TALLEY RINGS & 25" BARREL : GunBroker is the largest seller of Bolt Action Rifles Rifles Guns & Firearms All: 991325778

www.gunbroker.com

 

[rookhawk]

These look a little interesting. Wonder what recoil is like

ULA MODEL 20 BOLT ACTION MUZZLELOADER .50 CAL TALLEY RINGS & 25" BARREL - Bolt Action Rifles at GunBroker.com : 991325781

Buy ULA MODEL 20 BOLT ACTION MUZZLELOADER .50 CAL TALLEY RINGS & 25" BARREL : GunBroker is the largest seller of Bolt Action Rifles Rifles Guns & Firearms All: 991325781

www.gunbroker.com

ULA MODEL 20 BOLT ACTION MUZZLELOADER .50 CAL TALLEY RINGS & 25" BARREL - Bolt Action Rifles at GunBroker.com : 991325778

Buy ULA MODEL 20 BOLT ACTION MUZZLELOADER .50 CAL TALLEY RINGS & 25" BARREL : GunBroker is the largest seller of Bolt Action Rifles Rifles Guns & Firearms All: 991325778

www.gunbroker.com

I don't normally jump onto plastic gun "good gun deals" but I will make a general comment. With muzzleloaders, they all kick like donkeys. Generally speaking, to get the accuracy you need, you're using ultra premium bullets, blackhorn 209, a primer system that allows magnum match rifle primers for consistent ignition, and you're shooting a 2x-3x of a typical safe load.

So that means more likely than not, either a custom built receiver system, or the Remington 700 Ultimate muzzle loader is the action. From there, you may opt for high-end conversion to smokeless powder and even a 45 cal barrel swap out as 50s do not have the same long range accuracy past 350 yards.

The recoil taming comes from very ugly howitzer style Rex brakes to make them manageable.

I hate everything about muzzleloaders except the additional tags to hunt more often. I would never buy a questionable one. To be good, they are quite custom. Prepare to spend $4000-$8000 on the ugliest rifle you'll ever own.

 

[Caveman]

If this rifle is as good of condition as advertised, then this is a great price.

GunBroker.com - Error

 

[VertigoBE]

A Holland & Holland .500/ 465 double rifle, with an estimate of €2,800 - 3,500:

https://www.interencheres.com/meubl...ciennes-et-militaria-607493/lot-72890126.html

This calibre is essentially the same as a .470, the difference being that it was a proprietary Holland calibre.

The rifle looks dirty, and would benefit from a scrub-up. It appears to have detachable locks.

Tried my best to get it, but some else’s pockets were deeper than mine, it sold for 6600€.

From the superficial report I had received, it looked to be an almost unused, but for a longtime neglected, double rifle.

 

[Daniel Cary]

Here ... I believe this is pretty good!

GunBroker.com - Error

 

[Red Leg]

Dschulnigg 375 H&H Sidelock Ejector Double - - Other Rifles at GunBroker.com : 992068229

Buy Dschulnigg 375 H&H Sidelock Ejector Double -: GunBroker is the largest seller of Other Rifles Rifles Guns & Firearms All: 992068229

www.gunbroker.com

I normally don't post in this thread because I really know NOTHING about any firearm that I can't hold in my hands. That said, were I looking for a .375, this is would be exactly the sort of rifle I would have in mind. As is often the case with Continental firearms, the dealer has no clue. Dshulnigg was a dealer in Salzburg not a gunmaker. This rifle, like virtually all quality Austrian firearms, was built in Ferlach.

The rifle is an OU which is ideal for a .375 double. Such a rifle is far easier to scope and far easier to develop a load that regulates. The myth that rimless cartridges won't extract properly is just that. The Germans and Austrians sorted it out decades ago. This rifle already has claw bases, so JJ Perodeau could create a set of rings very easily.

Had I seen this a few years ago, I would already own it - I currently own 4 .375's one of which is a double.

 

[Mark A Ouellette]

Dschulnigg 375 H&H Sidelock Ejector Double - - Other Rifles at GunBroker.com : 992068229

Buy Dschulnigg 375 H&H Sidelock Ejector Double -: GunBroker is the largest seller of Other Rifles Rifles Guns & Firearms All: 992068229

www.gunbroker.com

I normally don't post in this thread because I really know NOTHING about any firearm that I can't hold in my hands. That said, were I looking for a .375, this is would be exactly the sort of rifle I would have in mind. As is often the case with Continental firearms, the dealer has no clue. Dshulnigg was a dealer in Salzburg not a gunmaker. This rifle, like virtually all quality Austrian firearms, was built in Ferlach.

The rifle is an OU which is ideal for a .375 double. Such a rifle is far easier to scope and far easier to develop a load that regulates. The myth that rimless cartridges won't extract properly is just that. The Germans and Austrians sorted it out decades ago. This rifle already has claw bases, so JJ Perodeau could create a set of rings very easily.

Had I seen this a few years ago, I would already own it - I currently own 4 .375's one of which is a double.

That is a nice O/U .375 with a crossbody above the upper barrel. That should be a strong action!
I owned another O/U 375 without a crossbolt that would pop open when I shot the top barrel. Off to JJ she went for a tune up. I had JJ sell the gun... I kind of miss her since that O/U sure did handle nice!

For the price it has nice engraving with elephants, buffalo, and a lion.

I have not dealt with the seller but have watched him sell a couple dozen double rifles over the past few years. I have asked questions about his guns and received accurate answers.

 

[cajunchefray]

If this rifle is as good of condition as advertised, then this is a great price.

GunBroker.com - Error

Really nice Safari rifle, saw this yesterday, have on my Watchlist. Somebody will get a good deal.

 

[ftrovato]

Seems way way way to good to be true. But if someone is looking and its proven legit this is a hard to pass up deal!

Dakota ArmsModel 76 African Traveler Takedown 2 barrel set 375H+H/458 Lott

Dakota ArmsModel 76 African Traveler Takedown 2 barrel set 375H+H/458 Lott for sale online.

www.gunsinternational.com

 

[Rare Breed]

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/994284772

I saw this sold in the last hour. I do not know this caliber but seemed to be a smoking hot deal on a Krieghoff DR for a little over $5K.

 

[rookhawk]

Seems way way way to good to be true. But if someone is looking and its proven legit this is a hard to pass up deal!

Dakota ArmsModel 76 African Traveler Takedown 2 barrel set 375H+H/458 Lott

Dakota ArmsModel 76 African Traveler Takedown 2 barrel set 375H+H/458 Lott for sale online.

www.gunsinternational.com

That's a lovely gun. It's not a steal, but if a fellow wants to pay honest dollars for a foolproof reliable rifle, that's a great package.

Nobody gets let down or made fun of for owning a Dakota.

 

[rookhawk]

Dschulnigg 375 H&H Sidelock Ejector Double - - Other Rifles at GunBroker.com : 992068229

Buy Dschulnigg 375 H&H Sidelock Ejector Double -: GunBroker is the largest seller of Other Rifles Rifles Guns & Firearms All: 992068229

www.gunbroker.com

I normally don't post in this thread because I really know NOTHING about any firearm that I can't hold in my hands. That said, were I looking for a .375, this is would be exactly the sort of rifle I would have in mind. As is often the case with Continental firearms, the dealer has no clue. Dshulnigg was a dealer in Salzburg not a gunmaker. This rifle, like virtually all quality Austrian firearms, was built in Ferlach.

The rifle is an OU which is ideal for a .375 double. Such a rifle is far easier to scope and far easier to develop a load that regulates. The myth that rimless cartridges won't extract properly is just that. The Germans and Austrians sorted it out decades ago. This rifle already has claw bases, so JJ Perodeau could create a set of rings very easily.

Had I seen this a few years ago, I would already own it - I currently own 4 .375's one of which is a double.

Ah @Red Leg shilling for the Germans again?

We all know he loves good German engineering and this is no different, an Austrian Ferlach is a reliable weapon. (has anyone seen a bad Ferlach ever?)

My consternation is that the gun needs some stock cleanup and repairs, a $2000 scope, and $2400 in claw mounts. Add it all up, we're getting close to a steal-of-a-deal on a small bore SxS Heym 375.

Bottom line: if you find a gun with scope and mounts, plus regulation targets, its a WAY better deal than an ala carte gun. This gun is a great start to a wonderful do-all safari rifle.

And yes, I agree with Red Leg that O/U small bore double rifles are underappreciated.

I'm not keen on Dangerous Game rifles with rimless cartridges, but a 375HH will certainly do that one elephant hunt of your life, plus countless plains game and buffalo hunts without much issue.

P.S.- I know some will take offense that I'm calling Austrians Germans, but they are. Some of my ancestors are genetically Lithuanian but they spoke, thought, and acted German and considered themselves Prussian through and through. Probably why the Reich wanted Austria and the Czech republic for their own as well. There's a German way of building something and it applies beyond the current borders of the nations.

 

[Red Leg]

Ah @Red Leg shilling for the Germans again?

We all know he loves good German engineering and this is no different, an Austrian Ferlach is a reliable weapon. (has anyone seen a bad Ferlach ever?)

My consternation is that the gun needs some stock cleanup and repairs, a $2000 scope, and $2400 in claw mounts. Add it all up, we're getting close to a steal-of-a-deal on a small bore SxS Heym 375.

Bottom line: if you find a gun with scope and mounts, plus regulation targets, its a WAY better deal than an ala carte gun. This gun is a great start to a wonderful do-all safari rifle.

And yes, I agree with Red Leg that O/U small bore double rifles are underappreciated.

I'm not keen on Dangerous Game rifles with rimless cartridges, but a 375HH will certainly do that one elephant hunt of your life, plus countless plains game and buffalo hunts without much issue.

P.S.- I know some will take offense that I'm calling Austrians Germans, but they are. Some of my ancestors are genetically Lithuanian but they spoke, thought, and acted German and considered themselves Prussian through and through. Probably why the Reich wanted Austria and the Czech republic for their own as well. There's a German way of building something and it applies beyond the current borders of the nations.

$2400! Remind me to give you another source for those rings.

I really do not include the scope in these musings. Though I admit that I had not realized that Heym provided a $2,000 scope with one of their .375's.

My stock guy would steam those dents fill that knot and even clean up the checkering and provide a final oil finish for about $350 - I would probably give him $400 because I like him. Assuming the barrels are ok on this gun (a dialogue with the seller), if I had a choice between a newish $8000-9000 Italian or French double with a test target and the usual fifty yard 3" group or this one, it would be no contest.

I know resale figures greatly in your assessments. Nothing wrong with that. It just never has in mine. I place value on utility. A quality, scoped OU rifle is just about a perfect home for the .375 - rimmed or rimless. Like a modern Blaser S2 it offers the potential for a rifle easily capable of delivering the maximum potential of that cartridge. Something a cheap double with a test target almost certainly never will. Again, assuming no barrel flaw, this rifle is unlikely to ever be worth less than its current asking price.

 

[rookhawk]

$2400! Remind me to give you another source for those rings.

I really do not include the scope in these musings. Though I admit that I had not realized that Heym provided a $2,000 scope with one of their .375's.

My stock guy would steam those dents fill that knot and even clean up the checkering and provide a final oil finish for about $350 - I would probably give him $400 because I like him. Assuming the barrels are ok on this gun (a dialogue with the seller), if I had a choice between a newish $8000-9000 Italian or French double with a test target and the usual fifty yard 3" group or this one, it would be no contest.

I know resale figures greatly in your assessments. Nothing wrong with that. It just never has in mine. A quality, scoped OU rifle is just about a perfect home for the .375 - rimmed or rimless. Like a modern Blaser S2 it offers the potential for a rifle easily capable of delivering the maximum potential of that cartridge. Something a cheap double with a test target almost certainly never will.

As usual, @Red Leg and I have no disagreement upon facts. I agree.

I'm just a poor kid from a farm in po-dunk so I count my nickels twice. My point is that lovely $7000 gun when claw mounted optic is added, plus regulation, plus cleanup of the stock defects and pad, we are over $11,000. So the debate is on approach, not facts.

When I see good gun deals, I see "package guns" selling for nearly the price of "bare bones guns". If you are going to add EAW pivot mounts or claws, and do stock work, and outsource regulation, I prefer to find a bargain on a cased, all-in gun, with ammo, and targets.

People are bargain hunters. They will buy cheap every time before they buy good. I'd rather spend a grand more and get six grand more bells and whistles. Otherwise, you're buying a project/hobby/profession than an object.

Highest regard for @Red Leg in all of this. I make no disparaging comments about his guns or wisdom, this is just a disagreement in bargain shopping.

In the end, nobody loses. This is a quality gun and will smoke an Eland as good as any other gun.

Now I'm going to leave you to check my wallet, ensuring I still have that $5 savings bond from my first commune still intact. #RookhawkFrugality

 

[VertigoBE]

and $2400 in claw mounts.

You know that for my Dumoulin, I exchanged the existing old straight tube scope with 18mm objective for a Swarovski 1.7-10x42. In order to accommodate for the eye relief, I had to get new claw mounts with the front one around the front objective bell of the optic. I think this was only 400€.

The work to put new bases on, I can believe to be much more expensive. But just the rings and claws is not overly complicated as far as I can tell.

 

[rookhawk]

You know that for my Dumoulin, I exchanged the existing old straight tube scope with 18mm objective for a Swarovski 1.7-10x42. In order to accommodate for the eye relief, I had to get new claw mounts with the front one around the front objective bell of the optic. I think this was only 400€.

The work to put new bases on, I can believe to be much more expensive. But just the rings and claws is not overly complicated as far as I can tell.

@VertigoBE your Centurion Dumoulin is a work of art. Point of order though, you're in Europe where the history gets made. Under every rock is a skilled craftsman that can do "simple things" like claw mounts. Not so for our Canadian and American friends.

First step in North America is taxes and duty on EAW or Rechnagel components like pivot mounts and claw mounts. You can buy on EU Optics, or use NECG, or JJ Perridoux directly for those with duty, customs, and a many-month wait.

Then you have to find a skilled craftsman that knows how to install German mounts properly in the New World. Ralf Martini, Steve Bertram, JJ Perridoux, and Mark Cornwall are who come to mind. The list is mighty short on skilled artisans and their queue is might long.

NECG charges about $2400 for claw mounts, same price for claw rings fitted to existing mounts. That is all-in with materials that cost $700 alone. If it were pivot mounts, you could buy materials for $700 and just come over to my place for the weekend and we'd install them for free, minus the cost of bourbon.

Bottom line, improving a gun is a job, not an object. It isn't free and it takes time and money. The US and CA have few skilled artisans to do this and they need materials sourced from Germany. What can be solved in Western Europe in two weeks takes us six months.