458 Win Mag

[NoStepOnSnek]

I'm leaning towards a red dot also because I would think in those bigger magnum actions the lpvo may not span the length of the action and a local gunsmith told me it may not be wise to run a full length rail across the action due to the size of the cartridge, of course I'm going for a vortex or a sig red with a QD mount....correct me and give me some insight but I have a vortex SPARC on my 12 gauge turkey gun and a 45° sig romeo on one of my ar's so and so far the SPARC held up even with magnum loads....would it cut the mustard for a 458 or is the recoil more substantial than a 12 guage

I’m usually a vortex guy but after talking to some of the guys on here and a guy from the outfit I’m going with I bit the bullet and got a trijicon rmr. Basically what I was told is vortex will replace anything, but the rmr won’t need replacing. I’d love to run a test on it if 458 ammo wasn’t so expensive

 

[DelRock83]

Shoot both and select from there. My bias is the .375 just because I can handle the rifle recoil. I'm not a macho man anymore, being 100% military disabled. I'm forced to modify my rifles just so my shoulders stay connected when I pull the trigger. I'm forced to port my barrels or attach muzzle brakes and just live through the snide comments.

Man I can't hear out of my right ear since I left Afghanistan and I'm going through the gauntlet trying to get ANY percentage...lol

 

[Foxi]

Man I can't hear out of my right ear since I left Afghanistan and I'm going through the gauntlet trying to get ANY percentage...lol

No one makes derogatory comments about someone like you.
You hear me, no one. At least not in the forum, and the others can visit you in the moonlight.
Good luck in the future.

Foxi

 

[DelRock83]

No one makes derogatory comments about someone like you.
You hear me, no one. At least not in the forum, and the others can visit you in the moonlight.
Good luck in the future.

Foxi

I'm out of context but I wasn't bashing or hating on anyone I'm out of the loop

 

[Foxi]

I'm out of context but I wasn't bashing or hating on anyone I'm out of the loop

I mixed up the recipients, my apologies.

 

[DelRock83]

oh no problem lol

I mixed up the recipients, my apologies

 

[DelRock83]

I’m usually a vortex guy but after talking to some of the guys on here and a guy from the outfit I’m going with I bit the bullet and got a trijicon rmr. Basically what I was told is vortex will replace anything, but the rmr won’t need replacing. I’d love to run a test on it if 458 ammo wasn’t so expensive

Another subject on the 458....is it TOO powerful and limited in accuracy to be effective on crocodile....I mean if you DO connect behind the eye wouldn't there be nothing left....the ONLY dangerous game I'm looking to pursue on my bucket list is buffalo and crocodile....I know the 458 is more than adequate for buffalo but will it bust that croc skull up as bad as I think it would if one connected

 

[DelRock83]

I need a little more of you guys wisdom a lot of reviews said that the zastavas are a little light for 458 with the rifle only weighing around 8 pounds I would assume with an optic could probably get it to 8 1/2 to 9 pounds I was considering putting it in a boyds straight comb stock but what are some suggestions you guys may have in adding some weight to it...I mean I know the pros and cons of a heavier rifle but I'm weighing towards first shot accuracy and recoil management so hopefully the ish going DOWNRANGE will prevent the ish from coming back UPRANGE...if that makes sense...LMAO

Shoot both and select from there. My bias is the .375 just because I can handle the rifle recoil. I'm not a macho man anymore, being 100% military disabled. I'm forced to modify my rifles just so my shoulders stay connected when I pull the trigger. I'm forced to port my barrels or attach muzzle brakes and just live through the snide comments

 

[NoStepOnSnek]

Another subject on the 458....is it TOO powerful and limited in accuracy to be effective on crocodile....I mean if you DO connect behind the eye wouldn't there be nothing left....the ONLY dangerous game I'm looking to pursue on my bucket list is buffalo and crocodile....I know the 458 is more than adequate for buffalo but will it bust that croc skull up as bad as I think it would if one connected

So as far as accuracy goes, I’ve put shots on each other at 50 yards with a rmr, and I’m sure that can be replicated out to 100 with a proper scope, especially with the right ammo and the right hunter.
I have yet to hunt Africa (scheduled for 2027) and this is my first year taking the 458 for any game, but seeing what it does to watermelons (a fun target) I would say that damage would be relatively severe. It could probably be minimized with a solid, or you could practice a neck shot. This is all being said with no croc hunting experience, but I feel like any rifle 375 and up would do substantial damage to the skull. When I was considering adding croc to my bag, the solution I came up with was to have a taxidermist do a bronze cast over the area that got blown out. There seems to be several taxidermy studios in South Africa that do bronze casts of other skulls, so it should be doable

 

[coreydb]

DelRock...everyone has their preferences and success stories, as well as their failures; me included. My first DG hunt I took the advice of one of the members here and started with the minimum acceptable DG caliber-the .375H&H. I took my brother's rifle to the range just to see what it felt like, and shot and shot it until I became comfortable with it. I went up to a .416 Rem mag (borrowed), one round and couldn't take another without a muzzle brake. A 416 Rigby was beyond trying...and boy do I still want one. But that's my reality. Take the advice from the others in this forum and try them all, or as many as you feasibly can! Then make your selection.

 

[Hyde Hunter]

So as far as accuracy goes, I’ve put shots on each other at 50 yards with a rmr, and I’m sure that can be replicated out to 100 with a proper scope, especially with the right ammo and the right hunter.
I have yet to hunt Africa (scheduled for 2027) and this is my first year taking the 458 for any game, but seeing what it does to watermelons (a fun target) I would say that damage would be relatively severe. It could probably be minimized with a solid, or you could practice a neck shot. This is all being said with no croc hunting experience, but I feel like any rifle 375 and up would do substantial damage to the skull. When I was considering adding croc to my bag, the solution I came up with was to have a taxidermist do a bronze cast over the area that got blown out. There seems to be several taxidermy studios in South Africa that do bronze casts of other skulls, so it should be doable

for the hand loader for a good load is the Stone Hammer 404gr loaded to 2500 fps with AA2230 sighted 4 in high 100 yards will take you to 300 with out a hitch and and a good close range load is the CEB 420 gr Raptor, deadly on buffalo 2300 to 2350

 

[DelRock83]

for the hand loader for a good load is the Stone Hammer 404gr loaded to 2500 fps with AA2230 sighted 4 in high 100 yards will take you to 300 with out a hitch and and a good close range load is the CEB 420 gr Raptor, deadly on buffalo 2300 to 2350

Ok I see the process, for an average hunter factory ammo is adequate but for the buffalo junkie they are gonna have thier OWN loads made to how THEY hunt buff....in the US people do develop loads according to their quarry but for the most part the average hunters buy factory due to the fact that most african hunts can instantly turn into a life or death situation I can understand the attention to detail with the load development

 

[DelRock83]

Ok I see the process, for an average hunter factory ammo is adequate but for the buffalo junkie they are gonna have thier OWN loads made to how THEY hunt buff....in the US people do develop loads according to their quarry but for the most part the average hunters buy factory due to the fact that most african hunts can instantly turn into a life or death situation I can understand the attention to detail with the load development

But basically what you guys are saying with ANY dg caliber there is a chance of a croc skull being vaporized....

 

[Bwgunslinger]

I have the 458 and 375 in safari express. After trying a 416 Rigby that really rang my bell, I grabbed the 458 knowing that might be even worse but wanted to try it.

It’s not bad at all. I’ve already shot a box and a half and I’m shooting Hornady at 2140. Ordered some CEB 450 and north fork 450 and going to try to get those going 2250.

My dad shoots a 404 Jeffery and has been hammering Buffalo with it. And a hippo. 430 grain north fork reloads.

The 375 is my personal favorite but my brother has gotten into a couple 13 round gun fights with Buffalo after a quartering shot where they were quartering at a different angle than he thought in the brush.

Placement is the key so not sure if the results would have been any different with a bigger caliber than 375.

 

[DLSJR]

Another subject on the 458....is it TOO powerful and limited in accuracy to be effective on crocodile....I mean if you DO connect behind the eye wouldn't there be nothing left....the ONLY dangerous game I'm looking to pursue on my bucket list is buffalo and crocodile....I know the 458 is more than adequate for buffalo but will it bust that croc skull up as bad as I think it would if one connected

When shooting a crocodile, precision is far more important than horsepower. I’ve only shot one croc, but it was with a 338 Winchester and a 225 grain Bearclaw. That was more than needed and did significantly less damage than a 458 would do. Next croc I shoot will likely be with the 338 again, or something smaller.

Biggest damage was to the top of skull, where pressure blew out the bone. It never moved, other than some tail swishing. 338, 225 grain Bearclaw.

 

[Andrew62]

As cheap as they are, why not buy both!?

 

[DelRock83]

When shooting a crocodile, precision is far more important than horsepower. I’ve only shot one croc, but it was with a 338 Winchester and a 225 grain Bearclaw. That was more than needed and did significantly less damage than a 458 would do. Next croc I shoot will likely be with the 338 again, or something smaller.

View attachment 712103
Biggest damage was to the top of skull, where pressure blew out the bone. It never moved, other than some tail swishing. 338, 225 grain Bearclaw.

Ok I have heard that in SOME countries you necessarily don't have a 375 requirement for dangerous game....if such a scenario was possible what you think....300 Win Mag...or a smaller 30

 

[DelRock83]

It just depends????.....I've personally seen whitetail take vital shots and still run damn near 50 yards so on something 5x the size I would guess it depends on how much lead the Buffalo is willing to take lol

I have the 458 and 375 in safari express. After trying a 416 Rigby that really rang my bell, I grabbed the 458 knowing that might be even worse but wanted to try it.

It’s not bad at all. I’ve already shot a box and a half and I’m shooting Hornady at 2140. Ordered some CEB 450 and north fork 450 and going to try to get those going 2250.

My dad shoots a 404 Jeffery and has been hammering Buffalo with it. And a hippo. 430 grain north fork reloads.

The 375 is my personal favorite but my brother has gotten into a couple 13 round gun fights with Buffalo after a quartering shot where they were quartering at a different angle than he thought in the brush.

Placement is the key so not sure if the results would have been any different with a bigger caliber than 37

 

[DelRock83]

As cheap as they are, why not buy both!?

Tbh a Winchester Model 70 is a little out of my price range for a rifle I may only use once or twice and I saw the zastavas and did some research and saw they only had them in 375 and 458 win mag, and the way my life is set up and I'm a wishful thinker and had the idea of what if the heavens smile down on you and you get a problem elephant tag or some wild ish like that...well I've got a 458 with me HERE, RIGHT NOW...I know I sound crazy I just like to be prepared for as much as I can be then I also have a 300 Win Mag that I shoot but haven't hunted with it yet because whitetail or feral hog is the biggest quarry we have here in the southeastern US and I already have a 30-06....and 300 win mag is overkill....I only have one because I won a raffle at a local gun shop....I PLAN on using the 2 rifle system

 

[DLSJR]

Ok I have heard that in SOME countries you necessarily don't have a 375 requirement for dangerous game....if such a scenario was possible what you think....300 Win Mag...or a smaller 30

I would not hesitate to use a 30-06 or any 300 magnum on a croc. A quality 30 caliber 200 grain bullet through the brain or breaking the neck will kill a croc just as dead as with anything 375 or bigger. And it’ll do less damage to the trophy.

To your comment about some countries not requiring a 375 or bigger for DG, keep in mind that while a smaller caliber bullet will work fine on a leopard or croc, you still have to use a 375 and up for stuff like buffalo, lion & elephant. While I’d never use anything smaller than a 375 on a dry land hippo even if allowed, I wouldn’t hesitate to use a 30-06 if just braining one in the water.