Beretta S56E

[Dewald]

Who knows anything about these older Beretta shotguns that could give some advice. I picked one up in good shape for R8000 last year, with the idea to have it restocked for my wife to shoot with. We live 300km from the nearest clay range, so our monthly or two-monthly clay shoot between 5 or 6 locals on one of the farms here is a very informal affair. Before spending big money on a small 20 gauge for her ( she is 5’2” and 99 pounds) I though if we can get the Beretta to the correct dimensions and start with 24 gram shells it might be a start. If the hobby grows on her then my wallet will suffer and I’ll get a 20 Ga fitted to her.

I’ve seen some of the S56E and S58E guns come out with single selective triggers. Mine unfortunately has two triggers, which doesn’t bother me to much, but if it can be changed easily enough I would like to do it. My other concern is whether the gun would still balance correctly if 3 or more inches of the stock is taken off to fit her.

 

[Dewald]

Nobody know anything about these?

 

[Velo Dog]

Hello Dewald,

I know only a little bit about Beretta shotguns overall, but that one shown in your pics here, with 2 triggers and solid rib is a real beauty to look at.
I like it a lot.
IMO, sometimes vintage Beretta shotguns can be had for what I think is a lot less than they should cost.

Also, being of simple retired blue collar income, my best shotgun is unfortunately not from a Bespoke London Maker or Prussian House of Linder, etc., etc.
Indeed it is a humble Italiano, Beretta Model 409, from the 1950’s - 1961ish ?
It’s a SxS in 20 bore, with extractors and lovingly fit at the factory with 2 triggers and dreaded 2 3/4 chambers, two sets of barrels and it has an aftermarket hard case to match.
One set is 28” full & modified.
The other set is 26” open choked (improved cylinder & modified ?).
I’ve not measured the chokes properly, but only thumb-nose guessing here.

My young trophy wife (she’s only 63), gave it to me for Christmas, not long ago.
And, I am definitely grateful for this little gun.
It has 2.5” drop at the heel and so this snappy little bird gun fits me very, very well.
I consulted 2 different professional gunsmiths, who also convert double shotguns to rifles, about having one set of my barrels made into a rifle, with the .303 British being my first choice and .30-30 Winchester being my 2nd choice.
They said no dice, because even though my gun has three fasteners (double under lugs and Greener cross bolt), those two cartridges generate just a tad too much chamber pressure plus, this gun does not have bushed firing pins.
Oye vey.

Not to worry, I am going to leave it as it is for now and tickled to use it as such with birdshot, as it was intended by the maker.
Maybe (maybe) someday, I might consider having the shorter barrels fit with express sights and the chokes polished out to cylinder & cylinder, for shooting slugs.
Such an arrangement will also remain fine for grouse and quail.
Speaking of quail, this winter I am bringing my vintage little Beretta to Gizmo’s ranch for a bit of bird hunting over his dogs, as the gun already is, without any such modifications.
Even with several months to go yet, I am already getting excited about this hunt.

Cheers,
Velo Dog.

 

[Kdgj]

These a fairly light field guns. Hopefully you are using some light loads or your wife may not like the recoil. I‘m sure the trigger can be converted. In the states you would want to talk to cole guns https://colegun.com/. I’m not sure who you could get to work on it in Zululand. You might want to send an email to Cole’s concerning parts. Taking 3” off the stock will change the balance.

 

[BeeMaa]

One of the pictures shows a significant mark on the top barrel on the right side. It's unclear if it's a superficial (although very deep) scratch or a crack that goes through to the chamber. I'd like to see that investigated a little further before you proceed too far into the deep end.

Other than that, it looks like a wonderful shotgun that will serve your bride well.

Anything worth doing is worth doing right. If it were me, I'd pony up the $ for a 20 bore shotgun that is properly fit to her slight frame. I understand trying to make things fit, but sometimes shaving the corners off a square peg make for a poor fit in the round hole.

 

[Paul Raley]

They are good shotguns , but like mentioned above they are light and the recoil is obviously felt more than a heavier gun . I also bought one a few years ago and eventually gave it to my son . In SA in the 70s ( maybe 80s ) they were imported and sold by Musgrave , some were also branded Musgrave . Fact is it is Beretta which makes it a decent shotgun . Good luck with it , may you and your wife have many happy shooting hours with it .

 

[Dewald]

View attachment 558543
One of the pictures shows a significant mark on the top barrel on the right side. It's unclear if it's a superficial (although very deep) scratch or a crack that goes through to the chamber. I'd like to see that investigated a little further before you proceed too far into the deep end.

Other than that, it looks like a wonderful shotgun that will serve your bride well.

Anything worth doing is worth doing right. If it were me, I'd pony up the $ for a 20 bore shotgun that is properly fit to her slight frame. I understand trying to make things fit, but sometimes shaving the corners off a square peg make for a poor fit in the round hole.

Good observation, those blemishes are indeed two scratches, the smaller one, I suspect from the gun being closed on a cartridge that was protruding somewhat. If you look at the face of the action though, they do not extend at all.

I put a few 28 gram 7,5s through it this afternoon. Recoil is slightly more than my Miroku 3700, but manageable. I do suspect if we are going to have it restocked and a more trim fore-end made for my wife it is going to be a very unwieldy gun to shoot and recoil will be unpleasant. So much so for a trial run before buying a little 20 gauge. I guess on the up side now I’ve got another field gun for chasing the odd flock of Guinea fowl when time permits or having a go at the local pigeon population

 

[Red Leg]

The issue of balance and stock length is driven by barrel length. Based upon what you need to shorten this gun, I suspect the result would be barrel heavy in her hands. I would find something with 26" tubes as my base gun - not that hard with 20's.

With respect to these Berettas, they are fine and very durable guns. They preceded the now ubiquitous 686 action but have many of the same features. In the State this action was sold as the BL series (2&4), were very popular in the seventies, and largely put Beretta on the map in this country. As others have noted, they are light for bore, so keep the loads manageable.

 

[Dewald]

Thanks for the input @Redleg, obviously 26” of 20gauge is going to weigh less that 26” (not that I will shorten) of 12 gauge, which will influence the balance.

Where do you suggest I start looking for a suitable 20 that will serve her well, but be in the price range of a first gun? She manages better with my 16 Ga SxS, but again the dimensions are just to long.

Currently options in SA are Beretta 686 and Browning B25’s both with 30” barrels. One often finds the odd Franchi 20 Ga around as well, I cant find specs at any of the larger retailers now,

Seems things are going she is getting a 5 pound something Evans 20 in a oak and leather case for my next birthday

 

[mdwest]

The issue of balance and stock length is driven by barrel length. Based upon what you need to shorten this gun, I suspect the result would be barrel heavy in her hands. I would find something with 26" tubes as my base gun - not that hard with 20's.

Completely concur with this..

My daughters first clay gun was a Webley & Scott 920 with a "bantam" length stock and 26" barrels in 20 gauge.. it is a relatively light gun overall.. she's on the small size (5'6".. about 120lbs).. she shot exceptionally well with it...

We've since moved her to a W&S 912 (basically the same gun, just in 12 ga on a larger frame).. the 12ga has 28" barrels and she's grown into a longer stock.. we ended up having to get the stock cut down slightly when we got it fitted to her, and also had a little weight inserted into the stock to move the balance point to the rear.. none of the work was terribly difficult or expensive though.. and she is an absolute terror with the 12ga and now runs circles around many of the much more experienced shooters on her team... (stepping up from the 20 to the 12 made a huge difference in trap and sporting clays.. and a slight difference in her skeet scores)..

For what its worth, the Webley and Scot 900 series guns arent all that expensive.. the challenge here is they arent very common in the US and were only imported for a few years... but from what I can tell they are very common and easy to come by in the commonwealth countries.. when I started searching for a 912 to buy I could easily find them at very reasonable prices in the UK, Canada, Australia, and even found a few in New Zealand.. I got lucky and finally found a very slightly used one in the US on gunbroker after searching daily for several months and got it for a good price... I dont know if you can find one in South Africa.. but if you can, I highly recommend them.. we've had great success with both a 20 and a 12 gauge (Daughter is currently ranked 5th in the state in her competitive class, often shooting against kids carrying guns that cost 3-5x as much)..

 

[Dewald]

Thank you for the above. I haven’t come across them in SA, but it wouldn’t hurt to start looking. Somewhere there must be one gathering dust and looking for a new owner.

We will likely never be as competitive as your daughter, but the idea is for a few couples to have fun on a farm once a month, have a braai and a drink afterwards, and do it again in the next 5 or 6 weeks.

 

[mark-hunter]

As a side note.
Zastava Factory in sixties and seventies had license with beretta and produced similar models s55 and s56.
My granpa had version of Zastava/Beretta s56 with english stock. That was first shotgun I ever fired!

Serbian models sometimes had Serbian proof marks on the barrel. Or berretta factory markings, with small imprint made in Yugoslavia. If I remember correctly some parts were imported from Italy, and assembled at Zastava factory. My good friend has Serbian Beretta S55, pistol grip stock, Serbian proof marks on the barrel, berreta markings on action.

By all engraving and marking, yours is original Italian, as it seams to me. So, dont worry,

 

[RockSlinger404]

@Dewald, if your objective is to minimise recoil, why don't you consider a 28 bore? With the smaller frame of the 20ga guns, the felt recoil is not much less than a 12ga. The 28ga punches above its weight and seeing that she won't be shooting millions of shells, ammo availability shouldn't be much of an issue.

 

[Desperatezulu]

Maybe contact Juan Broglioli - he's the local Beretta gunsmithing expert. He'll know all about the S56 series and can advise what mods may be available to you.

I have an S56S (the skeet version) which is a single trigger and very comfortable to shoot. I have shot a lot with an S56E too - my abiding memories are uncomfortable recoil and getting my finger whacked by the front trigger. Hence I don't own one.

There was a barely used 20ga Silver Pigeon doing the for sale rounds a month or 2 back - I'll see if I can find it. But you'd be looking at 3-4x what you paid for the 58E....
As you know, anything other than 12ga in this country means ammo is eye-wateringly expensive and very hard to find.

As non-traditional as it may be, I wonder if a semi-auto 12ga isn't the best solution for your wife

 

[spike.t]

Have one exactly same apart from mine has single trigger...think was bought it when I was 15 or 16 so way back last century.....Still have it but not used in probably 40 plus years....used it on clays and can't remember it being bad to shoot....Nice gun...but then got clay guns so used them instead

 

[sierraone]

Hello Dewald,

I know only a little bit about Beretta shotguns overall, but that one shown in your pics here, with 2 triggers and solid rib is a real beauty to look at.
I like it a lot.
IMO, sometimes vintage Beretta shotguns can be had for what I think is a lot less than they should cost.

Also, being of simple retired blue collar income, my best shotgun is unfortunately not from a Bespoke London Maker or Prussian House of Linder, etc., etc.
Indeed it is a humble Italiano, Beretta Model 409, from the 1950’s - 1961ish ?
It’s a SxS in 20 bore, with extractors and lovingly fit at the factory with 2 triggers and dreaded 2 3/4 chambers, two sets of barrels and it has an aftermarket hard case to match.
One set is 28” full & modified.
The other set is 26” open choked (improved cylinder & modified ?).
I’ve not measured the chokes properly, but only thumb-nose guessing here.

My young trophy wife (she’s only 63), gave it to me for Christmas, not long ago.
And, I am definitely grateful for this little gun.
It has 2.5” drop at the heel and so this snappy little bird gun fits me very, very well.
I consulted 2 different professional gunsmiths, who also convert double shotguns to rifles, about having one set of my barrels made into a rifle, with the .303 British being my first choice and .30-30 Winchester being my 2nd choice.
They said no dice, because even though my gun has three fasteners (double under lugs and Greener cross bolt), those two cartridges generate just a tad too much chamber pressure plus, this gun does not have bushed firing pins.
Oye vey.
Not to worry, I am going to leave it as it is for now and tickled to use it as such with birdshot, as it was intended by the maker.
Maybe (maybe) someday, I might consider having the shorter barrels fit with express sights and the chokes polished out to cylinder & cylinder, for shooting slugs.
Such an arrangement will also remain fine for grouse and quail.
Speaking of quail, this winter I am bringing my vintage little Beretta to Gizmo’s ranch for a bit of bird hunting over his dogs, as the gun already is, without any such modifications.
Even with several months to go yet, I am already getting excited about this hunt.

Cheers,
Velo Dog.

Good Morning Paul. I had a S56E in 12 ga, I bought new in 1973 when I was in the Navy in Italy. Sold it to a dentist in 1989 for about twice what I paid. I was at the Tulsa Arms Show in 2014 and bought a like new S56E in 20 ga single selective trigger. It was spotless with the exception of having a sling attachment on the barrels and had a "filler" on the stock where a stock sling attachment had once been. It has dove hunted twice and that was 9 or 10 years ago. Beautiful little shotgun. May give it to my grandson when he gets a little taller. Just thought I would throw this out after reading this post....

 

[Dewald]

@Dewald, if your objective is to minimise recoil, why don't you consider a 28 bore? With the smaller frame of the 20ga guns, the felt recoil is not much less than a 12ga. The 28ga punches above its weight and seeing that she won't be shooting millions of shells, ammo availability shouldn't be much of an issue.

You are absolutely right, a little 28 Gauge would be the dream. Realistically in good old South Africa ammunition is virtually unobtainable for them. I know one person in the country with a 28 Ga, and as far as I know he reloads for the gun. I have in the past loaded for 16 gauge and 12 gauge, but it is not something I’m going to do again unless absolutely forced to. Quality shot and primers are so expensive here that combined with the cost of a proper MEC or similar press it is still cheaper to buy ammunition here.

 

[Dewald]

Maybe contact Juan Broglioli - he's the local Beretta gunsmithing expert. He'll know all about the S56 series and can advise what mods may be available to you.

I have an S56S (the skeet version) which is a single trigger and very comfortable to shoot. I have shot a lot with an S56E too - my abiding memories are uncomfortable recoil and getting my finger whacked by the front trigger. Hence I don't own one.

There was a barely used 20ga Silver Pigeon doing the for sale rounds a month or 2 back - I'll see if I can find it. But you'd be looking at 3-4x what you paid for the 58E....
As you know, anything other than 12ga in this country means ammo is eye-wateringly expensive and very hard to find.

As non-traditional as it may be, I wonder if a semi-auto 12ga isn't the best solution for your wife

I have Juan’s number, I might chat to him or Alan Henry, I learnt to shoot with side by sides, so the double triggers didn’t bother me when I shot it. The idea of changing to a single trigger was to make it easier for my wife to reach a trigger that is positioned further back.

I think at the moment this will become my second field gun and i’ll go back to the drawing board and start looking for a suitable gun for her to shoot

 

[rookhawk]

Nobody know anything about these?

They are alright. At about $450 for the one you're looking at, thats a good deal. They usually go $600-$800 over here, perhaps by uniformed buyers starry eyed by the name.

The good:

-Fairly well made
-Cheap
-Somewhat reliable

The Bad:

-Not proofed for steel
-Fixed chokes
-They do not interoperate with 680 / 686 / 687 parts, so the service and repair reputation of Berettas does not apply


If it were me, I would find some eley or gamebore subsonic target loads with 24g of powder, and I would chop 1" from the stock. At 13", it will be a bit long, and it will have a plastic/wood butt plate. However, the recoil for a small person will be reasonable. When the person grows, you can add a 1" pad to get the gun back to 14" for future use.

I would not cut the gun down 2-3" because there will be so little stock remaining, the pad will be very small and the recoil will intensify over the smaller surface area.

 

[Fixfire]

Beautiful Beretta. I think it would be a shame to “alter” its current configuration, particularly since (as recommended) a properly fit model or a 28ga could make more sense. Unfamiliar with that model, does it have fixed chokes??
Another thing to consider for versatility would be removable chokes.