Why all the hate for CBL (Captive-Bred Lion) Hunting?

[375Fox]

Nice shot though I both admitted my mistake and apologized I don’t think that is within you

After 10 pages of direct public pressure after you refused to admit any wrongdoing. You can tell me where I’m wrong on CBL. I’ll likely look up the fact and provide the source to tell you otherwise.

 

[Rare Breed]

Your ignoring this thread trying to direct attention to me…can you not read…I admitted my mistake and apologized…what does that have anything to do with you bulling people about CBL hunting…come on man up

 

[375Fox]

Your ignoring this thread trying to direct attention to me…can you not read…I admitted my mistake and apologized…what does that have anything to do with you bulling people about CBL hunting…come on man up

I can read clearly. I can also read when you bring pricing into nearly every post you make. You made it a point to call me out directly. I try to stick to facts and provide the resources to back it up. Most on your side refuse to do that. There is a lot more to CBL than the tracking experience.

 

[Quest#1]

I will give him credit @375Fox doesn’t give up.
I know @Wishfulthinker580 commented that i keep this going by posting i should ignore. But damn hard to do when we continue to jam up the site with the same BS and 200 notifications that a person has stated the same damn thing. You win CBL hunting is evil everyone that doesn’t agree with you is going to hell and sole reason hunting is ruined.

Now Is that a hippo in water you are shooting in your avatar?

 

[Rare Breed]

I can read clearly. I can also read when you bring pricing into nearly every post you make. You made it a point to call me out directly. I try to stick to facts and provide the resources to back it up. Most on your side refuse to do that. There is a lot more to CBL than the tracking experience.

I only called you out for bullying people that's all...stating your opinion is respected...bullying people is not.

 

[HankBuck]

My dad usto rase pidgins for a man that used them for his dogs .
Said the same most quail were not strong enough for that.

I don’t know if any one doing it since me Brown died. Mr Brown put his on a high flying pen built on 7 acers if I remember right.
And sold them a little later along
His flew better from what I was told but they were twice as much to the quail hunt places.

@Flbt - I recall those Quail raise in big pens being billed as “Flight conditioned” birds and they did fly slightly better but still required DRY conditions. These Flight Conditioned birds were more like “athletes” compared to the regular pen raised “couch potato’s”

 

[Daisy]

After 10 pages of direct public pressure after you refused to admit any wrongdoing. You can tell me where I’m wrong on CBL. I’ll likely look up the fact and provide the source to tell you otherwise.

You “might” be right on CBL. You’re wrong on how you talk to people.

 

[375Fox]

I will give him credit @375Fox doesn’t give up.
I know @Wishfulthinker580 commented that i keep this going by posting i should ignore. But damn hard to do when we continue to jam up the site with the same BS and 200 notifications that a person has stated the same damn thing. You win CBL hunting is evil everyone that doesn’t agree with you is going to hell and sole reason hunting is ruined.

Now Is that a hippo in water you are shooting in your avatar?

I really can care less about the individuals that have chosen to shoot CBL. They made their choice. However, I think anyone considering CBL should know what they are beyond the tracking experience. Maybe we will never need to have the discussion again after the 2025 season.

That is most certainly a hippo shot in the water in my avatar. Shot on a community meat permit as well. The trophy is still there somewhere.

 

[375Fox]

You “might” be right on CBL. You’re wrong on how you talk to people.

That might be a correct statement but the tolerance for misinformation and misleading information I find unacceptable.

 

[Flbt]

In AH and in hunting in general you are part of a community.
The nature of a community is to enforce communal rules. Part of that is showing that you continue to be aligned with the spoken and unspoken rules of the community.
CBL is PR branding. It means ‘farmed lions’
I love hunting for so many reasons. It’s my biggest passion in life. African hunting is a subset of that. Farmed lions is disgusting to me and other conscionable humans. It’s affordable, it’s thrilling, it in some ways is comparable to other ugly forms of hunting (Texas high fence operations).
Some of us are speaking out to say that relatively inexpensive thrill seeking doesn’t justify the damage done by this farming practice

So we’re just going by your thought on the subject. Ok we are getting some where .

I did not sine up for any one’s rules when I started hunting. Me being at my dads and grate uncles knees. I probably picked up a lot from them. And they never cared about what someone thought

 

[Flbt]

In AH and in hunting in general you are part of a community.
The nature of a community is to enforce communal rules. Part of that is showing that you continue to be aligned with the spoken and unspoken rules of the community.
CBL is PR branding. It means ‘farmed lions’
I love hunting for so many reasons. It’s my biggest passion in life. African hunting is a subset of that. Farmed lions is disgusting to me and other conscionable humans. It’s affordable, it’s thrilling, it in some ways is comparable to other ugly forms of hunting (Texas high fence operations).
Some of us are speaking out to say that relatively inexpensive thrill seeking doesn’t justify the damage done by this farming practice

I thought of posting this it’s a grate uncle wording the best I can remember from about 79-80 so it’s by no means pc
When ask why he did something.
His answer the best I can remember
Who are you to ? Me.
I am 6’9” 300 lbs
I am free white 21
I wanted to is all the reason why I need

 

[Flbt]

Had no idea we had so many progressive post-modernists on this forum . With all the talk about subjectivity and the “how dare you judge me” attitudes

That’s really not all that progressive from where I am from.
You don’t tell me what to do or force me to do something
Is responsible for at least 3 wars and countless fudes in the south

 

[HankBuck]

I could be wrong, but from what I understand, SCI considers "estate" hunting to be on large properties with self sustaining herds as is common on Argentina and New Zealand. To my way.of thinking that would be very different than shooting a captive bred animal that is released into a smaller, strange (to the animal) property for the express purpose of being killed. Even completely free range animals will have a home range that they.live in.

@Doug Hamilton - SCI has NO specific or measured “Size requirements” for Fenced in game animals but they do state the animals must have terrain that provides “escape cover etc..”….unless there has been a recent change — I called and later emailed a person at SCI about 10 years ago and asked “Why does SCI not follow the same requirements as B&C and P & Y for recognizing trophies”? I was given a very thoughtful and detailed reply - which I respected but did not fully agree with. Also, any herd inside the fence does Not have to be ‘Self Sustaining’, friends that went to SA received Gold, Silver, & Bronze metals for everything they shot and none of their concessions were Self Sustaining - although some breeding might take place - new animals were being introduced regularly.
Regarding your last sentence “even completely free range animals will have a home range” - very true but even a whitetail deer Buck can disperse 20 miles in one direction from place of birth and 3 to 5+ miles or more in one direction during the rut and other animals range much farther —100s to 1000 square miles in their lifetimes. While I agree - the BIGGER the fence the more closely it replicates Free Range. One outfitter told me to remember in any Fenced concession THE FENCE is the most important part of the operation and it cannot be run as successfully or profitably with out a good & well maintained fence. If it could - no one would spend the $$ to put up miles of fence and maintain it.
Lastly, I am Not bashing hunting fenced concessions or even CBL - those decisions are up to the hunter and local laws. And many of my close friends hunt High Fence in Texas and SA — they enjoy it greatly.

 

[Flbt]

If you are going to put it that way I’d take into account the anti-poaching dollars one wild lion provides. It saves the littlest animals to the largest. In the event a pride male is killed, yes the youngest cubs will get killed by a new male, however many wild areas will rapidly decline without the money generated by hunting lion. The only money trail from CBL is to the farmer to farm raise more CBL lions for the next hunt. The game farm they shoot them on is a game farm with or without CBL. No money from CBL contributes conservation value just the farming supply chain.

So are you saying you would be ok with it now I’d the farms payed for a anti-poaching program?

 

[Flbt]

When a person disregards all consequences of their actions is that not what they are? All major hunting organizations aside from PHASA (who profit from it) condemn the practice but somehow hunters wanting to participate find a roundabout way to justify their actions.

There’s hunting organizations that don’t support dog hunting, trapping ect don’t make them right

 

[HankBuck]

I only called you out for bullying people that's all...stating your opinion is respected...bullying people is not.

@Rare Breed @375Fox ——. I enjoy many Posts from both of you past and recent…You’ve reached a DEAD END on this subject, maybe have a beer/scotch/bourbon (or 6 or 7) and accept this disagreement will Not be resolved. Best Regards

 

[375Fox]

So are you saying you would be ok with it now I’d the farms payed for an anti-poaching program?

I’m going to assume from your responses you’ve never been to Africa and simply want to argue. A farm they release CBL lions on is 2500-20000 acres. It is high fenced and all animals on it are property of the landowner. No one is encroaching on their borders. More CBL lions are released and shot on one farm than some entire countries have quota. A 100,000-500,000 acre concession area might only get 1 or 2 lions on quota. CBL is a farming supply chain model. Hunting wild lions is a conservation model.

 

[375Fox]

There’s hunting organizations that don’t support dog hunting, trapping ect don’t make them right

When every organization except the one that profits from the practice condemns it I’d say that’s a sign

 

[Wishfulthinker580]

That’s really not all that progressive from where I am from.
You don’t tell me what to do or force me to do something
Is responsible for at least 3 wars and countless fudes in the south

And yet the progressives say the same thing? It’s almost as if human nature is pretty consistent across the board.

I like history, heritage, patriotism as much as the next guy but it’s a bit much to bring that stuff up here.

We have laws that you follow do you not? That’s the federal, state and local governments saying what you can/can’t do so please spare me the war/feud nonsense.

 

[Rare Breed]

@Rare Breed @375Fox ——. I enjoy many Posts from both of you past and recent…You’ve reached a DEAD END on this subject, maybe have a beer/scotch/bourbon (or 6 or 7) and accept this disagreement will Not be resolved. Best Regards

lol!!! You are 100% correct! To be clear I both like and greatly respect @375 fox!!!! I will definetly buy him a drink when I see him!!!!