cup point solids on game

[Green Chile]

Who has some experience shooting the cup point solids on game? I've been hearing reports of them creating wound channels of 2x bullet diameter, almost like an expanding solid. I'm curious in particular with Northfork's version of this but interested in anyone's experience with this style of solid bullet. I heard Kevin Robertson say that if limited to one bullet in Africa, this would be his choice.

 

[WAB]

I’ve heard the same thing. Hopefully someone with direct experience will chime in.

 

[fourfive8]

I have experience with them out out 416 Rem Mag. on buffalo, eland and several smaller plains game. Agree with Kevin Robertson on how they perform. Very accurate. Easy to work up loads with them. They penetrate in straight line. Penetration depth is less depth than comparable FP monolithic. Quite a bit more depth than tough soft points like TSXs, TBBCs and A-Frames. Nothing unexpected or unpredictable in how they act. All around excellent bullet. Only recovered them out of eland and buffalo. Always complete pass through on PG smaller than eland. My experience is limited to .416 CPS at about 2300 fps.

 

[V.Veritas]

Dr. Kevin Robertson highly recommends them in his books and interviews.

There is a YouTube series that you could find on-line called: "Africa Hunting (Bullets) 101 With Kevin Robertson". The word in the brackets changes depending on the main subject.

If you don’t have time to listen to the entire interview (highly recommend) skip forward to around minute 40. Enjoy.

 

[Hunter-Habib]

These bullets "Rivet" rather than expand fully (unlike conventional soft points). They are ideal for backing shots at departing Cape buffalo or eland (or the like). Also excellent for stopping Cape buffalo charges.

Not suitable for hunting lion or leopard (or light framed plains game). Northfork's Percussion Point bullet is far better suited to these applications because it has an expansion initiating ring milled into the ogive with results in full expansion within 2" of penetration.

 

[Mark R]

I have used the Woodleigh Hydro version and would happily use them for everything.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Who has some experience shooting the cup point solids on game? I've been hearing reports of them creating wound channels of 2x bullet diameter, almost like an expanding solid. I'm curious in particular with Northfork's version of this but interested in anyone's experience with this style of solid bullet. I heard Kevin Robertson say that if limited to one bullet in Africa, this would be his choice.

View attachment 552169

@Green Chile
The Woodleigh hydrostatic stabilised projectile is reputed to be excellent for penetration and wound channels as well.
I have not used them but a mate that used them on water buffalo with a 300 Weatherby said the ream a buffalo out from stem to stern.
He said it kicked up dust a couple of hundred yards behind the buff and he thought he had missed. The buff took a few wobbly steps and fell over.
Bob

 

[Green Chile]

Thanks for the replies. Any photos of a recovered cup point? I like the comment about them riveting. That’s more accurate than to say expanding solid. There also seems to be some kind of air bubble effect that has hydraulic cavitation results that create larger than caliber wound channels. That’s the logical explanation for disruption beyond the touch of the bullet. The riveting is fairly minor in comparison to the petals of an expanding soft point.

 

[Hunter-Habib]

Thanks for the replies. Any photos of a recovered cup point? I like the comment about them riveting. That’s more accurate than to say expanding solid. There also seems to be some kind of air bubble effect that has hydraulic cavitation results that create larger than caliber wound channels. That’s the logical explanation for disruption beyond the touch of the bullet. The riveting is fairly minor in comparison to the petals of an expanding soft point.

400Gr .416 caliber Northfork Cup Point Solid recovered from Cape buffalo (right side).

Note how bullet riveted, as opposed to expansion in the true sense ( as seen on the recovered 400Gr .416 caliber Northfork Semi Spitzer on the left side).

 

[Green Chile]

Perfect and that's exactly the application I'm thinking of...416 Rigby on buff. Do you mind sharing load data? Did you approach it like loading for a Barnes X? I asked NF for load data and got just a little bit of info and no starting loads...only max loads.

 

[Hunter-Habib]

Perfect and that's exactly the application I'm thinking of...416 Rigby on buff. Do you mind sharing load data? Did you approach it like loading for a Barnes X? I asked NF for load data and got just a little bit of info and no starting loads...only max loads.

You want to use the load data of the 400Gr Barnes Banded Solid. Here you are.

https://www.barnesbullets.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/416RigbyWeb.pdf

 

[Green Chile]

Perfect. Thanks.

 

[Longwalker]

I wrote a report in the bullet performance data base on results from my .450-400 on buffalo. I was very impressed!

 

[Green Chile]

Could you put a link here to your report?

 

[double rifle newbie]

I have used the Woodleigh Hydro version and would happily use them for everything.

same. devastating on my Brooks Range interior grizzly with my 416 Remington magnum.

 

[Longwalker]

Bullet Performance Database
Type of bullet: North Fork cup point solid
Bullet speed: MV 2100 FPS
Distance of shot: 80M
Original weight: 400 gr.
Recovered weight: 400 gr.
Calibre: 450-400 3"
Species: Cape buffalo
Shot placement: this was a follow up shot from rear, buffalo was already mortally wounded and had spun away and starting to run. Bullet hit inside surface of right "ham", penetrated hindquarter ( missing the femur), through guts, rumen, and part of the right lung, lodged in ribcage on right side, after at least a meter and a half of penetration. There was a very noticeable "whomp' when the bullet hit, and visible reaction to the shot. buffalo ran only about five more steps. I was very impressed. Of course they quit making them!

Bullet Performance Database

There was a noticeable difference between the NF and the other two, on impact performance and penetration Sadly NF is folding. They have an excellent design, expensive, but “you get what you pay for!”

r.tapatalk.com

 

[Longwalker]

Bullet Performance Database
Type of bullet: North Fork cup point solid
Bullet speed: MV 2100 FPS
Distance of shot: 80M
Original weight: 400 gr.
Recovered weight: 400 gr.
Calibre: 450-400 3"
Species: Cape buffalo
Shot placement: this was a follow up shot from rear, buffalo was already mortally wounded and had spun away and starting to run. Bullet hit inside surface of right "ham", penetrated hindquarter ( missing the femur), through guts, rumen, and part of the right lung, lodged in ribcage on right side, after at least a meter and a half of penetration. There was a very noticeable "whomp' when the bullet hit, and visible reaction to the shot. buffalo ran only about five more steps. I was very impressed.

Bullet Performance Database

There was a noticeable difference between the NF and the other two, on impact performance and penetration Sadly NF is folding. They have an excellent design, expensive, but “you get what you pay for!”

r.tapatalk.com

 

[Longwalker]

See below

 

[Longwalker]

See above, had trouble with link

 

[Green Chile]

Bullet Performance Database
Type of bullet: North Fork cup point solid
Bullet speed: MV 2100 FPS
Distance of shot: 80M
Original weight: 400 gr.
Recovered weight: 400 gr.
Calibre: 450-400 3"
Species: Cape buffalo
Shot placement: this was a follow up shot from rear, buffalo was already mortally wounded and had spun away and starting to run. Bullet hit inside surface of right "ham", penetrated hindquarter ( missing the femur), through guts, rumen, and part of the right lung, lodged in ribcage on right side, after at least a meter and a half of penetration. There was a very noticeable "whomp' when the bullet hit, and visible reaction to the shot. buffalo ran only about five more steps. I was very impressed. Of course they quit making them!

Bullet Performance Database

There was a noticeable difference between the NF and the other two, on impact performance and penetration Sadly NF is folding. They have an excellent design, expensive, but “you get what you pay for!”

r.tapatalk.com

Thanks. Here's your bullet from that post showing the riveting effect.