Any of you stop a charge with a handgun?

[MaxXSaker]

I've seen many videos online of hunters in Africa using rifles to stop charges from dangerous game but, what about using handguns being used to stop charges from dangerous game (Lion, Cape Buffalo, Elephant, Hyena) ? Have any of you seen or been part of having to use a handgun to stop a charge?

Is the Smith & Wesson 460 and 500 x-frames allowed in Africa as it's a Double-Action, or are only Single Action revolvers allowed?

For handgun ammo, is it best to use mono-metal brass and copper solid or can you use hard cast lead LBT for head-on shots against a charging cape buffalo?

Honestly, trying to stop a charging buffalo with a handgun is asking for trouble. Even big revolvers like the S&W 500 don't have the reliable stopping power of a proper rifle. Most African countries won't even allow handguns for dangerous game for good reason - the risk is just too high. If you're facing something that can kill you, you want the most reliable tool available, and that's always a rifle.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

When I did my lethal weapon training, the instructor hammered into our heads a pistol only has a effective range of 15 feet, when we went for the weapon test I was amazed at the number of people who failed the test, at 15 feet, a pistol is good for snakes and if your “ spydie senses “ are on highest level against hogs and bears, humans and pistol is in hand
I had the neighbors pit bull mix attack the outside cat and ripped its ear off , it was still in the yard when I hit it with a 1oz load of #6 20ga , to CMA , I called the S.D animal control officer, she came out to investigate, and the dog came after her , she missed all 14 times at 5 feet but it did stop her from getting bitten, a trained LEO missing @ 5 yards to 5 feet on a moving target just kinda makes me wonder how effective a side arm is for defense against animals, when she went to her cruiser for a shotgun . I took care of the dog with my .22 mag as it was trying to get back through the hole in the fence. Total shit show , 4 LEO’s in my yard with little orange cones and measuring tapes , measuring from bloody spot to empty shell casings, and from my house door to dead dog ! ( 42yards)

You should have sent that idiot neighbor a dead skunk in his mailbox ... at the very least. Hopefully he was charged. Pitbulls have been legally banned in Ontario for some time now. Not sure how or if the reg is enforced. I still do see a few of them around but at least if the damn things get out of control there's another criminal charge on the list for the owner.

Hitting a moving target with a shouldered gun (rifle or shotgun) requires some skill. Hitting one with a handgun requires 10x skill. But of course that's not true because John Wayne movies prove it's easy.

 

[thoma018]

no comment here...just following some of this conversation...but check this out; you can skip to about minute 16 to start but all of it is entertaining. if you find it interesting search for part 1 also.

BTY i think this is some of Martin Johnson's (Osa) films.

 

[pilar]

Dang, this thread went down hill fast.

No it was doomed from the start ,
Regardless of where you stand about pistols , it is ridiculously ignorant to obsess on stopping a DG charge no matter which YouTube fool you quote or worship

 

[Ontario Hunter]

no comment here...just following some of this conversation...but check this out; you can skip to about minute 16 to start but all of it is entertaining. if you find it interesting search for part 1 also.

BTY i think this is some of Martin Johnson's (Osa) films.

Quite the staged spectacle. I wonder how much they paid the tribe for a cadaver (hopefully!) to use as bait. Both of the camera crew sported Hitler mustaches. I don't recall Martin Johnson had any facial hair. Maybe just actors he hired?

Edit: No photo of Martin Johnson where he's not clean shaven. Also he was much taller than either of these guys. Judging by several group photos, I'm guessing he must have been around 6'6" tall. The film outfit's name on the truck indicates it was based in Colorado. The Johnsons were from Kansas and very proud of it.

 

[BRICKBURN]

You know, Brick, there's a fundamental difference between being prepared for the shot and the attack coming out of the blue. And even if you are prepared, the shots sometimes miss their target and the force of the attacks is enormous; it doesn't even have to be a wild pig weighing over 60 kg.
Fortunately, we have dogs on this hunt, and if they're any good, they will be the first victims and you'll have time to shoot.

Just my 2 cent

I wish we could have that line of defense when we hunt big game. At least you would get some warning. My friends dog, while by his side, barked twice at the oncoming Grizzly charge and it slowed the bear through distraction, along with the bear popping his jaws prior to the charge provided enough time to have the bear spray ready. Sometimes we can just be lucky.
Keep safe.

 

[BRICKBURN]

https://www.africahunting.com/help/terms/

 

[VertigoBE]

Well I thought this morning that this thread could not get any worse, and @Carnivore hunter managed to prove he can stoop even lower.

Which is a shame, as there was some interesting info coming from our resident bear hunting professionals.

 

[BRICKBURN]

Which is a shame, as there was some interesting info coming from our resident bear hunting professionals.

There will be no more quick sand to sink in.

Polite, reasonable, knowledgeable replies are always welcome to continue.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

Looks like he was banned while my last post was being written. Someone else must have beat me to the report button. Apologies for losing my cool. I should not have taken the bait.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

I wish we could have that line of defense when we hunt big game. At least you would get some warning. My friends dog, while by his side, barked twice at the oncoming Grizzly charge and it slowed the bear through distraction, along with the bear popping his jaws prior to the charge provided enough time to have the bear spray ready. Sometimes we can just be lucky.
Keep safe.

Popping jaws is a warning the bear is nervous. Sometimes followed by a charge but usually a bluff charge. A surprised bear that attacks and mauls usually doesn't have time to consider giving a warning. A bear that is observed stalking you is an absolute threat! Find a tree. Fast. That one wants to eat you. Exception would be subadults. They usually just don't know what they're doing. Often I think they are just looking for company. Or leftover scraps. I experienced numerous jaw popping warnings from adult bears, the closest being less than ten feet. I was on my way to go fishing and there was a "bear jam" on the way to observation platforms. About a dozen visitors were stuck. Suddenly a sow appeared on the trail behind us. And she walked towards us. "Okay folks, let's move on down the trail slowly. Keep an eye on that sow with cub up ahead." I kept myself between the bear and visitors. Suddenly the visitor in the front says "She caught a fish." "Okay, everyone STOP." That sow was sick with a crybaby cub and she was a known cranky troublemaker. I kept my bear in peripheral vision (don't look at them - look away as a sign of submission), backing to visitors and speaking calmly. Then she popped her gums! "Okay, everyone off the trail and into the swamp. Now! We gotta let this bear by." I dug out my radio and called for help. Turns out the on-duty bear tech was in the sack with a young gal from the archeology crew. That bear walked by me not four feet away. She had three feet of tapeworm hanging out her butt. I was in civies with uniform underneath in case I got jammed while fishing and couldn't get back to change. The radio was in my daypack. I never identified myself as a ranger but everyone seemed to accept I knew what I was doing.

I was stalked once when fishing alone at the creek on the other end of Brooks Lake. Very unnerving. Played cat and mouse in the timber till I could get to the boat on the beach. He came right out to the water's edge as I backed away. I would have shot that SOB if I'd had the means.

 

[Daisy]

So you don't care about the opinions of those with vastly more experiences ence than you? That's what I thought. Have it your own ignorant way.

Scott has more experience and he mostly carries a pistol too. He also said use a 9 or 10mm and not a 44 magnum.

 

[pilar]

Popping jaws is a warning the bear is nervous. Sometimes followed by a charge but usually a bluff charge. A surprised bear that attacks and mauls usually doesn't have time to consider giving a warning. A bear that is observed stalking you is an absolute threat! Find a tree. Fast. That one wants to eat you. Exception would be subadults. They usually just don't know what they're doing. Often I think they are just looking for company. Or leftover scraps. I experienced numerous jaw popping warnings from adult bears, the closest being less than ten feet. I was on my way to go fishing and there was a "bear jam" on the way to observation platforms. About a dozen visitors were stuck. Suddenly a sow appeared on the trail behind us. And she walked towards us. "Okay folks, let's move on down the trail slowly. Keep an eye on that sow with cub up ahead." I kept myself between the bear and visitors. Suddenly the visitor in the front says "She caught a fish." "Okay, everyone STOP." That sow was sick with a crybaby cub and she was a known cranky troublemaker. I kept my bear in peripheral vision (don't look at them - look away as a sign of submission), backing to visitors and speaking calmly. Then she popped her gums! "Okay, everyone off the trail and into the swamp. Now! We gotta let this bear by." I dug out my radio and called for help. Turns out the on-duty bear tech was in the sack with a young gal from the archeology crew. That bear walked by me not four feet away. She had three feet of tapeworm hanging out her butt. I was in civies with uniform underneath in case I got jammed while fishing and couldn't get back to change. The radio was in my daypack. I never identified myself as a ranger but everyone seemed to accept I knew what I was doing.

I was stalked once when fishing alone at the creek on the other end of Brooks Lake. Very unnerving. Played cat and mouse in the timber till I could get to the boat on the beach. He came right out to the water's edge as I backed away. I would have shot that SOB if I'd had the means.

I was hunting up the Naknek river in Alaska and had some bear activity, then one night I heard something walking / splashing around the tent ( it was very wet with standing water on the tundra)
Woke my uncle up and whispered “ hey listen I think something is walking around the tent “ he confirmed it and we both grabbed a gun and started hollering “ hey bear , hey bear “ it growled and started popping its teeth, then running around whoffing
At times very very close to the tent , we didn’t get much sleep, but the next day we climbed out of the tent for a look around, and there next to the tent was a wormy pile of
Bear skat , my uncle had left his bloody shirt hanging on the tent line . ( that’s the only thing I can think that would bring over a bear because we had all the food and meat underneath the vestibule tent about 50-60 yards away up the hill)
We moved the kitchen tent down to the lake and the sleeping tent up the hill .
When the 206 came and picked us up the pilot said that a bear was bothering people up and down the river. Being a tents thickness from a bear is not very good for the nerves

 

[Ontario Hunter]

I was hunting up the Naknek river in Alaska and had some bear activity, then one night I heard something walking / splashing around the tent ( it was very wet with standing water on the tundra)
Woke my uncle up and whispered “ hey listen I think something is walking around the tent “ he confirmed it and we both grabbed a gun and started hollering “ hey bear , hey bear “ it growled and started popping its teeth, then running around whoffing
At times very very close to the tent , we didn’t get much sleep, but the next day we climbed out of the tent for a look around, and there next to the tent was a wormy pile of
Bear skat , my uncle had left his bloody shirt hanging on the tent line . ( that’s the only thing I can think that would bring over a bear because we had all the food and meat underneath the vestibule tent about 50-60 yards away up the hill)
We moved the kitchen tent down to the lake and the sleeping tent up the hill .
When the 206 came and picked us up the pilot said that a bear was bothering people up and down the river. Being a tents thickness from a bear is not very good for the nerves

You'd think bears couldn't survive the winter infected with so many parasites. Actually, it's the parasites that don't survive the bear's hibernation. Guts get emptied and parasites are starved out. Key, of course, is bear must put on enough fat to last the winter. His body can live off fat during hibernation while most parasites live in the digestive system (trichinosis being one exception).

 

[pilar]

You'd think bears couldn't survive the winter infected with so many parasites. Actually, it's the parasites that don't survive the bear's hibernation. Guts get emptied and parasites are starved out. Key, of course, is bear must put on enough fat to last the winter. His body can live off fat during hibernation while most parasites live in the digestive system (trichinosis being one exception).

I had never seen anything like that before, worms hanging out of their ass’s lots of them
They said the salmon carry the worms and the bears are reinfected every year

 

[Boone66]

Scott has more experience and he mostly carries a pistol too. He also said use a 9 or 10mm and not a 44 magnum.

 

[WAB]

Popping jaws is a warning the bear is nervous. Sometimes followed by a charge but usually a bluff charge. A surprised bear that attacks and mauls usually doesn't have time to consider giving a warning. A bear that is observed stalking you is an absolute threat! Find a tree. Fast. That one wants to eat you. Exception would be subadults. They usually just don't know what they're doing. Often I think they are just looking for company. Or leftover scraps. I experienced numerous jaw popping warnings from adult bears, the closest being less than ten feet. I was on my way to go fishing and there was a "bear jam" on the way to observation platforms. About a dozen visitors were stuck. Suddenly a sow appeared on the trail behind us. And she walked towards us. "Okay folks, let's move on down the trail slowly. Keep an eye on that sow with cub up ahead." I kept myself between the bear and visitors. Suddenly the visitor in the front says "She caught a fish." "Okay, everyone STOP." That sow was sick with a crybaby cub and she was a known cranky troublemaker. I kept my bear in peripheral vision (don't look at them - look away as a sign of submission), backing to visitors and speaking calmly. Then she popped her gums! "Okay, everyone off the trail and into the swamp. Now! We gotta let this bear by." I dug out my radio and called for help. Turns out the on-duty bear tech was in the sack with a young gal from the archeology crew. That bear walked by me not four feet away. She had three feet of tapeworm hanging out her butt. I was in civies with uniform underneath in case I got jammed while fishing and couldn't get back to change. The radio was in my daypack. I never identified myself as a ranger but everyone seemed to accept I knew what I was doing.

I was stalked once when fishing alone at the creek on the other end of Brooks Lake. Very unnerving. Played cat and mouse in the timber till I could get to the boat on the beach. He came right out to the water's edge as I backed away. I would have shot that SOB if I'd had the means.

Popping teeth is not a fun sound to hear! My son was 13 or 14 when he shot his first black bear, a nice boar out on the tidal flats. We got to the bear and a brown bear started popping and thrashing alders twenty yards from us. I gave my son my .375 (he just had an ‘06) and proceeded to skin and bone the black bear. The entire time I did so that brown bear was trying to run us off. I told my son to drop it if it cleared the alders. It seemed like the longest job cleaning a bear I’ve ever done.

I will say again, I know a lot of Alaskan resident bear hunters. I don’t know any that pack pistols while bear hunting. I’m not saying none do, just none of the ones I know. We all pack pistols while fishing.

 

[tward1604]

I've only ever experienced feral hogs popping their teeth at me. I can't imagine the sounds a bear makes doing it.

 

[Ridge Runner]

@Daisy , regarding your thread this information is incorrect.

"........It is hard to get a handgun into Africa, so most don’t do it. If it was easier, it would be a no brainer to have a sidearm also."


Ahh...It's not hard to get a handgun into Africa, as a whole. I can only attest that I only imported (temporarily) my BFR, 4-5/8 barrel, 44Mag into Zimbabwe and RSA as back up and possibly for hunting purposes. I was asked, if I intended to use it for personal defense [the intent was did I plan on carry it for for use against bad guys]. I responded No. However, it was possible.

To import a handgun a person needs to know the legal minimum and maximum caliber for the purpose of hunting an intended species. There is also a minimum barrel length. This information can easily be accomplished by contacting Henry Rifle Premits, whom I used to get my pre-approved firearms permits; SAPS 520.

 

[BRICKBURN]

This was one I'd never seen before.
Wyoming Wildlife Officers.
Taser in one hand and Bear Spray in the other.
They were removing a carcass while two Grizzly Bears were within 50 yards.
Handguns in the holsters.