Combo plains game and Dangerous Game scope

[MLindsay]

I have the same exact 2-12x42 on both of my 375 H&Hs and it works great for both DG and PG. I have a new NightForce NX8 1-8x24 on my CZ Lott that I just mounted and hope to shoot soon.

The Leupold scopes have been fine on my 375s but the Lott has been hard on Leupold 1-6x scopes.

That is the problem Scott starting with the Lott and on up. I have a Nikon slughunter on my 500 A2, 5 inches of eye relief but on my July Zim hunt when I was looking through my Meopta on my small rifle the difference in the glass was just unbelievable. I will never change the Nikon but wish the optics were better

 

[jimbo1972]

Quick math explanation because people get lost in the topic of light gathering in scopes. You know, you have to get a big 50mm scope because of light gathering, etc?

A typical male over the age of 40 has a maximum pupil dilation of around 6mm. (A young kid with great vision might reach almost 8mm).

So, let’s work the math. A 1-6x24mm optic set at 6x is transmitted 6/24=4mm. But at 4x, you are literally getting all the light through an optic that your over-40 years pupil is going to take in anyway for those low-light situations.

What is the average shooting distance for low-light, dawn/dusk hunting? A leopard blind is typically set at 70 yards. Dangerous game hunting of all types, in aggregate, in the Boddington study found the average shot distance was 38 yards. 38 yards taking in all of those extreme distance shots on Buffalo past 100 yards, you’re still at 38 yard average.

So for DG hunting you’re probably setting your power to 1x and an absolute max of 3x magnification for those 10 yard to 120 yard shots. Your light gathering with a 1-6x24mm set at 3x is passing 8mm of light gathering yet your eyes can only absorb 6mm best-case. Light gathering even on the 1-6x24mm is wasted.

The scenarios that come up in hunting where someone needs a 40mm or 50mm exit objective lens, or a 7x-12x zoom range are very, very rare. The consumer’s false belief they need it is why they are common, not because they are actually solving a problem.

With quality optics I have never been able to see difference in low light gathering ability of a 40mm, 44mm or 50mm. I know in theory there is a small difference but not enough for me to justify the extra size. My question is on magnification is I was on a plains game hunt in the Eastern Cape where I shot two animals at over 400 yards and my Leupold 3x15x44 VX5 magnification came in very handy to pick a blue wildebeest shoulder out from the surrounding brush on a hillside.

 

[Andrew62]

For several hunts I used a Leupold 1.5x5, now for versatility I use a Leupold 2x10x42 VX5. I feel for those longer shots the 10 power comes in handy sometimes. The VX6 in 2x12 would be ideal.

 

[nomspc]

This last trip to Limpopo I took my R8 .375 with a Swaro Z6i 1-6X24 and took 2 buffalo, 5 PG. My partner had a VX-6 1-6X24 on his .375, took a buff, 6 PG. My long shot was 150 yards. Hunting DG, I have the scope at 1X and the dot on.

 

[rookhawk]

With quality optics I have never been able to see difference in low light gathering ability of a 40mm, 44mm or 50mm. I know in theory there is a small difference but not enough for me to justify the extra size. My question is on magnification is I was on a plains game hunt in the Eastern Cape where I shot two animals at over 400 yards and my Leupold 3x15x44 VX5 magnification came in very handy to pick a blue wildebeest shoulder out from the surrounding brush on a hillside.

Being able to tell the difference between blue wildebeest and surrounding brush is really more a consideration for the types of coatings on the glass. All optics have coatings, converting some colors into others more intelligible by our eyes. As a general rule, humans suck at discerning blues and grays, the very colors that everything is in low light conditions. The really good glass (Swaro, S&B, Zeiss) tries to bend the light spectrum into something easier for us to pick up. Same for creating better differentiations in the brown colors.

Bad glass zoomed up is just bigger, blurrier stuff. The best glass will have the best clarity, the highest percent light gathering, and the best coatings. My own personal biases are that Swaro/Kahles has the best glass, then S&B. Others find durability to be of the utmost concern (e.g. snipers) in which case Nightforce and S&B are the strongest (heaviest) choices.

On my double rifle I had a 1-4x S&B and I would have no issue taking a PG shot out to the maximum ethical range of the weapon, about 220 yards. A magazine rifle with a Swaro 1-6 should have no issues out to 350 yards, and a 1-8x would provide additional broad daylight potential out to 600+ yards, albeit it would provide zero additional light gathering benefit over a 1-4 or 1-6 of equal exit objective lens size with the same clarity and coatings.

 

[nomspc]

With quality optics I have never been able to see difference in low light gathering ability of a 40mm, 44mm or 50mm. I know in theory there is a small difference but not enough for me to justify the extra size. My question is on magnification is I was on a plains game hunt in the Eastern Cape where I shot two animals at over 400 yards and my Leupold 3x15x44 VX5 magnification came in very handy to pick a blue wildebeest shoulder out from the surrounding brush on a hillside.

This makes sense if you’re in an area where longer shots are possible. I used a VX6 2-12X42 in Namibia for PG, same scope I use here for elk.

 

[Scott CWO]

1-6x24mm extended eye relief is the classic do-all scope for DG game plus PG shots out to 350 yards.

I would never sacrifice low rings and 1x straight tube in exchange to get more top-end zoom.

The USMC and US Army were using 10x fixed optics for targets between 600 and 1000 meters. If we can’t shoot 1/3rd that distance with a 6x power, it’s a user problem.

I’m not a particularly good shot as any that have seen me shoot can attest. Nonetheless, the farthest shot I’ve ever taken under extremely peculiar circumstances was 347 yards on a bushbuck with a 375HH using a 1-6x scope. Anything with more zoom than that doesn’t make me a better shooter, it just lets me see how terrible a shot I am at greater magnification.

I get it but not all hunting is done in Zimbabwe brush. I use mine on the AK Peninsula where it is more open and it will be going to Ethiopia for mountain nyala where shooting across a drainage or canyon is sometimes required. South Africa and Zambia (Kasonso, Bangweulu and Kafue Flats) have open areas. I have Talley low rings on both my CZ and my Whitworth with the Leupold 2-12x42mm mounted just fine. Even in the thickest brush, I have found 2x to be just fine. To each, his own.

 

[Cotton King]

Per the Philip Glass videos, I just put the Leuold VX 6 HD 2-12 x 42 Fire Dot on my 375 HH. Hopefully it provides the best flexibility from DG to Plains Game.

 

[rookhawk]

I get it but not all hunting is done in Zimbabwe brush. I use mine on the AK Peninsula where it is more open and it will be going to Ethiopia for mountain nyala where shooting across a drainage or canyon is sometimes required. South Africa and Zambia (Kasonso, Bangweulu and Kafue Flats) have open areas. I have Talley low rings on both my CZ and my Whitworth with the Leupold 2-12x42mm mounted just fine. Even in the thickest brush, I have found 2x to be just fine. To each, his own.

For your application, it is pretty hard to top a 3-9x36mm swaro for $600. They still come up fast and sit low, but you get the additional reach for scenarios like yours, Namibia, the Karoo, etc.

 

[PARA45]

This was my set up for my 2022 safari, Trijicon 1-6x24 on Alaskan Arms mounts, and this scope was excellent. I hunted PG & two DG animals (Lioness & Cow Buffalo). Could I have used the extra magnification during some of the hunts, absolutely, but I was fine with 6 power setting.

 

[Novice Huntress]

Thoughts on 2x12x42 vs 1x6x24 for a combo plains game DG Scope? This will be on a 375 H&H Blaser R8. Either one will be a Leupold VX6HD with Fire dot. DG will be mostly Buffalo

I will add I had an opportunity to do exactly the same, though initially I didn't know DG was on the menu.
I too use a R8 308w and 375H&H, I used and continue to use a Leica ERI 2.5-10x42 which worked extremely well, so I would not be worried about your 2-12x42 for your 375, obviously illuminated reticle is very handy to on a dark cape buffalo in the shadows!!!

Enjoy your trip

 

[Ridge Runner]

It’s just math. A 3-9x40mm optic set at 6x would be 6/40=6.66mm. Thus, a 3-9x40mm at 6x isn’t giving a male over 40 any more light gathering than a 1-6x24mm set at 4x.

A 2-12x50mm optic set at 12x is coming up short, only 4.16mm of light gathering when your eye can handle 6mm. So with this optic as example, your eye cannot absorb any more light gathering beyond 8.33x.

Clarity matters. Rapid target acquisition matters. Low power is far more important than high power under most real world hunting situations. In more than a dozen safaris, I’ve had my scope set to 6x a mere handful of times. It usually sits at 3x, providing not one bit less light gathering to my eye than a 50mm exit objective behemoth could do at the same power.

Thanks. But I'll stick with my 50mm objective with the 16x option to see the animal at 150 to 400 yards, in the shadows, beside the tree, looking at a limb nearly aligned in front of the vitals, that I couldn't see on 6x before deciding on taking or not taking the shot.

Or at 16x looking to verify blood on the side of the animal at 300+, 400+ yards before assuming that is the wounded animal we've been tracking, to make a follow up shot; where again that 6x lacked enough magnification.

How my gune are scoped.

On two 30-06s are 4-16 x 50mm with 1 scope has 32mm tube. the other scope has a 34mm tube.

On a .375H&H a 2-12 x 44mm with a 34mm tube.

On a 340 Weatherby has a 2-10 × 40mm with 1" tube. Came with the rifle.

On a 458WM has a 2-10 x 32mm straight tube scope.

On a 12 gauge slug gun has a 2-6 x 32mm with 1" tube. Came with the shotgun.

 

[Neophyte]

I tend to favor the 2-10 X 42.
I’m pert near sixty and find I like the higher magnification for those longer shots. The 2X is fine for close in stuff. For the .375 I think you’d be golden with the 2-12 X 42.
Just my $0.02. With the exchange rate it’s worth about $0.016.

 

[RichieG]

Anyone who has had a buffalo run towards them would probably prefer a 1x something. I'd suggest maybe start there?

 

[CZDiesel]

Rook is absolutely right here! I worked for Swarovski in sales for several years and we would explain this over and over to people…
This is not Swarovski but one of the big ones for you

Exit pupil | Basic Information about Binoculars | Nikon Consumer

 

[Philip Glass]

Thoughts on 2x12x42 vs 1x6x24 for a combo plains game DG Scope? This will be on a 375 H&H Blaser R8. Either one will be a Leupold VX6HD with Fire dot. DG will be mostly Buffalo

Thread 'My Take on Dangerous Game Scopes'

Nov 27, 2023

Here is a video where I discuss my journey in finding the ultimate DG scope. Bombs away!

• Philip Glass
• blaser dangerous game dangerous game scopes leupold philip glass philip glass safaris rifle scopes swarovski vx6
• Replies: 225
• Forum: .375 & up

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[Neophyte]

Anyone who has had a buffalo run towards them would probably prefer a 1x something. I'd suggest maybe start there?

Not trying to argue or be disrespectful but a friend who took multiple Cape Buffalo in the 1970’s used a fixed power 4X and some were right close.

 

[Philip Glass]

Facing this exact same question myself. I’m planning on going with the 2-12 for versatility. I habitually shoot with both eyes open, which has me leaning this way.

Philip Glass’ videos and comments on this forum were convincing.

On the other hand, I’d think about your intended common use. If it’s primarily buffalo - 1-6, if it’s primarily plains game with the occasional buffalo (my situation, not 100% I will hunt buffalo) 2-12.

Good luck!

PS. What ammo are you using? I’ve only been able to source Barnes 300 gr TSX which has a good reputation, though there is also some Hornady DGX available in my area. Hopefully both shoot accurately enough.

Thank you!
Stick with the TSX. It will NOT let you down.

 

[Philip Glass]

I don’t have the numbers in front of me but I bet the field of view on the 2-12x42 is just as large as the 1-5x24 and there’s nothing bad about having the option of 12x magnification for sighting in and for a few longer shots.

Yes sir. That is one of my points. There is very little difference in 1x and 2x.

 

[Philip Glass]

I have bought a Swarovski Z8i 1,7-13,3X42 for my hopefully soon to be finished custom rifle in .375 H&H. The reason for that is the idea of a riflescope to do it all.

On my double rifle I had the Swarovski Z8i 1-8x24 and noticed that I never had it on a lower setting then 2 so I think that 1,7 as the lowest setting will work great for me.

You will love that scope!