Dealing with wounded Cape buffalo

[Inline6]

Well, have only hunted Buffalo once.

The one time was with a 416REM win model 70 using 400gr AFrames it took 9. I acquired the 416REM after reading some reports about Buffalo soaking up lead. After I put 3 in him my PH said keep shooting, so I did.

Lessons learned, bring more ammo than you think you need. I trained hard off the sticks and that paid off, trained hard on fast followup shots that too paid off.

I now have an R8 in 458Lott that I will take next time. The recoil is not much more than the 416REM. The load it likes is 450 TSX at 2350. I know most like heavy and slow, this worked well on a Watusi. Seems to be a good balance.

 

[Frederik]

Man this post has gone in quite a few directions.

From dogs, trackers, choppers and snapping at each other.

Me, I use my 458 lott these days for the first and then the rest of the shots loaded with quality 500gr softs. I have been on 15 buffalo hunts where buffalo were killed and all found. One with a chopper used on a wounded cow and a wounded bull soaking up lead from a 458 and 470 NE not my 458.

Dealing with a wounded buff depends on a lot on the circumstances. You could be hunting on the border of a park and the wounded buff is heading that way then there is no time to wait or it could be the end of the day and getting dark soon.

It depends on the person if they can be calm and composed, some can so do not.
Your PH needs to summarise all of this in a hurry and make up his mind what to do when he has seen you in the field that last few days and handle yourself.

I hate it when a PH fires simultaneously on a buffalo with the client and this is where I will break down new SA ph's there is just too many PH's around in South Africa and everybody wants to boast that they have guided DG and shot a buff so they are trigger happy. You can see it on Youtube.

Whatever the outcome is of this post following uyp wounded buffalo is not for everyone but having the right tools and being mentally prepared your are 90% there already.

 

[Tanks]

...

I hate it when a PH fires simultaneously on a buffalo with the client and this is where I will break down new SA ph's there is just too many PH's around in South Africa and everybody wants to boast that they have guided DG and shot a buff so they are trigger happy. You can see it on Youtube.
...

Wow, if a client did not ask for a PH backup and it is not a charge then the PH has no business shooting at the same time as the client.

If there are too many PH's around in RSA that is most likely due to slack requirements. I think it is months rather than several years and apprenticeships that is the requirement in other countries.

 

[Frederik]

Wow, if a client did not ask for a PH backup and it is not a charge then the PH has no business shooting at the same time as the client.

If there are too many PH's around in RSA that is most likely due to slack requirements. I think it is months rather than several years and apprenticeships that is the requirement in other countries.

Tanks,

Wow, you take every opportunity to trash South Africa I have already done it in my post so now you take this one point and bring it up to trash South Africa even more.
Watch a bit more Youtube and you will see it happens in your favorite ZIM also where PH fires immediatly after the client.

Don't let me open up a can of worms on how some ZIM PH's allow SA ph/outfiters to bring clients and never see their trophies there are bad apples everywhere and that is why we love this forum to learn and share experience.

You, are just like anti hunting reporters these days taking one bit from a whole article and smearing the hunting industry making up your judgement.

 

[grand veneur]

Due to the last postings, I still allow a comment on the topic despite everything.

I am also just a client, but I shot some buffalos in different countries of Africa and in Southeast Asia, and I have also accompanied some buffalo hunts in West Africa and sometime made the backup at the request of clients in a country where there is not always the assistance of a PH like the south African model. I also followed wounded buffalos that I had injured, and also buffalos from other clients.

I have not read all posts, but I can well imagine that the discussion, as I initially suspected, went in all directions. What else can one expect if already in a discussion about cartridges for buffalo hunting, opinions often do not always go in the right direction, and now we should discuss the dealing with wounded buffalos and have to give our opinion on the procedure. I initially gave my concerns about this topic, perhaps not so kindly, but I still believe that such topics coming from a PH are more of a discussion that should be conducted under the same, or then be formulated in a completely different way and be moderated accordingly when clients should express their opinion.

As some have written you have to improvise depending on the situation, especially with the knowledge everyone has of the game species and the terrain, and also as some have written, with the right rifle in our hands. You may not need to be a PH, but perhaps you should have hunted the game species more than two or three times in Africa and if possible in very different countries, and are be able to handle large caliber weapons. One remain in all cases an amateur who can never have the experience of someone who was born in the country and has always lived and hunted there.

 

[Flewis]

I for one am enjoying this thread. I’ve taken 3 bulls and been in on 2 more, so still a baby at this. As for some on here it’s like road apples, just step around and keep going.

 

[grand veneur]

The topic is not primarily about buffalo hunting. As far as this hunt is concerned, everyone shot only one, sometimes two buffalo on their first hunt. Everyone has to start at some point.

It's about dealing with a wounded buffalo, that means following a wounded dangerous animal, and that's a step further than just shooting a buffalo. I don't know if that would have worked well in my case when I first hunted buffalo about 30 years ago in case that I should have done something like this alone. Someone would have asked me how something like that works, I could have answered only theoretically. In such cases I would have said I don't know.

 

[Inline6]

The topic is not primarily about buffalo hunting. As far as this hunt is concerned, everyone shot only one, sometimes two buffalo on their first hunt. Everyone has to start at some point.

It's about dealing with a wounded buffalo, that means following a wounded dangerous animal, and that's a step further than just shooting a buffalo. I don't know if that would have worked well in my case when I first hunted buffalo about 30 years ago in case that I should have done something like this alone. Someone would have asked me how something like that works, I could have answered only theoretically. In such cases I would have said I don't know.

And maybe that is the whole point. Maybe it is to get people to actually visualize that happening (or could happen)so that they are more prepared. Evaluate equipment and techniques, having an idea is better than going in blind. Having watched some people take a knee did not click at first, when taking a step back it gives you a better angle to but the bullet in the right spot. I can only speak for myself, I would be slower to get out of the way it the bullet did not connect.

I'm always interested to hear the why's of people, just because it works for someone doesn't mean it will work for you. It will at the minimum give a different perspective.

 

[IvW]

Well when I started this thread I did not visualise some of the shitshow that would develop.....be that as it may.
I was actually thinking when I started this one that we could follow up with the rest of the big 5 but alas.....

I will share my opinion and that is exactly what it is my opinion and mine only....I dont expect anybody to change there way and or what workes for them...

Most cape buffalo are killed with one well placed shot and an insurance shot once the hunters are close...sometimes it does go that easy and things can go south as with any hunting....

Calibers, 375 probably kills more buff than any other....is it ideal maybe not is it good enough for sure....I believe that a well placed shot from a 375 with the right bullet is more than adequite...is it good enough for a follow up when the chips are down? Maybe not but in competent hands it can and has done the job many times....a few professional hunters have used only 375 H&H on everything.

Bigger is better provided one can use the rifle caliber combination to good effect.

The 400 calibers I believe are the perfect caliber for a visiting hunter hunting Cape Buffalo, 375 H&H if it is a mixed bag or one of each.

Double vs bolt....

I have always used a bolt action...partly because I could not afford a double but I am very familiar with my bolt actions and have relied on them always....never let me down....I can also easily load my own ammo without the need for regulation and can just sight in. I can also load to the speed I prefer which for me is min 2200fps and max 2400fps with 2300fps being the sweet spot.

CRF is a must for me and my favourite rifles for the task are ZKKBRNO 602 based.

Bullets....

Another much debated point and probably my main reason for starting this thread....
I am of the opinion that some hunters who have been killed may have survived the ordeal had they been using the right bullets....

Yes we can say that for many years the norm was a soft for the first shot and solids after that....I however do not agree with this for Cape Buffalo...
A premium grade expanding bullet is all that is needed for Cape Buffalo..from the first to the last...
A round nosed full metal jacket is the worst in my opinion and causes the least damage in and out and often perveived to have no effect..

Buffalo that have been wounded and that are running on adrenaline can take an amazing amount of lead to bring down.

A controlled expansion bullet that retains max weight expands to at least 2x diameter and does not exit is the best stopper coming or going for buffalo.

I do not like Barnes TSX some only use them which is fine and I consider them to be premium but not for me.
TBBC, Bitterroot, Swift A frame and then the Rhino bullets I prefer they expand to 2.5x caliber so for my 500 Jeff that means 1.275 inches of expansion....570gr traveling at 2300fps they are devestating....causing a lot more damage than round nose solid ever can and the bullet being bonded and only having lead in the front section has no problem smashing neck/spine vertabrae or hip bones/joints...

If solids are used for backup, it takes a lot of control not to fire while the buffalo is running with others in close proximity as the chance of wounding another is a real posibility.
Ifbusing solids I can only recommend Brass solids with a big meplat or concave front such as Hydros....but I dont use solids on buffalo as they are not needed and controlled expansion bullets are more effective...

Often it is said that a solid is needed in order to reach the vitals of a wounded buff that is moving directly away from the hunter....I disagree and always ask "If the vitals could not be hit while the buff was broadside where exactly are you going to aim in order to now hit the vitals from behind?"
Best option to anchor a wounded buff moving directly away is to aim and hit what you can see as oposed to trying to hit the vitals which are for all practical purposes on the front side of the buffalo which in my opinion is either one of the hip joints or the spine above the root of the tail...executed with a premium expansion bullet will anchor the buffalo or at the least pull up the hand brake so to speak...
It is also often suggested that for a charging buffalo that a solid is needed to brain the buffalo through the boss....which is not the case...a charging buffalo has his nose and head up and the initial shot placement for me is to place it to tey and hit the spine as it it dips down very low much easier shit to execute than trying to hit the bobbing brain....
If you fail to stop it and the head drops you shoot for the brain and at that close even if you need to shoot throigh some boss the right expanding bullet will do it no problem....
Stopping a side running buff where the neck dips down and meets the shoulder will drop him on the spot if not possible send it into the boiler room....

Before I get blasted again this is my opinion and each can do and use what they want.
What has always worked for me using is 570gr Rhino controlled expansion bullets from my 500 Jeff and abive shot placements.....

Now I have to cook some T bones with thick cut potatoes on the fire.....

Let the masters rip it apart.....

 

[IvW]

I could share some in field experiences but will probably just be taken to the cleaners by some here so will refrain from doing so....

 

[Pondoro]

If in rather open country I would take a scoped .375/400 bolt something..with Swift A frames.. In dense bush either my 450/400 3 1/4 double with 400 grain Woodleigh softs or my .470 double with 500 grain Woodleigh softs.. Hmm..perhaps I will chose that 450/400...its very well balanced and fast..a tad faster than the .470 I think..and it has that flip-up moon sight..

 

[IvW]

If in rather open country I would take a scoped .375/400 bolt something..with Swift A frames.. In dense bush either my 450/400 3 1/4 double with 400 grain Woodleigh softs or my .470 double with 500 grain Woodleigh softs.. Hmm..perhaps I will chose that 450/400...its very well balanced and fast..a tad faster than the .470 I think..and it has that flip-up moon sight..

Great caliber choices ...I also love the idea of a 500/416NE 31/4" but for some reason it seems to have not been so popular....

 

[Art Lambart II]

@IvW Thanks for the great advice, I'm glad to hear I can stick with my favorite bullet the TBBC in my 416 Rigby

 

[Flewis]

I could share some in field experiences but will probably just be taken to the cleaners by some here so will refrain from doing so....

Please do. Don’t mind the road apples, just step over them.

 

[freefall]

I have no experience dealing to wounded buffalo, but was under the impression they usually say "Hit me".
When following bears, I'd usually give them 20-30 min to get good and sick (or dead) then pull my socks up, take whatever rifle I had and do the deed.

 

[Qc_BearHunter]

I did not read the entire thread but will do it. Here's my story.

I hunted buffalo one time in my life. The shot I got on an already pissed buffalo (he came from nowhere broking fences) was frontal at something like 90 yards.

I was shooting a 375HH with handloaded Barnes 270 grains TSX.

The bullet was perfectly centered about 1/3 up the chest, like they say in books.

The buffalo reaction was like they say in books, as he entered some thick bushes.

He was bleeding his life leaving litteraly a "bloodline".

We were a few minutes from camp so the PH called the outfitter on the radio to bring the Jack Russell's.

We let the 2 Jack's on the blood and they jump the buffalo that was still alive.

The outfitter shot once with his 470NE loaded with Nosler flat point FMJ, the PH shot twice with his 500NE with round nosed FMJ, both when the buffalo was quartering away. They got flesh, guts and the back of one lungs. The buffalo did not seem to care much. The flat point FMJ penetrated and excited like a laser beam leaving a hole the size of a pencil. The round noses thumbled and were recovered in the hide on the oposite side.

When the bull came in my view running, I sent one double lungs behind the shoulder, sent another one in the same hole (really) going forward as he was turning to his left. He was down seconds later.
The PH later told me he wanted to give him pressure because of the orchard's workers around. He did not want someone killed by a wounded buffalo.

I learned that solids are meaningful only if they break bones. I will let them to my PH because I know any Barnes TSX can break the spine, the shoulder, the hip or reach the brain of a buffalo.

Even if I'm 100% sure that it was my 3 shots that killed this bull, I will go back buffalo hunting for one reason: Proving myself that I can kill a buffalo without someone else making holes in it.

The next time I'll tell the PH that if I have to take a frontal shot, I want to wait a minimum of one hour before going on the blood.

Let's have some soft drinks, eat biltong, share a few stories, and let him stiffen.

 

[Scott CWO]

I could share some in field experiences but will probably just be taken to the cleaners by some here so will refrain from doing so....

Nah, do it anyway. You’re tough enough!

 

[Red Leg]

Interesting read.

I have yet to truly follow up a wounded buffalo into the thick stuff. My four all succumbed within fifty yards. My son's bull did the same, but only after he had put five rounds into him. The first seemed to anchor the bull standing with legs splayed. My son's subsequent three shots, as he stood quartering away, elicited a good imitation of a death below, but the animal would not fall. At a shout from the PH, the bull spun around and he, my son's PH, and my son all fired simultaneously dropping him. Appropriate action on everyone's part.

As I have mentioned in other discussions, I loathe dragging along extra gear - particularly a second rifle. If hunting buffalo and PG that rifle will be a .375. There is nothing that offers the same utility. In recent years it would be Blaser R8. Except for the tiny ten, I use the same ammunition for everything - a 300 gr Swift A-Frame. On the little guys I use a solid - never on buffalo.

All my African rifles, regardless of caliber, have dismountable scopes. In a true follow-up on a wounded buffalo or leopard, the scope would be dismounted from the R8 and the chamber and magazine would be full of 300 gr A Frames. The open sights of that rifle are dead on at fifty yards and are so visible even my ancient eyes can see them.

 

[Major Bonkers]

I'm sorry that you feel like that, IvW. I suspect that most of the perceived unpleasantness is down to the sometimes awkward way in which people express themselves. I have certainly enjoyed this thread, and I thank you for starting it.

My friend Mr. Swarrie (from my previous post) used to be a PH in Zambia, and his way of hunting buffalo was to brain them with a .375 monolithic. He only had one unfortunate incident, out of some 30 buffalo, which was when the bullet glanced off the skull, knocking out the buffalo rather than killing it. (The bullet did that trick of going around the circumference of the skull and exiting at the back of the scalp.) The buffalo apparently started to come to just as the client was squatting in front of it for his hero photograph.

From my own limited experience, a week of tracking 'my' buffalo, and then four hours of creeping through the mopani after him when he was wounded, was followed by a charge which took about 3 - 4 seconds. Thankfully, one of the bullets fired during that charge broke his back.

The lesson I take away is to use as big a gun as you can handle and to stitch the air with lead. And if you practice beforehand, you have a better chance of hitting something.

 

[VertigoBE]

I could share some in field experiences but will probably just be taken to the cleaners by some here so will refrain from doing so....

I for one would like to hear those stories