Back country carry gun

[Shootist43]

Guys, it is all about sight alignment and trigger squeeze. If you want to be a better shot with a handgun you need to practice with it. Better yet join a club that shoots Bullseye. Learn to control a 22 and the bigger stuff comes easy, it just has a bigger bang. BTW at 75 I still shoot Bullseye twice a week. My hunting revolver is an old three screw Ruger Blackhawk in 44 Mag.

 

[larry4831]

Why the Blackhawk and not the Redhawk? Is it the SA vs DA, or something else? Just curious. I'm looking at 480 Ruger myself.

Beartooth Bullets makes a 325 gr WFNGC with a .390 meplat that can be pushed to 1400 FPS. I shoot BTB 425 and 525 gr out of my 45-70 at about 1600 fps. I'm really impressed with bullet performance and consistency. BTB also makes a 420 WFNGC with a .385 meplat, but you can order the bullets in .476, .477, or .478. It'll work with 480 Ruger and 475 Linebaugh.

I'd think the Redhawk would handle the recoil a bit better.

Because I have the relatively new Ruger super Blackhawk in 480 and 454 and with hot loads the Blackhawks are easier to shoot than the Redhawk with a hot load. However, the Redhawk with a hard cast 360 grain bullet loaded with 21 or 22 grains of H-110 is a real beast. My Redhawk with a 4" barrel is a little easier to carry than the Blackhawks with the 6.5" barrels. The recoil of the Redhawk is brutal. It's not a SA vs DA It's just what I have and what I feel like carrying at the time.

 

[Von S.]

Guys, it is all about sight alignment and trigger squeeze. If you want to be a better shot with a handgun you need to practice with it. Better yet join a club that shoots Bullseye. Learn to control a 22 and the bigger stuff comes easy, it just has a bigger bang. BTW at 75 I still shoot Bullseye twice a week. My hunting revolver is an old three screw Ruger Blackhawk in 44 Mag.

Shootist,

The first round I squeezed out of a 500 s&w has 500 grain loads that were absolutely horrible.

It felt like Roger Marris hit my hand with a bat. I put it down on the bench and started laughing and tried to run the sting off my hand and gave it a couple of oh boys. A 460 was like a sissy round compared to this handgun.

A nice guy here sent me a nice pm and told me not to quit. And who am I to argue with a guy who killed an elephant with a handgun and 60 other heads of big game?

I loaded 350 grain hp,s pretty warm and after abox or so and mounting a scope I got ok with it up to 100 yards.

Yesterday I shot a small deer in the chest and he went down like he was hit by a truck. No too far away and truthfully I don't care for shooting eating animals with a pistol or revolver as I won't attempt to shoot them with a handgun in the head as I don't have the confidence that I have with a rifle.

A fella at the range asked me if I wanted to shoot his 458 Win Mag revolver....I thanked him and said no as it must assuridly kick way worse than my 500.

Chances are I'll never hunt with it again, but it was one hell of a stopper.

 

[charleslabounty]

Ruger Alaskan
Ammo 340 gn Buffaloe Bore ( note a sticker on the box states not for use in S&W or Taurus)
Carried in Ruger’s chest carry fabric rig - very comfortable carry set up while stream fishing in Alaska.

 

[Shootist43]

I spent many years running the Pistol Range during our Club's "sight in days." We had both 25 and 50 Yd. targets available. There was one group of four guys that came almost every year with their 454 Casulls neither of them ever put 5 shots into the black from the bench let alone off-hand. They complained that I would not let them move to the 50 Yd. line because that is where their "bait pile" was. Towards the end of the day when things were slowing down, I'd get out my scoped Blackhawk and proceed to put 10 out of 10 shots into the black at 50 Yds. They "challenged" me to do that with their 454 Casulls which to their amazement I did. But to this day I can remember not liking it one bit. One thing about big revolvers, the grips need to fit your hand. If they don't you'll get "bit" every time you pull the trigger.

 

[sgt_zim]

Guys, it is all about sight alignment and trigger squeeze. If you want to be a better shot with a handgun you need to practice with it. Better yet join a club that shoots Bullseye. Learn to control a 22 and the bigger stuff comes easy, it just has a bigger bang. BTW at 75 I still shoot Bullseye twice a week. My hunting revolver is an old three screw Ruger Blackhawk in 44 Mag.

Yeppers.

I've also found over the years that confidence is every bit as important as technique. While shooting IPSC or IDPA is a different beast, accuracy for hunting and self-defense isn't difficult to obtain.

As long as you know what the 4 primary technique errors look like on your target, it's easy to figure out what you're doing wrong and correct it.

When I was a police cadet and we first went to the pistol range, I expected I'd shoot well. I did, and shot Marksman in pretty short order. With some technique refinement over a couple more weeks, I was shooting high expert (590+ out of 600 possible points) and never looked back. All that with an out-of-the-box SW 686.

 

[BRICKBURN]

............
When I .......... first went to the pistol range, I expected I'd shoot well. ..........

I did too. I am convinced every hand gun I have ever shot is actually a shotgun in disguise. (at least that is what the targets always look like) In my life they are fun noise makers.

 

[Shootist43]

Generally speaking, good pistol shooters make good rifle shooters. It doesn't work the other way around.

 

[BRICKBURN]

Generally speaking, good pistol shooters make good rifle shooters. It doesn't work the other way around.

I am living proof of that one.

 

[sgt_zim]

I did too. I am convinced every hand gun I have ever shot is actually a shotgun in disguise. (at least that is what the targets always look like) In my life they are fun noise makers.

 

[sgt_zim]

Generally speaking, good pistol shooters make good rifle shooters. It doesn't work the other way around.

Art, what's really funny...after I'd been on the department a couple years and it came time for my annual qualification (by this time, I'd moved to a Sig P-220)...

Within the first 3 rounds (36 total shots fired, 12 per round), I'd so thoroughly shot out the center of the target that I'd intentionally not shoot my last couple bullets on the 3rd round and still get full credit of 120 points for that round. The scorers just assumed I'd put all 12 shots into the gaping hole that was the 10 ring. A little chest thumping, but it ain't bragging if it's true.

I'm not that good anymore, but still pretty good.

 

[Shootist43]

I understand completely. I still make the "actual team" more times then not, in our South Eastern Michigan Pistol Association Matches but I don't shoot as good as I used to either. Last summer while shooting outdoors at 50 Yd. targets (one handed) I told a buddy of mine that also holds a NRA Masters Classification that "compared to the good old days, we don't shoot for sh** but we can still outshoot 99% of the overall population."

 

[ChrisG]

Generally speaking, good pistol shooters make good rifle shooters. It doesn't work the other way around.

That is ABSOLUTELY true! I was a mediocre shot with a rifle until I turned 21, got a job as an armored car guard and was required to qualify. After sending some 2,000 rounds down range during that 47 hour course, My pistol shooting got better. So I determined to become even better at it and over the years I have probably expended 10s of thousands of rounds into the ranges berm, trying to learn from each shot why it did or didn't go where I wanted it to... I am by no means as accomplished as most bullseye shooters. I was satisfied with basic practical skills, which in my mind, meant hitting a 8" circle at 50 yards 9 out of 10 times. I don'town a .44 magnum anymore as I just shot better with smaller guns, which is why I settled on the .45 Super.

Anyway, applying pistol shooting techniques to rifles VASTLY improves rifle shooting in a way that hundreds or thousands of rifle rounds may not. In my mind, the best riflemen are not the ones who can hit a gong at 500 yards with a $5,000 custom rifle and a bunch of ballistics charts... they are the ones that can skip a bowling pin along the ground with a bolt action rifle at 100 yards, and the only time it stops moving is when they have burned up their 4 or 5 rounds.

Hitting steel at 700 yards is a firearms math game, hitting moving targets at 75 yards is a firearms skills game.

 

[sgt_zim]

I understand completely. I still make the "actual team" more times then not, in our South Eastern Michigan Pistol Association Matches but I don't shoot as good as I used to either. Last summer while shooting outdoors at 50 Yd. targets (one handed) I told a buddy of mine that also holds a NRA Masters Classification that "compared to the good old days, we don't shoot for sh** but we can still outshoot 99% of the overall population."

Nice to have those skills. Means the only way a turd is going to get you is to catch you up short, or maybe has a golden bb in his gun. Otherwise, it's always our party.

 

[Jon Ray]

I carried a charter arms bulldog 44 special and most the time carried a Marlin 1894C 357 rifle. In Nevada near Lake Lahontan I had a Mountain lion get after my dog and was able to fire near it and chase it off. In California my woods gun was a Ruger SP101 in 357mag.

 

[rnovi]

As someone who owns both a Smith 629 7.5” PC light hunter and a 69 4” I can say that the recoil on the 69 is quite violent for me. In my 629 I can put 50 rounds of 300 gr. 1250 FPS handloads downrange while with my 69 I’m barely able to launch 5 rounds of factory 240’s.

Everyone is different. Im going to try to make some lower pressure loads for the 69. 300 gr at 900 FPS might be the answer. If not, I’ll stick to a .357 with 180’s or a 9mm. More and more I find myself less and less enamored with recoil.

 

[Velo Dog]

Hello flat8,

Great topic, thanks for posting it.
Yours truly has lived and worked in Alaska for well over 30 something years now.
Both grizzly and black bear encounters are very common here, sometimes even in our largest city, Anchorage.
Our polar bear are only common in the far northern region of this state.

Regardless of the specific bear sub-species, maulings are not very common here but, they do happen now and then.
Pepper spray seems to work very well on animals, including bears, if you deploy it before said animal launches a determined charge.
A determined charge evidently is only stopped reliably with a brain hit or a spinal hit, combined with adequate damage to same.

Personally, I’d prefer a large bore, fast handling rifle for this.
However, being a fly fishing junkie, especially as it pertains to wading remote salmon streams, a rifle and fly casting do not mix well.
During the times that I’ve carried mean old Mister .375 on such fishing trips, all too often I was leaving it a few steps away at best, leaned against a boulder or a willow bush.
It’s useless if your first realization that a bear has joined you in the creek is when, you see him standing slap bang half way between yourself and where you left your rifle, watching you flail the waters with your sink tip line.
I have experienced that exact scenario.

And so I eventually (around 1989 or 90 I think) caved in and bought a handgun that is, IMO well suited to carrying all day long and yet in a fairly powerful caliber, at least fairly powerful in handgun terms.
I settled on a S&W Model 629, 4” dreaded .44 magnum, double action revolver.
It is heavy enough to dampen recoil somewhat but light enough that I’m never tempted to leave it somewhere else while I’m fishing.
I chose that one because a full pressure .44 magnum is the top end of my recoil tolerance in shooting a lot for practice.

I have a chest holster for most stream fishing, as it often involves wading and this keeps it above the water very well.
Plus, as such it doesn’t interfere with my spastic fly rod antics.
This revolver’s sights are dedicated to only Federal brand “cast core” 300 grain flat nose factory ammunition.
Why Federal includes the word “core” in the name I cannot guess.
These bullets are monolithic solids, made from a VERY hard lead alloy.
There is no separate core per se.
They seem to be unavailable now but, I have enough to last awhile.

I’ve encountered many bears and some at only a few yards, down to a few feet.
One pressed his snout against me while I was in a tube tent / bivy sack and sniffed loudly, like a big hound.
However, much to my delight I’ve never been charged by one.

Merry Christmas to all,
Velo Dog.

 

[ldmay375]

Hello flat8,

Great topic, thanks for posting it.
Yours truly has lived and worked in Alaska for well over 30 something years now.
Both grizzly and black bear encounters are very common here, sometimes even in our largest city, Anchorage.
Our polar bear are only common in the far northern region of this state.

Regardless of the specific bear sub-species, maulings are not very common here but, they do happen now and then.
Pepper spray seems to work very well on animals, including bears, if you deploy it before said animal launches a determined charge.
A determined charge evidently is only stopped reliably with a brain hit or a spinal hit, combined with adequate damage to same.

Personally, I’d prefer a large bore, fast handling rifle for this.
However, being a fly fishing junkie, especially as it pertains to wading remote salmon streams, a rifle and fly casting do not mix well.
During the times that I’ve carried mean old Mister .375 on such fishing trips, all too often I was leaving it a few steps away at best, leaned against a boulder or a willow bush.
It’s useless if your first realization that a bear has joined you in the creek is when, you see him standing slap bang half way between yourself and where you left your rifle, watching you flail the waters with your sink tip line.
I have experienced that exact scenario.

And so I eventually (around 1989 or 90 I think) caved in and bought a handgun that is, IMO well suited to carrying all day long and yet in a fairly powerful caliber, at least fairly powerful in handgun terms.
I settled on a S&W Model 629, 4” dreaded .44 magnum, double action revolver.
It is heavy enough to dampen recoil somewhat but light enough that I’m never tempted to leave it somewhere else while I’m fishing.
I chose that one because a full pressure .44 magnum is the top end of my recoil tolerance in shooting a lot for practice.

I have a chest holster for most stream fishing, as it often involves wading and this keeps it above the water very well.
Plus, as such it doesn’t interfere with my spastic fly rod antics.
This revolver’s sights are dedicated to only Federal brand “cast core” 300 grain flat nose factory ammunition.
Why Federal includes the word “core” in the name I cannot guess.
These bullets are monolithic solids, made from a VERY hard lead alloy.
There is no separate core per se.
They seem to be unavailable now but, I have enough to last awhile.

I’ve encountered many bears and some at only a few yards, down to a few feet.
One pressed his snout against me while I was in a tube tent / bivy sack and sniffed loudly, like a big hound.
However, much to my delight I’ve never been charged by one.

Merry Christmas to all,
Velo Dog.

The 300 grain Federal Cast Core were my favorite factory loads for my S&W 44's.
It seems that I have not seen any in local stores in years.

 

[Ray B]

For absorbing recoil I have found that the grip is the most important part. Back in the day, I carried a duty weapon. the only limitation was that it needed to be concealed and I needed to have qualified with it. I got S&W 60 & 66. Both were short barrels and round grips. The checkering pattern on the wood grips caused a sharp edge along the back of the grip, particularly on the 60. If I fired six shots of P+ the grip would cut my hand. Both wood grips were replaced with Pachmaers and that ended the problem. Even with full house 357 loads that 2 1/2" 66 was pleasant and easy to shoot. I imagine the effect of having a form fitted comfortable grip would be a significant factor when shooting those hand cannons.

 

[edward]

This guy famously got mauled twice, and both the spray and the gun were of lessor use.

A couple of the recent killings I read about involved black bears, 3 incidents in one month in which they attacked people in tents. The kind of situation where bear spray has limited use. Not that I particularly expect to find my gun either.

-----------------------------------------

Assuming the law is neutral, I would like to have a a rifle for this kind of thing. A really heavy snub nose is not my kind of thing, seems mostly a convenience thing. Easy to say since they aren't legal anyway up here.

kind of hard to use a rifle when the bear has a bear hug on you.