Elephant with a bow?

I have killed one Cape Buffalo with a bow. So no expert. The bull had no idea what hit it. It ran off and was bellowing very quickly.

I’ve seen many TV shows where Buffalo were shot multiple times by multiple rifles and tracked minutes, hours and days. Clean deaths are what we all want. But to pretend that archery is inhumane and rifles always kill instantly is less than honest. Or uninformed
 
Guys, use whatever you like but remember if things go wrong you are defenseless with your bow. Yes you can kill anything with it but you also can’t stop anything with it.
 
I respect everyone's informed opinions, but many are uneducated on the lethality of archery equipment, granted my personal experience is limited to black bear, grizzly, elk, moose and other NA game, but the death sequence between an arrow kill and a bullet kill, all-be-it via different mechanisms, is not different when it comes to effectiveness... I have put down 1000 pound bull moose in 2 seconds without them taking a step, a 600 pound bear dead in 2 seconds without time to moan or flich when hitting the ground. You have to see the lethality in person to appreciate it. Again, I have zero experience with elephants, and they would require special equipment, special planning and due diligence with respect to their size and stamina, but I have no doubt that an archery kill would be lethal, humane and effective. JMO.
Bear in mind a bull elephant can top 12000 lb and it is hardskinned on top of that......
Very few can properly use the archery equipment required let alone place the arrow where it needs to go. So yes doable and has been done.....but few can master the art.....
And yes some are also wounded and lost using rifles....
 
I have killed one Cape Buffalo with a bow. So no expert. The bull had no idea what hit it. It ran off and was bellowing very quickly.

I’ve seen many TV shows where Buffalo were shot multiple times by multiple rifles and tracked minutes, hours and days. Clean deaths are what we all want. But to pretend that archery is inhumane and rifles always kill instantly is less than honest. Or uninformed
We are talking elephant here not Cape buffalo....
Most buffalo are shot over alfalfa from a blind not on foot....not saying yours was...non of my business.

However comparing shooting a cape buffalo from a blind to hunting an elephant on the foot...well irrespective of the size difference(animal and bow)....not compareable..
 
Mine was stalked properly. I would’ve rather shot it with a rifle stalking, then in a blind with a bow.

I agree the conversation is elephant, and I personally would not try it with a bow, but someone mentioned, and brought Buffalo into it
 
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Not to mention all his lond distance bow wounds. I also had the misfortune of guiding him years ago and putting down many plainsgame with a rifle. Prick of note
Yip....Ray Bunny when he was still a partner was the opposite a total pleasure to hunt with and sit around a campfire....jb however was a selfcentered, shitshot who had to be the centre of attention....I eventually refused to hunt with him....I would also not sit at the same table as him.....many times he would wound and lose animals but then get them to take another clients animal from the skinning shed to complete the "photo shoot"....could also not leave women alone....especially prostitutes.....never drank a drop......
As you note Prick of note......

No wonder I hate hunting for tv shows.....
 
I have killed one Cape Buffalo with a bow. So no expert. The bull had no idea what hit it. It ran off and was bellowing very quickly.

I’ve seen many TV shows where Buffalo were shot multiple times by multiple rifles and tracked minutes, hours and days. Clean deaths are what we all want. But to pretend that archery is inhumane and rifles always kill instantly is less than honest. Or uninformed
This is true... whether elephant or grizzlies... it is a sobering thing to release an arrow at either, and not something to be taken lightly or without due preparation and consideration.
 
Yip....Ray Bunny when he was still a partner was the opposite a total pleasure to hunt with and sit around a campfire....jb however was a selfcentered, shitshot who had to be the centre of attention....I eventually refused to hunt with him....I would also not sit at the same table as him.....many times he would wound and lose animals but then get them to take another clients animal from the skinning shed to complete the "photo shoot"....could also not leave women alone....especially prostitutes.....never drank a drop......
As you note Prick of note......

No wonder I hate hunting for tv shows.....
JB??? I’m not familiar. I also don’t watch many hunting shows.
 
Many have been wounded and lost.....

JB use to be a bowhunting God.....making outdoor shows all across the world...now he knows how to use a bow but took him 3 elephants before he could take a picture next to one....he is also a total arsehile in camp.....

I personally do not like hunting dg with bows especially elephant.

I get it that some like iy and want to do it but I have seen too many issues.
“Many have been wounded and lost” I am sure is laden with truth. Let me preface this by asserting that I am NOT a bow hunter but I am an authority of what projectiles of any type do to mammalian bodies after practicing forensic pathology, military and civilian, hunting and examining countless projectile wounds from a sharp stick to “gummie bear goo” after claymore mine catastrophe and everything in between.
The pure lung shot to the elephant with a linearly cutting( essentially no area adjacent to the track of significant tissue damage due to lack of temporary cavity formation) will cause respiratory distress over time but will not readily cause the tension pneumothorax seen in other mammals. The significance of a tension pneumothorax is FAR more than the decreased lung tidal volume during respiration. Tension pneumothorax forcibly pushes the heart to the compressed side and this severely “kinks” the great vessels feeding the right heart(low pressure inferior and superior vena cavae) as well as low pressure pulmonary vein blood return to the left atrium. The higher pressure flows in the pulmonary artery and aorta are not compromised as much, immediately, due to hi pressure blood flow. However, when the low pressure sources of blood, now compromised can no longer provide supply to the high pressure side, cardiovascular collapse occurs. That is why you “vent” a tension pneumothorax with a needle/trochar with a one way(air out) valve. Re-expansion of that lung returns the heart and attached vessels to their normal central position, “un-kinks” the blood flow and allows normal cardiac output. The recovery is dramatic when it is released.
Direct heart and great vessel ( aorta, pulmonary artery) will cause a rapid hemorrhaging death.But that arrow will not have any of the “temporary cavity” associated tissue destruction which can be VERY significant with high energy rifle projectiles thus offering no “forgiveness “ beyond that precise cutting track of the arrow.
So, the arrow will definitely do it, there is just essential no room for forgiveness if the heart or great vessels are not pierced/severed. Little target in a huge animal.
Cutting instruments like knives razors can also cause slit-like holes in thick musculature of the left ventrical which may “seal” to an extent but fill the pericardial sac surrounding the heart with blood that builds in pressure and compresses the heart, keeping it from filling fully and therefore not ejecting enough blood. Depending on the individual, this can be a slow enough death that you could lose the animal.
These are the reasons i think it is very difficult, but not impossible, to get a humane, relatively quick kill on an elephant with a bow.Challenging yes- ethical ?- depends.
 
Yip....Ray Bunny when he was still a partner was the opposite a total pleasure to hunt with and sit around a campfire....jb however was a selfcentered, shitshot who had to be the centre of attention....I eventually refused to hunt with him....I would also not sit at the same table as him.....many times he would wound and lose animals but then get them to take another clients animal from the skinning shed to complete the "photo shoot"....could also not leave women alone....especially prostitutes.....never drank a drop......
As you note Prick of note......

No wonder I hate hunting for tv shows.....
IvW, so much can be excused or forgiven BUT you’re saying he “Never drank a drop”….well, that is disturbing !!
 
Everyone has a right to an opinion including those that have had no experience, those that have and those that do it for a living.

I would like to see the look on some inexperienced hunter going after DG and his PH breaks out his compound bow to do back up.

Lon
That’s a good one!
 
A friend just returned from a safari in South Africa. He told me that on the return flight he sat next to guy who claimed to be a PH and also claimed to have successfully hunted elephant with a bow. The guy said that the bow he used had a 100 lb draw. There are several things about this story that make me suspicious. What you folks think? Is this a plausible story or more likely BS? I know that Fred Bear took an elephant, but he was a special case and probably shot everything that was legal in his day.
I wonder if that’s the same clown l met? My wife and I were in Miami Beach a few years ago at the international boat show convention. To my surprise the convention center actually had booths for Safari hunts and tours.

It was a guy there asking one of the PHs would he book a lion hunt with clients who wanted to use a Rambo knife .

According to him he killed a lion in Africa with one. He wanted someone to film his next kill. You should have seen the look on the PH’s face:LOL::LOL:
 
SURESHOT375, since almost all Bow kills are the result of Hemorrhaging (heart, Lung, Liver etc..) They would work the same way on Elephant (I have No personal experience). So is the disagreement that an Elephant - lung shot by arrow) takes too long to bleed out and “that” makes an arrow unacceptable? While an arrow might cause a slower death - that does not mean it is a painful or agonizing death. I am a bow hunter but no interest in taking Elephant with a bow - also no problems with others that do…provided they are reasonably proficient with their bow. This is a surprisingly “hot topic” and i find the various opinions interesting - also more emotional then expected.

In order to understand why a lung shot with a weapon of any sorts is looking for trouble on an elephant you need to understand the anatomy. I have conducted autopsies on elephant in Kruger, and their lungs, due to the weight, are attached to the inner thoracic wall.

This opposes the mechanism in any other mammal, where the lung is a loose organ, supported to the inner thoracic cage via a potential space and negative pressure. Correctly termed, this is where the visceral pleura sticks to the pariatal pleura via above mentioned negative pressure.

A penetrating chest wound of any sorts will allow the lung, or in the case of a double lung shot, both lungs, to collapse causing difficulty in breathing and more haemorrhaging into the lungs. This is known as a pneumothorax, and when filling up with blood a haemopneumothorx. The animal breaths faster and faster, speeding up the process, which leads to their rapid death.

In the case of a penetrating chest wound in an elephant, you simply have a hole in it’s lung, which might or might not have hit a blood vessel. That leaves the animal with a fairly benign hole in his chest, as well as two very functional lungs. He might take days to expire or recover. Think of all the elephants found with musket balls in their chests after being hunted years later.

Obviously a heart shot traversing the mediastinum and severing the large thoracic arteries will cause the sufficient haemorrhage to kill the elephant, but it is a difficult shot and takes deep penetration, coupled with the hope that the arrow or bolt does not deflect on its way there.
 
In order to understand why a lung shot with a weapon of any sorts is looking for trouble on an elephant you need to understand the anatomy. I have conducted autopsies on elephant in Kruger, and their lungs, due to the weight, are attached to the inner thoracic wall.

This opposes the mechanism in any other mammal, where the lung is a loose organ, supported to the inner thoracic cage via a potential space and negative pressure. Correctly termed, this is where the visceral pleura sticks to the pariatal pleura via above mentioned negative pressure.

A penetrating chest wound of any sorts will allow the lung, or in the case of a double lung shot, both lungs, to collapse causing difficulty in breathing and more haemorrhaging into the lungs. This is known as a pneumothorax, and when filling up with blood a haemopneumothorx. The animal breaths faster and faster, speeding up the process, which leads to their rapid death.

In the case of a penetrating chest wound in an elephant, you simply have a hole in it’s lung, which might or might not have hit a blood vessel. That leaves the animal with a fairly benign hole in his chest, as well as two very functional lungs. He might take days to expire or recover. Think of all the elephants found with musket balls in their chests after being hunted years later.

Obviously a heart shot traversing the mediastinum and severing the large thoracic arteries will cause the sufficient haemorrhage to kill the elephant, but it is a difficult shot and takes deep penetration, coupled with the hope that the arrow or bolt does not deflect on its way there.
Dewald, I will defer to your opinion since you are either someone with detailed medical knowledge or the Best Bulls—ter on this forum. I will pose one question: Have any elephant been killed with an arrow 1). to a single lung and 2). died in less then an hour? If so, your argument is inconsistent with some bow hunters experience —- or is beyond my limited intellect
 
Dewald, I will defer to your opinion since you are either someone with detailed medical knowledge or the Best Bulls—ter on this forum. I will pose one question: Have any elephant been killed with an arrow 1). to a single lung and 2). died in less then an hour? If so, your argument is inconsistent with some bow hunters experience —- or is beyond my limited intellect

Yes I happen to have detailed trauma surgery and ER knowledge.

Insinuating I am a bullshitter on a public forum is like water off a duck’s back from a faceless, nameless stranger.

I will answer you with a counter question.
1. Have any, and how many elephant, not died, irrespective of an hour time limit with a single lung shot?
 

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