Word of caution (first hand) about hunting Mexico now

[BGGMKLR]

In preface... I am not looking for a beef, or issues, or debates, with Mexican Outfitters or hunters. I am merely making this post as a heads-up cautionary tale for those considering Mexico as a hunting/fishing destination...from a guy who's been there and done that.

In full disclosure, I have hunted and fished widely throughout Mexico and Baja since about 1975.
All the usual spots...and then some. Gauymas, Culiacan, Guanauato, Loreto, La Paz, Rancho Leonaro, Cabo, Mazatlan, Puerto Vallarta, Tulum, Playa del Carmen, and on and on.
For 35 plus years I never had a single experience that left me feeling threatened or endangered...not...one.
Things are (sadly...and factually) a whole lot different now.
A five day '22 Duck hunt with 5 amigos in San Fernando had me seriously wondering if I would survive the adventure.
For 5 days, the 1 1/2 hr drive to and from our "hunting lodge"...ie. heavily fortified compound (see Scarface)... to the hunting ponds our driver never drove (not once) less than 100 mph, on 2 lane roads, passing anything in the way.
My best bud, after telling the driver to slow down 3 or 4 times finally came undone and screamed at the driver to
"SLOW THIS M***** F***** DOWN OR I'M GOING TO JERK THE F***** KEYS OUT AND THROW THEM OUT THE WINDOW".
To which the driver responded:
"We drive this fast because the boss told us to. It makes it harder for the Cartels to pull us over, kidnap you, get a ransom, and then burn you in a ditch"
Moral of the story:
There is not a fish to be caught... or an animal to be hunted...that can't be pursued elsewhere with 0 risk to your life and personal safety. Do NOT believe the Outfitters when they pooh pooh the actual dangers...they've still gotta try to make a living.
Best
Spike

PS... After swearing on 1000 bibles I'd never go back, I'm headed to Sonora in 3 weeks for a Couse Deer hunt...BUT..I've done my due diligence. My guy is connected... and I have a name to drop if intercepted enroute to the ranch from the airport.
Safety first.
Hunting repost to follow...God willing.

 

[dchum]

The last thing cartels want to do is hold Americans ransom…

 

[dogcat1]

And you know this "how"?

 

[deewayne2003]

Well back to the topic of the OP.....

Born and raised in Texas and for the life of me I cannot understand why people continue to recreate in Mexico - Yes, there are beautiful places and people in Mexico but it only takes one illiterate cartel henchman or corrupt cop to turn your trip into a nightmare.

"Well you can find trouble anywhere if you go looking for it!"... I have heard this worn out statement from countless Americans who are spoiled by the personal safety they enjoy in first world countries.

Resorts - Many people think they are safe at resorts, this is marginally true .... because those resorts were built with drug money and everything is safe, until it isn't.

Gunmen attack Mexico resort, killing 6 adults and a child

The owner told authorities the gunmen destroyed a shop and took security cameras before fleeing the scene.

www.nbcnews.com

There are also less advertised safety issues, like Mexican resorts and communities dumping untreated sewage into both ground water as well as the ocean directly off of the swimming beaches.

https://earthjournalism.net/stories/sewage-from-mexicos-tourism-industry-threatens-caribbean-coast-reef

Drugging - This happens for both robbery and sexual assault; if you go to Mexico and take female relatives you better advise them of the dangers; as some of the male waitstaff at these resorts seem to make a game of drugging women, especially American teenage females who are not used to the lax drinking laws in Mexico.

Oklahoma college students possibly drugged at Mexican resort, hospitalized in Dallas

Zara Hull and Jake Snider traveled to Cancun last Thursday. The vacation became a nightmare after Hull and her friend Kaylie visited the pool bar.

www.cbsnews.com

There is also the robbery aspect - I have a friend that is very wealthy and would fly his wife and two daughters to Cabo on his private jet, I would caution him against this and suggest he go to Costa Rica instead......

"Dude, you don't understand the quality of the resort we stay at, it's SUPER EXCLUSIVE!"

On their last trip he and his wife were finishing up dinner and the waiter brought around a "Special after dinner cocktail" which he refused because he stopped drinking alcohol; then the waiter came by with a special fruity desert drink with no alcohol, which he and his wife both drank.

Shortly after they both became mildly ill/groggy and the hotel staff helped them back to their room, next thing he knows he's waking in his bed fully clothed while some stranger in non hotel uniform is trying to take his Breitling watch off his wrist while another man is digging through his wife's suitcase.

The two thieves ran out of the room and they immediately called the front desk, which REFUSED to call police and the manager onsite was in full damage control mode trying to keep the situation as quiet as possible.... They left Mexico that evening and vowed to never return.

 

[BGGMKLR]

Well back to the topic of the OP.....

Born and raised in Texas and for the life of me I cannot understand why people continue to recreate in Mexico - Yes, there are beautiful places and people in Mexico but it only takes one illiterate cartel henchman or corrupt cop to turn your trip into a nightmare.

"Well you can find trouble anywhere if you go looking for it!"... I have heard this worn out statement from countless Americans who are spoiled by the personal safety they enjoy in first world countries.

Resorts - Many people think they are safe at resorts, this is marginally true .... because those resorts were built with drug money and everything is safe, until it isn't.

Gunmen attack Mexico resort, killing 6 adults and a child

The owner told authorities the gunmen destroyed a shop and took security cameras before fleeing the scene.

www.nbcnews.com

There are also less advertised safety issues, like Mexican resorts and communities dumping untreated sewage into both ground water as well as the ocean directly off of the swimming beaches.

https://earthjournalism.net/stories/sewage-from-mexicos-tourism-industry-threatens-caribbean-coast-reef

Drugging - This happens for both robbery and sexual assault; if you go to Mexico and take female relatives you better advise them of the dangers; as some of the male waitstaff at these resorts seem to make a game of drugging women, especially American teenage females who are not used to the lax drinking laws in Mexico.

Oklahoma college students possibly drugged at Mexican resort, hospitalized in Dallas

Zara Hull and Jake Snider traveled to Cancun last Thursday. The vacation became a nightmare after Hull and her friend Kaylie visited the pool bar.

www.cbsnews.com

There is also the robbery aspect - I have a friend that is very wealthy and would fly his wife and two daughters to Cabo on his private jet, I would caution him against this and suggest he go to Costa Rica instead......

"Dude, you don't understand the quality of the resort we stay at, it's SUPER EXCLUSIVE!"

On their last trip he and his wife were finishing up dinner and the waiter brought around a "Special after dinner cocktail" which he refused because he stopped drinking alcohol; then the waiter came by with a special fruity desert drink with no alcohol, which he and his wife both drank.

Shortly after they both became mildly ill/groggy and the hotel staff helped them back to their room, next thing he knows he's waking in his bed fully clothed while some stranger in non hotel uniform is trying to take his Breitling watch off his wrist while another man is digging through his wife's suitcase.

The two thieves ran out of the room and they immediately called the front desk, which REFUSED to call police and the manager onsite was in full damage control mode trying to keep the situation as quiet as possible.... They left Mexico that evening and vowed to never return.

Spot on.
As I said, I am truly not trying to instigate an argument or debate as to whether travel to Mexico is dangerous as I know for a fact that it is. Those here who disagree may wish to contact the State Dept. for professional unbiased advice.
That said, ANYONE who wishes to go and does not feel concerned about their safety...please do so.
Personally, I've found a cure for Mexico...it's called Argentina...just keep headed south.
Best
Spike

 

[WyoBull]

I had an experience in Cabo many years ago that was pretty scary and I vowed to never go back. And I never will.
We basically got taken by corrupt cops out into the desert and got shaken down for a bunch of money. There were two of us couples and a month old baby. Suffice it to say it could have gotten a lot worse than it did.
I know a number of RV’ers that go down and explore the Baja in their RV’s during winter months. Not only no, but hell no!

 

[Luis Medina]

I normally do not participate at all and take a very passive stance on AH, but this post shook my innards and forced me to give my opinion. Forgive the lengthy post.

First off, nothing to do with education or the conquerors or anything like that at all. To give such a reference from a cosy armchair thousands of miles away in the comfort of a first-world home and safe environment without any knowledge nor exposure to said environment/context/country is misleading to say the least.

I think I am in a position to talk with some level of authority: I lived in Mexico from 2000-2022 and saw its demise into a very, very scary place. Everyone is free to do what they please, I just would like to give my view on this matter and offer a word of caution.

The things I heard, experienced and saw first hand (that cannot be unseen...) forced me to leave the country.

I know what I am talking about when I say you are not safe anywhere, maybe only in Yucatán and that is because is the residence place of the "big boys".

The Policia Federal now Guardia Nacional (paramilitary unifomrs), Policia (blue uniforms), Traffic Police (uniform varies according to State) are 99% corrupt and as dangerous as "los malos" (the bad ones) as they call the cartel guys there. The Policia Judicial (in plain civilian clothes) are an altogether different league, the worst of the worst, vicious unscrupilous dogs. To sum it up, I do not really know what is worse, to fall in the hands of any of the Police Forces or the cartels themselves! On a side note, cartels wear the same uniforms and set up the same check points...

The Armed Forces themselves which in the past were a source of pride have been corructed and now anything and everything requires a "mordida" (bite= bribe).

I know many Mexican hunters who are avoiding going to the Northen border States even though they are great hunting destinations. I have heard first-hand all kind of horror stories involving kidnapping, stealing guns, beat ups, robbery...anything you name it!).

Again, each of us decides what level of security (or lack thereof) they are happy with. I am not returning there, much less go to a far-off hunting area in the middle of nowhere.

I work for an NGO mostly in African countries under conflict. Suffice it to say I feel less at risk there than I did in Mexico.

Outfitters can and must sell you their truth. I know the truth and had to share it.

One member said he will return and his guy knows the guy and will be let through...good luck to him! Recipe for disaster.

My advice: AVOID MEXICO 100%

 

[leslie hetrick]

two good friends were robbed by the mex police, wallets-watches-class rings for so called speeding at a check point. the owner of the car had stashed several hundred dollars in the trunk before they left for mex and that at least got the out of mex and into the united states. the u.s. border patrol didn,t want to be brothered with it and no help at all. no mexico for me.

 

[CEO]

I know of quite a few guys who have deer leases in Mexico and seem to get along without problems. Most of them say once you get a little away from the border everything calms down.

That said, I had a client, a decade or so back, who owned an oilfield services company in West Texas. He leased an 8,000 acre ranch in Mexico to take clients/family. Said all was good until he had some local police come by and he gave them a doe one of his clients killed. That gradually turned into guys showing up demanding deer meat. Annoying, but nothing he couldn't handle.

It all came to a head one night when he said they broke the main rule or the lease; don't leave the ranch after dark. I forget the exact reason, but they took off in one Excursion and one F250 (two cartel favorites). They get pulled over by the police and spent an hour face down in the dirt with guns to their heads trying to prove they were not cartel. When that was over they went back to the ranch, grabbed a few things, and went back home the next day. Never went back to the lease and wrote everything off as a loss.

I'd still go on a hunt down there if I found the right one. Will probably do some flyfishing when down there on a family vacation this year.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

I know of quite a few guys who have deer leases in Mexico and seem to get along without problems. Most of them say once you get a little away from the border everything calms down.

That said, I had a client, a decade or so back, who owned an oilfield services company in West Texas. He leased an 8,000 acre ranch in Mexico to take clients/family. Said all was good until he had some local police come by and he gave them a doe one of his clients killed. That gradually turned into guys showing up demanding deer meat. Annoying, but nothing he couldn't handle.

It all came to a head one night when he said they broke the main rule or the lease; don't leave the ranch after dark. I forget the exact reason, but they took off in one Excursion and one F250 (two cartel favorites). They get pulled over by the police and spent an hour face down in the dirt with guns to their heads trying to prove they were not cartel. When that was over they went back to the ranch, grabbed a few things, and went back home the next day. Never went back to the lease and wrote everything off as a loss.

I'd still go on a hunt down there if I found the right one. Will probably do some flyfishing when down there on a family vacation this year.

Let us know how it went when you get back ... if you get back. I have been known to live life on the edge ... but would never take my family along for the ride.

 

[deewayne2003]

I normally do not participate at all and take a very passive stance on AH, but this post shook my innards and forced me to give my opinion. Forgive the lengthy post.

First off, nothing to do with education or the conquerors or anything like that at all. To give such a reference from a cosy armchair thousands of miles away in the comfort of a first-world home and safe environment without any knowledge nor exposure to said environment/context/country is misleading to say the least.

I think I am in a position to talk with some level of authority: I lived in Mexico from 2000-2022 and saw its demise into a very, very scary place. Everyone is free to do what they please, I just would like to give my view on this matter and offer a word of caution.

The things I heard, experienced and saw first hand (that cannot be unseen...) forced me to leave the country.

I know what I am talking about when I say you are not safe anywhere, maybe only in Yucatán and that is because is the residence place of the "big boys".

The Policia Federal now Guardia Nacional (paramilitary unifomrs), Policia (blue uniforms), Traffic Police (uniform varies according to State) are 99% corrupt and as dangerous as "los malos" (the bad ones) as they call the cartel guys there. The Policia Judicial (in plain civilian clothes) are an altogether different league, the worst of the worst, vicious unscrupilous dogs. To sum it up, I do not really know what is worse, to fall in the hands of any of the Police Forces or the cartels themselves! On a side note, cartels wear the same uniforms and set up the same check points...

The Armed Forces themselves which in the past were a source of pride have been corructed and now anything and everything requires a "mordida" (bite= bribe).

I know many Mexican hunters who are avoiding going to the Northen border States even though they are great hunting destinations. I have heard first-hand all kind of horror stories involving kidnapping, stealing guns, beat ups, robbery...anything you name it!).

Again, each of us decides what level of security (or lack thereof) they are happy with. I am not returning there, much less go to a far-off hunting area in the middle of nowhere.

I work for an NGO mostly in African countries under conflict. Suffice it to say I feel less at risk there than I did in Mexico.

Outfitters can and must sell you their truth. I know the truth and had to share it.

One member said he will return and his guy knows the guy and will be let through...good luck to him! Recipe for disaster.

My advice: AVOID MEXICO 100%

@Luis Medina - Thank you for sharing your honest opinion about the current state of Mexico as well as the educated arm chair quarterback statements…. I find both to be spot on!

For the rest of you thinking about going to Mexico, consider this…..

One of those leaked Hillary state department emails stated that…..

“There are two countries on earth in imminent danger of government collapse - Pakistan & Mexico.”

Let that sink in for a minute….

 

[Luis Medina]

My pleasure, I felt a duty to inform being in the most humble way in a position to do so.

Furthermore...

On the one hand, look up the ranking of countries according to homicides/violent deaths...Mexico is number 3 or 4 if I remember well. All top positions are countries which are enduring war! That should bring some perspective. Bear in mind that the figures the Mexican government shares are not truthful either...you can imagine!

On the other hand, many people are playing with the odds of "nothing happens until it happens"...but are you willing to endure the toll when it happens? Not me, residual risk is far too high even if "you know the guy who knows the guy". Been there, done that. Living on the edge or not if you want to feel how your nuts shrink just try it.

Furthermore,the government in Mexico is just a puppet controlled by cartels's interests. I do not deviate from the truth when I say Mexico is a country with a theatrical government and politics. Everyone knows the big "malos" are the one running the show. Period.

I could bore all of the audience down with countless events I have lived, seen and experienced but they are too gory and disgusting.I have seen acts of abussive behaviour, utter violence and plain vile unspokeable acts on human beings that would put any Middle Ages or Spanisj Inquisiciòn executioner to shame. These doings really defy any thoughts these people have a soul at all.

I repeat and will advise the same to anyone: avoid Mexico if you can!

 

[pilar]

I travel Mexico a lot , car , bus , train and only one place has been a huge problem
San Fernando !
San Fernando Has a huge concentrated cartel presence and I would say is dangerous to hunt and fish !
And this isn’t spoken lightly , as I have seen some crazy stuff in my days on earth
Any of the popular destinations have a huge police and military presence and I have never had a problem ( rule #1 is don’t seek trouble, and you won’t find any) in those areas.
Now my wife may disagree with me ( she had a military team chasing a el chapo rumor, come busting down a resort walkway with guns in hand while getting a spa treatment when I was swordfishing in Maztalan ) lol!
Common sense is your friend when hunting and fishing Mexico

 

[franzfmdavis]

All of these experiences are worth paying attention to. Fortunately, my experiences going to Mexico every year for 14 years in a row has been very pleasant and comfortable. We have always gone to the Cancun/Playa del Carmen/Cozumel area with many diving and fishing excursions outside of the resorts. Everyone has been very friendly and helpful. Perhaps that region is an outlier?

 

[Ontario Hunter]

@Luis Medina - Thank you for sharing your honest opinion about the current state of Mexico as well as the educated arm chair quarterback statements…. I find both to be spot on!

For the rest of you thinking about going to Mexico, consider this…..

One of those leaked Hillary state department emails stated that…..

“There are two countries on earth in imminent danger of government collapse - Pakistan & Mexico.”

Let that sink in for a minute….

Mexican government has been in a perpetual state of collapse for 600 years. Pakistan not much better but only seventy years.

 

[dchum]

My family has been visiting San Miguel de Allende for decades. It’s in the state of Guanajuato…. Top 3 Mexican states for murder rate historically. Never one bad experience. The bloodshed has nothing to do with American citizens.

Cabo San Lucas and Baja area? It’s full of Americans…. One of the best fisheries I’ve ever experienced. Just a standard resort town. Lots of fear mongering going on. One good thing is it’s keeping the Yankees away!

 

[Mort Hill]

I used to duck hunt out of San Fernando Mexico twice a year, up until the last trip several years back. An assortment of events told my inner self it was not worth it and the risk of leaving my family without a husband and father. Humorously, as we sat in the “red light, green light que” for our outfitter’s vehicle admittance into Mexico at MacAllen crossing, I stared at a Federali Humvee with a teenager poised on a 50 cal pointed at our vehicle. One of my compadres commented he hoped this young Federali had been given a good time by his girlfriend last night because we were one bad blowjob away from being blown to bits. Nervous laughter as the thought sank in. Upon our return to the states a week later, we learned the day before an RPG had actually been fired on the main road through Reynosa, the one we just drove, and that 8 human heads were founds in the duck hole we had previously just hunted. Haven’t been back no matter how much pleading I have gotten from the outfitter that “things are better now”. I concur that any place that cautions you need K&R insurance(kidnap & ransom) is no place for me!

 

[Pilgrim]

My family has been visiting San Miguel de Allende for decades. It’s in the state of Guanajuato…. Top 3 Mexican states for murder rate historically. Never one bad experience. The bloodshed has nothing to do with American citizens.

Cabo San Lucas and Baja area? It’s full of Americans…. One of the best fisheries I’ve ever experienced. Just a standard resort town. Lots of fear mongering going on. One good thing is it’s keeping the Yankees away!

My dad suffers from this same hazardous attitude: invulnerability, where he believes it will never happen to him. In a small way, he's right, it never happens until it does.

 

[BGGMKLR]

I normally do not participate at all and take a very passive stance on AH, but this post shook my innards and forced me to give my opinion. Forgive the lengthy post.

First off, nothing to do with education or the conquerors or anything like that at all. To give such a reference from a cosy armchair thousands of miles away in the comfort of a first-world home and safe environment without any knowledge nor exposure to said environment/context/country is misleading to say the least.

I think I am in a position to talk with some level of authority: I lived in Mexico from 2000-2022 and saw its demise into a very, very scary place. Everyone is free to do what they please, I just would like to give my view on this matter and offer a word of caution.

The things I heard, experienced and saw first hand (that cannot be unseen...) forced me to leave the country.

I know what I am talking about when I say you are not safe anywhere, maybe only in Yucatán and that is because is the residence place of the "big boys".

The Policia Federal now Guardia Nacional (paramilitary unifomrs), Policia (blue uniforms), Traffic Police (uniform varies according to State) are 99% corrupt and as dangerous as "los malos" (the bad ones) as they call the cartel guys there. The Policia Judicial (in plain civilian clothes) are an altogether different league, the worst of the worst, vicious unscrupilous dogs. To sum it up, I do not really know what is worse, to fall in the hands of any of the Police Forces or the cartels themselves! On a side note, cartels wear the same uniforms and set up the same check points...

The Armed Forces themselves which in the past were a source of pride have been corructed and now anything and everything requires a "mordida" (bite= bribe).

I know many Mexican hunters who are avoiding going to the Northen border States even though they are great hunting destinations. I have heard first-hand all kind of horror stories involving kidnapping, stealing guns, beat ups, robbery...anything you name it!).

Again, each of us decides what level of security (or lack thereof) they are happy with. I am not returning there, much less go to a far-off hunting area in the middle of nowhere.

I work for an NGO mostly in African countries under conflict. Suffice it to say I feel less at risk there than I did in Mexico.

Outfitters can and must sell you their truth. I know the truth and had to share it.

One member said he will return and his guy knows the guy and will be let through...good luck to him! Recipe for disaster.

My advice: AVOID MEXICO 100%

Luis
Very succinct and well- spoken....but above all...heartbreakingly sad.
The wonderful, generous, friendly people I first met back in the early 70's are still there in abundance, but their Country, their safety, their dreams, and their children's futures have dissappeared and...more likely than not...will never return.

Power corrupts.
Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

Regretfully
Spike

 

[BGGMKLR]

All of these experiences are worth paying attention to. Fortunately, my experiences going to Mexico every year for 14 years in a row has been very pleasant and comfortable. We have always gone to the Cancun/Playa del Carmen/Cozumel area with many diving and fishing excursions outside of the resorts. Everyone has been very friendly and helpful. Perhaps that region is an outlier?

No. It can happen anywhere.
Things are great until suddenly...they're not.
About three years ago three cartel sicarios pulled up to a beach at a top resort in Cancun on jet skis and opened fire. Turns out, they had found out that a couple of rival cartel hotshots were partying there with girlfriends.

Best
Spike