375 Whelen Improved?

[jpr9954]

Is anyone familiar with the .375 Whelen Improved? I came across one and was wondering if it is worth bidding on.

As I understand it, the .375 Whelen is based upon the the .30-06 cartridge necked up to .375.

I must admit I have a thing for obscure calibers.

 

[John Wasmuth]

Not much difference between that and the 9,3x62. Both outstanding cartridges

 

[Flewis]

The improved will be better for head spacing. If I remember correctly it does about 2200 with a 300 grain, maybe a little more.

 

[mgstucson]

I just bought one. I haven't had time to work up loads for it yet. It seems to be about 200fps under 375 H&H in lighter weight bullets, but closer with heavier bullets. Data I have seen posted says between 2400-2450 for 300gr. That is nearly even with older 375 H&H loads. Maybe newer loads go more in the H&H. Some used to load down the H&H a little due to over penetration with heavy bullets anyway. It seems CFE223 is the powder of choice nowadays for the Whelens. 300gr at 2450 is right at 4000fpe. That should do.

 

[mgstucson]

According to an article published in 2022 in Rifle magazine, professional guide Ed Stevenson carried a version of the 375 Whelen shooting 250gr at 2700 and/or 270gr at 2500 as protection against the big bears in AK. He gave it hearty approval based on field results.

 

[cajunchefray]

I just bought one. I haven't had time to work up loads for it yet. It seems to be about 200fps under 375 H&H in lighter weight bullets, but closer with heavier bullets. Data I have seen posted says between 2400-2450 for 300gr. That is nearly even with older 375 H&H loads. Maybe newer loads go more in the H&H. Some used to load down the H&H a little due to over penetration with heavy bullets anyway. It seems CFE223 is the powder of choice nowadays for the Whelens. 300gr at 2450 is right at 4000fpe. That should do.

That is the cartridge my gunsmith uses, over 20 safaris. Has taken a couple of buffalo, now just hunts large plains game. Uses nothing else, a beautiful 1903 Springfield.
Barnes 270 TSX with Varget is his potion.

 

[BeeMaa]

I understand that the 375WI would be unique, but if you wanted a .375 caliber to fit in a standard 30-06 action and still outperform the 375H&H (and the 9.3's)...why not just go with a 375RUGER and retain the ability to buy ammo off the shelf?

 

[mgstucson]

@BeeMaa That is THEORETICALLY possible if Hornady ever decides to make brass or ammo for the 375 Ruger again. The Whelen would be cheaper to reload on 06 brass, but a big problem would be getting head stamped cases to take to Africa. That would be another advantage of going with the Ruger cartridge. I have head stamped brass for 35 Whelen and 400 Whelen, but not 375 Whelen (yet). I have a 416 Ruger, and it is also VERY difficult and expensive to find ammo or components for. I think Qual-Cart makes Whelen head stamped brass, but it is not cheap either. The 375 Ruger will do full power loads equal to H&H or better, so no tradeoff on power either. Advantages to the Whelen are: much less powder, much less recoil, and more rounds in the magazine. This theoretically leads to faster follow-up shots and at least 1 more than the Ruger or the H&H before reload. Can't really go wrong with any of the above in a 375.

 

[BeeMaa]

@BeeMaa That is THEORETICALLY possible if Hornady ever decides to make brass or ammo for the 375 Ruger again. The Whelen would be cheaper to reload on 06 brass, but a big problem would be getting head stamped cases to take to Africa. That would be another advantage of going with the Ruger cartridge. I have head stamped brass for 35 Whelen and 400 Whelen, but not 375 Whelen (yet). I have a 416 Ruger, and it is also VERY difficult and expensive to find ammo or components for. I think Qual-Cart makes Whelen head stamped brass, but it is not cheap either. The 375 Ruger will do full power loads equal to H&H or better, so no tradeoff on power either. Advantages to the Whelen are: much less powder, much less recoil, and more rounds in the magazine. This theoretically leads to faster follow-up shots and at least 1 more than the Ruger or the H&H before reload. Can't really go wrong with any of the above in a 375.

I see your point on reloading brass, less powder, more cartridges in the mag...and it makes sense. But there still seem to be high costs, both in brass availability and overall price.

You talk about saving powder, but have you considered the powder required to fire form brass from 30-06? Plus you mentioned the high cost/low availability of properly head-stamped brass in both 375WI and 375RUGER. I'm surprised that 375RUGER brass isn't more readily available.

The CZ550 375H&H that I sold held 4 + 1 and there are mods you can make for them to hold 5 + 1. What was your plan for

It just seems like you are taking the long way around to end right back up at 375H&H or 375RUGER ballistics. And that's fine, if that's what you want. It's just that most times a .375 caliber (or 9.3mm), I'm thinking about a traveling hunter looking at LARGE game animals like brown bear, moose, or even African DG. Do you really think the trade-offs are worth it, especially if your luggage (with your ammo) is delayed?

I know I'm not saying anything you don't already know. Sometimes it's the journey of a man & his rifle forming a bond through load testing and hunting. Hope it works out well for you.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Is anyone familiar with the .375 Whelen Improved? I came across one and was wondering if it is worth bidding on.

As I understand it, the .375 Whelen is based upon the the .30-06 cartridge necked up to .375.

I must admit I have a thing for obscure calibers.

@jpr9954
Sounds like it could be a 35 Whelen AI necked up to 375. But that's just a guess. Have you got a photo of the case.
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

The improved will be better for head spacing. If I remember correctly it does about 2200 with a 300 grain, maybe a little more.

@Flewis
So it 200fos slower than the 35 Whelen with a 310 grainers then. What's the point. Might be able to stoke it up a bit with proper handloads.
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I just bought one. I haven't had time to work up loads for it yet. It seems to be about 200fps under 375 H&H in lighter weight bullets, but closer with heavier bullets. Data I have seen posted says between 2400-2450 for 300gr. That is nearly even with older 375 H&H loads. Maybe newer loads go more in the H&H. Some used to load down the H&H a little due to over penetration with heavy bullets anyway. It seems CFE223 is the powder of choice nowadays for the Whelens. 300gr at 2450 is right at 4000fpe. That should do.

@mgstucson
CFE223 in the 35 Whelen with 310 grainers isn't much good, to fast
H4350/2209 with a two foot drop tube and you can safely get 2,455 out of the standard 35 Whelen. A bit over 4,000fpe
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I understand that the 375WI would be unique, but if you wanted a .375 caliber to fit in a standard 30-06 action and still outperform the 375H&H (and the 9.3's)...why not just go with a 375RUGER and retain the ability to buy ammo off the shelf?

@BeeMaa
And where's the fun in that.
The Ruger is lacking something.
That's right the WHELEN tag. 375 Whelen sounds classy , 375 Ruger, ho-hum so yesterday bro.
Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I see your point on reloading brass, less powder, more cartridges in the mag...and it makes sense. But there still seem to be high costs, both in brass availability and overall price.

You talk about saving powder, but have you considered the powder required to fire form brass from 30-06? Plus you mentioned the high cost/low availability of properly head-stamped brass in both 375WI and 375RUGER. I'm surprised that 375RUGER brass isn't more readily available.

The CZ550 375H&H that I sold held 4 + 1 and there are mods you can make for them to hold 5 + 1. What was your plan for

It just seems like you are taking the long way around to end right back up at 375H&H or 375RUGER ballistics. And that's fine, if that's what you want. It's just that most times a .375 caliber (or 9.3mm), I'm thinking about a traveling hunter looking at LARGE game animals like brown bear, moose, or even African DG. Do you really think the trade-offs are worth it, especially if your luggage (with your ammo) is delayed?

I know I'm not saying anything you don't already know. Sometimes it's the journey of a man & his rifle forming a bond through load testing and hunting. Hope it works out well for you.

@BeeMaa
You really need to get into reloading mate.
To fire form the brass you don't even need a projectile or that much powder.
Load the case with 20gn of unique shotgun powder, push one square of dunny paper into the case the push the neck of the case into a block of wax or soap.
Load said round, pull trigger and you have one perfectly formed case.
The hardest part is neck the case up to 40cal then run into the 375 due to form a false shoulder so it headspaces properly. Just size the case so it has a slight feel when you close the bolt.
As for properly head stamped just get some small number stamps and put a 75 after the 3 on a normal Whelen case.
There's always a simple solution to a problem.
Bob

 

[BeeMaa]

@Bob Nelson 35Whelen - I appreciate the thoughts, but I’m not going to start reloading. I have enough hobbies to keep me busy. After all, I have a Barbie to love.

 

[CoElkHunter]

@BeeMaa
You really need to get into reloading mate.
To fire form the brass you don't even need a projectile or that much powder.
Load the case with 20gn of unique shotgun powder, push one square of dunny paper into the case the push the neck of the case into a block of wax or soap.
Load said round, pull trigger and you have one perfectly formed case.
The hardest part is neck the case up to 40cal then run into the 375 due to form a false shoulder so it headspaces properly. Just size the case so it has a slight feel when you close the bolt.
As for properly head stamped just get some small number stamps and put a 75 after the 3 on a normal Whelen case.
There's always a simple solution to a problem.
Bob

Bob,
If you push the neck of the case into a block of Vegemite, you'll have less powder fouling when forming cases than if you use soap or wax. FYI.
CEH

 

[Flewis]

@Flewis
So it 200fos slower than the 35 Whelen with a 310 grainers then. What's the point. Might be able to stoke it up a bit with proper handloads.
Bob

Bob, that is the old data. The old pressures were very low, remember the 35 whelen was 2400 with a 250 grain and the 06 was 2700 with a 150 if I remember correctly. Pressures were about 50k. Most reloading manuals still show the whelen that low.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Bob,
If you push the neck of the case into a block of Vegemite, you'll have less powder fouling when forming cases than if you use soap or wax. FYI.
CEH

@CoElkHunter
Your wrong mate. Cooked Vegemite would be very hard to get out of the bore and would eventually clog the bore completely.
Bob

 

[GuttormG]

I have this cartridge on my list of fun things to do.
Thinking of marking it 38 Whelen. 2 reasons, as a tribute to Whelen and his first wildcat, and because it would be quite easy to remark 35Whelen cases.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I have this cartridge on my list of fun things to do.
Thinking of marking it 38 Whelen. 2 reasons, as a tribute to Whelen and his first wildcat, and because it would be quite easy to remark 35Whelen cases.

@GuttormG
So what 38 cal
The standard Whelen is great
The 375 Whelen only a bit better
The 400 petrov Whelen ( the one with the better shoulder) the equal of the great 400-450.
The 35 Whelen AI a waste of time in my book even tho I own one.
Bob