3.5 12ga vs big bore rifle

[62flint]

I am a newbie here to africa hunting. I looked through the search feature but did not find what I was looking for .
Went this past July with my daughter. Well now I am hooked and we are planning on a return trip in 2025 for buff and a few plains game.
Here is my question, Never having shot a big bore safari type rifle. How does the recoil compare to say a 3 1/2 in heavy 12ga load? Those I have shot a bunch. I am thinking about getting a win m70 in 375 but see quite a few in 416 or even 458win. But I really like a nice double shotgun,,, and a double rifle is a pretty thing....
sorry back to the recoil.

 

[375Fox]

Hopefully the site lets me post these links (ignore all the ads). But this gives you best idea. Unfortunately they don’t list the recoil velocity with shotgun but do with rifle, but that’s the difference that makes a big bore rifle much more difficult to shoot than a shotgun. A 375 is very easy to learn to shoot above that not for everyone.

Rifle Recoil Table

SHOTGUN RECOIL TABLE

 

[ChrisG]

I would say a 3.5" 12 gauge from a 6.5lb shotgun is probably the equivalent of a modest load from a .416 class rifle... definitely less than a .458 IMO

 

[62flint]

Hopefully the site lets me post these links (ignore all the ads). But this gives you best idea. Unfortunately they don’t list the recoil velocity with shotgun but do with rifle, but that’s the difference that makes a big bore rifle much more difficult to shoot than a shotgun. A 375 is very easy to learn to shoot above that not for everyone.

Rifle Recoil Table

SHOTGUN RECOIL TABLE

I have looked at the table, which led me to wonder.
ft pounds of recoil of the shot gun vs a big bore rifle are not that different. But the velocity is not mentioned.
Its hard to get a "feel" for something until you actually do it.

 

[pilar]

Shooting 3 1/2 12 & 10ga shotgun is worse then a 375 all day
my uncle and I shot 63 geese one day with our 10ga laying in a field , I think I did permeant damage to my neck and shoulder lol !

 

[DPHunter4570]

I don't shoot many 3.5" shotgun loads, but I shoot plenty of 3" turkey loads and deer slugs. I would say for me, those turkey loads and slugs kick much worse than my CZ 550 in 375H&H. I don't really think 375 in the factory loads I've shot is all that bad.

 

[Stephen Ausband]

Depends also on the type of shooting, I think. l can tolerate the recoil of a 12 gauge 3 1/2 inch heavy load when I'm pass shooting ducks or geese, but the idea of snuggling up to the thing and firing deliberate, aimed shots from a set of sticks or (God forbid!) off a bench sounds like no fun at all. It doesn't take long for a guy used to shooting something like a 30-06 to get used to the recoil of a 375 shooting a 300 grain bullet. At least it didn't take me long. The 416 with 400 grain bullet is about as much of a step up from the 375 as the 375 from the 30/06, in terms of theoretical recoil, but a lot depends on the rifle's weight and how it fits you. On a purely subjective level, I find the recoil of the 375 about like that of a heavy field load/"short magnum" 12 gauge. I find the recoil of the 416 to be more like that of a 3" duck load. I've never shot a rifle that recoiled as much as a 3 1/2" 12 gauge. Short version: I have shot some of the 400s OK; I have shot the 375 much, much more accurately. The recoil in ft lbs of a rifle with the same sort of recoil as a 12 gauge 3 1/2 inch seems like it would be beyond the thump of a 416, and I doubt I'd be very good with it, at least without lots of practice. But that's just my subjective opinion, and you may be way more recoil tolerate than I am.

 

[Hunter-Habib]

If you can handle a 12 gauge 3.5” Super Magnum load, then a well balanced .375 Holland & Holland Magnum won’t be a big deal at all.

 

[shootist~]

JBM - Calculations - Recoil

www.jbmballistics.com

3.5" 1 3/8 Oz, 1,470 fps, 8 pound shotgun, guessed ~22 gr powder:
= 38.7 foot pounds recoil energy.

The 375 will be very dependent on weight of rifle. Calculate using the jbm link above. Use ~70 grains of powder and rifle weights from 9 to 11 pounds.

When I had my Super Black Eagle 3.5", all my practice was with skeet loads. The few 3.5" hunting loads I shot while hunting was no biggie.

 

[CD24]

I can't preach it enough but a shock eater shooting pad does wonders and it's thin enough that you won't notice it. I wore one in my undershirt while using a 470 and never bruised. I don't have any affiliation with them in any way but I had excellent results.

I would say a 9.3X74R double gun is no worse than a 3.5 inch 12ga. The 416 is noticeably worse but not unreasonable. I think a 470 and up is too much for most shooters (including me without the shock eater pad)

ShockEater Shooting Gear

ShockEater® is the latest advancement in recoil reducing technology. Featuring Nano-Poly™ technology in recoil pads and shooting gear.

shockeater.com

 

[Red Leg]

I would say a 3.5" 12 gauge from a 6.5lb shotgun is probably the equivalent of a modest load from a .416 class rifle... definitely less than a .458 IMO

A 3 1/2 inch 12 from a 6 1/2 lb shotgun would be nose bleed brutal. It would make a .375 look tame.

This is a much better ChuckHawks Table showing comparisons between rifle and shotgun. Note a 3" mag 12 from an 8 3/4 lb gun is roughly equivalent to a .450 NE and slightly more than a .416 of appropriate weight.

Compared: Rifle and Shotgun Recoil Table

 

[ActionBob]

Shooting 3 1/2 12 & 10ga shotgun is worse then a 375 all day
my uncle and I shot 63 geese one day with our 10ga laying in a field , I think I did permeant damage to my neck and shoulder lol !

Except you are unlikely to shoot 63 anything even on a full bag 21 day hunt, much less per day

@62flint a Winchester M70 in 375 H&H is pretty well weighted to control the recoil, you are not going to have a problem. I have one in 375 and another in 416 Rem Mag, noticeable uptick in recoil on the 416.

When you get into dangerous game rifles who's calibers start with a 4 or more, you will experience a different type of recoil. More barrel rise, harder shove. A definite need to hold onto them tightly and have them securely tucked into the pocket in your shoulder and your cheek down tightly. If your cheek is up off the stock, the stock is likely to give it a good whack

 

[chashardy]

You will notice felt recoil on the practice range. When you are in the bush in Africa and shooting at a buffalo you won't feel a thing.
Having said that, I agree with the other posters here. Felt recoil is a function of rifle design and weight and fit. An ill-fitting 12 gauge shotgun will beat you worse than a well-designed big bore rifle.

 

[John the Electrician]

Late in the 1980’s I started hunting deer , where I live it was shotgun only. Rifles were not allowed.

We had no money for nice guns, mine and my brothers first deer gun was a light weight Mossberg bolt action 20 gauge that held three rounds fully loaded.

That son of a B kicked sharp and fast. Not great for a 12 year old to get started with. I now have a Remington 870 12 gauge. With a 1oz slug that thing also kicks the bejeezus out of me.

I think a poor fit and a rock hard pad with sharp edges it the main issue with that gun. It is a very long way from pleasant to shoot.

I have zero experience with large bore rifles. I do know that slugs from a shotgun are a lot in the recoil department; as are turkey loads.

John

 

[thriller]

I am a newbie here to africa hunting. I looked through the search feature but did not find what I was looking for .
Went this past July with my daughter. Well now I am hooked and we are planning on a return trip in 2025 for buff and a few plains game.
Here is my question, Never having shot a big bore safari type rifle. How does the recoil compare to say a 3 1/2 in heavy 12ga load? Those I have shot a bunch. I am thinking about getting a win m70 in 375 but see quite a few in 416 or even 458win. But I really like a nice double shotgun,,, and a double rifle is a pretty thing....
sorry back to the recoil.

Not very different. I would say a little sharper but my 3.5 10 ga with hevi shot is comparable to my 458 win mag.

A non semi auto 3.5 is what is comparable to me. And the recoil calculator says they are both in the 60 ftlbs range

 

[Wyatt Smith]

My 12 gauge BPS with brenneke black magic slugs is by far the worst kicker I have ever fired. The stock was not very slick and it felt like it ripped your cheek off. A 375 or 416 is easy compared to that beast.

 

[BeeMaa]

I have a SBE3 that weighs 7 lbs and shoot 2 1/4 oz 7 shot TSS turkey loads. The recoil is much worse than my 375H&H rifle that weighs 7.75 lbs by a good bit. Pattern testing those shotgun loads was not a fun day.

Here is me shooting the 375 and I'm not a big guy at 70" and 160 lbs...

Start with a .375 caliber (you pick the flavor...H&H, RUGER...etc) and master that before you move up into the .400 plus realm. Give yourself some time to master the mid-bore before jumping into the deep end.

Hard to go wrong with a Winchester Model 70, CZ550 or Kimber for a working rifle that will last a lifetime.

 

[CJW]

3.5" waterfowl loads aren't bad but 2.25 oz turkey loads are brutal out of my rem super mag. Fast, bruise inducing recoil in a 7.5 lb gun with a crappy butt pad. Those loads require a 9.5 lb gun at least.

 

[62flint]

Thanks guys, I will keep looking for a 375HH . They just seem to be eluding me local and I do not want to ship one in yet. I have ran across a few 416rem and a 458wm on the shelf. I knew the 458 was more than I need. But it sure is pretty at a good price.

 

[Challer]

If you’re just starting Africa, 375 H&H is probably the best all around choice for a first rifle - with the right loads there is very little you can’t do with it from DG to the tiny 10. Modern bullets such as CEB, Swift, Barnes have effectively “up-bored” most calibers that were invented 100 years ago.

After you’ve got some miles on the 375, you’ll be able to chose any specialist rounds in an informed manner. Many of us here use the 375 exclusively.