What's So Great About The 400 H&H?

[BeeMaa]

I guess if I were trying to sell these, I'd tend to cherry pick data sources and embellish the attributes also then shmooze C.B. a little for good measure

This is exactly where I was going...salesman doing salesman stuff.
Buyer beware...right?
I'd bet there were several people at that very booth who were tempted as you were @TOBY458.
Having a knowledge pool like AH to draw from helps one to make an informed decision.
A decision that could go either way.

It's my opinion that people will look for facts to back up their own thoughts on a subject.
Instead of trying to be objective and weigh the pros and cons of a particular purchase.
It's tough with rifles (or cars/women...etc), sometimes they just speak to you and you gotta have 'em.

I personally like the look of the 400H&H and having one next to my 375H&H would be pretty cool.
Truth is it would become a safe queen for me because of ammo availability.
Along with the other factors mentioned above, I'd have to pass on it until LOTTO calls.

 

[Wyatt Smith]

As cool as that 400 H&H is, I’m with @TOBY458 the Rem mag should work just as well. Not to mention available of ammo, brass, and 416 bullets are even easier to find.
But the 400 is cool.

 

[Pheroze]

And Pheroze, are you related to RIP?

Sorry, I missed this question first reading. My only relative on here is my son, but he has forsaken me for University, girls and other young man stuff

Truth is it would become a safe queen for me because of ammo availability.

Honestly, the dies and brass were easy to get. Bullets by CEB, with load data, and Swift (Bill Hober said the .001 will make no difference as the A-Frame will obturate to fill the bore). I totally get how the ease of the 416 RM appeals It's totally adequate, if that's your thing But, why not make that DG safari a bit more special? If you reload you too can join this unique and cultured group of 400 H&H owners... come and join us, we have tea and biscuits.

 

[BeeMaa]

Honestly, the dies and brass were easy to get. Bullets by CEB, with load data, and Swift (Bill Hober said the .001 will make no difference as the A-Frame will obturate to fill the bore). I totally get how the ease of the 416 RM appeals It's totally adequate, if that's your thing But, why not make that DG safari a bit more special? If you reload you too can join this unique and cultured group of 400 H&H owners... come and join us, we have tea and biscuits.

I'd love to join you in reloading my own cartridges...and owning a 400H&H.
But my wife knows me all too well...and reloading would not be good for me, or our bank account.
Let's just say I have a little German in me and things need to be precise.
To say that I would be completely consumed in load development is an understatement.
For now at least, I will stick with factory loads.

In the future I can see myself reloading a bit.
Along with owing a DG double and a Kipplauf mountain rifle.
Those dreams will have to wait a bit.
Appreciate the invite.

Can I come for the tea and biscuits anyway?

 

[Dirtdart]

There are probably very few members of this forum that are not older than the cartridge in question so, is it a classic? Practical? The laws of physics do not apply to cartridges with cool British surnames.

 

[Pheroze]

Can I come for the tea and biscuits anyway?

Any time friend

 

[TOBY458]

As far as Craig Boddington is concerned, @Bullthrower338 and I spoke with him about the 400 H&H at DSC this year. He had nothing really negative to say, but he admitted that the laws of physics do apply, and it offers nothing over what the 416 cartridges already offer. Don't get me wrong, I still like the idea of the 400 H&H, but having a 404 and a 416, leaves very little room in the safe. But what can I say? It's a 400. So what's not to love?!

 

[Pheroze]

As far as Craig Boddington is concerned, @Bullthrower338 and I spoke with him about the 400 H&H at DSC this year. He had nothing really negative to say, but he admitted that the laws of physics do apply, and it offers nothing over what the 416 cartridges already offer. Don't get me wrong, I still like the idea of the 400 H&H, but having a 404 and a 416, leaves very little room in the safe. But what can I say? It's a 400. So what's not to love?!

And that's the real truth. All these are in the same ballpark, performance wise. It just gives variety and that is a good thing.

I have often thought the 416 Taylor look would match my 308 NM, (lord knows, matching cartridge styles is important when it comes to firearms!) and give me access to a larger variety of bullets. But, I am committed to this build now, and I am happy with that.

 

[TOBY458]

And that's the real truth. All these are in the same ballpark, performance wise. It just gives variety and that is a good thing.

I have often thought the 416 Taylor look would match my 308 NM, (lord knows, matching cartridge styles is important when it comes to firearms!) and give me access to a larger variety of bullets. But, I am committed to this build now, and I am happy with that.

I'm all for you my friend! Looking forward to seeing the finished product!

 

[AZDAVE]

Salesmen will be salesmen all the 40's are pretty much in the same power level, ballistics and physics are so close does it really matter. Kinda like a right handed pitcher and a left handed pitcher throwing a 98 MPH fastball, same ball, same speed, just a different look from the batters perspective. Us gun cranks just love to argue the gnats ass details

 

[dchamp]

For kicks, giggles and just because, here is what everybody's favorite loading program QuickLoad has to say.

.416RM 23.6" barrel, 400gr Woodleigh, 10lb gun
76.5gr Varget, 2380 f/s, 58567psi, 51.78 ft-lbs recoil

.400H&H 23.6" barrel, 400gr Woodleigh, 10lb gun
75.0gr Varget, 2387 f/s, 63804psi, 51.5 ft-lbs recoil

I say pick your poison and Be Happy

 

[Bullthrower338]

And that's the real truth. All these are in the same ballpark, performance wise. It just gives variety and that is a good thing.

I have often thought the 416 Taylor look would match my 308 NM, (lord knows, matching cartridge styles is important when it comes to firearms!) and give me access to a larger variety of bullets. But, I am committed to this build now, and I am happy with that.

And for God’s Sake make sure your belt matches your boots on the range, the true definition of ammosexual! Gun cranks are all the same, we can justify just about anything in anyway! I love it!

 

[jacques smith]

Dont think an animal could tell the difference of 25 fps velocities or even 100 feet lb of energy
I have a 400 HH which ive grown very fond of. The only thing my 416 rigby excells in is more recoil
Placement remains paramount

 

[norfolk shooter]

My 416 Rem feeds like goose shit sliding down a waterfall, so that's no advantage for the 400.
Also the 416 can be loaded down to 450/400 level with no problem. So, strike two.
More case capacity for the 416 Rem, so pressure would be lower for similar velocity. Strike three!
Lol! I still think the 400 H&H sounds cooler, but that's about the only advantage as far as I can see.
I'm thinking Holland & Holland simply didn't want to put Remington's name on their rifles.

Buddy I think you have hit the nail on the head there. I can tell you why it sound cooler. Its because its British!! Trousers sounds better than pants. Pants is what I call undergarments!

 

[Excessexpress]

Gentlemen, you are most assuredly missing the point.

The H&H simply shoots a better class of animal than the “common” Remington.....

 

[CoElkHunter]

Again, a very interesting thread. Maybe if the .400 h and h had been designed and introduced
to the public before the .416 RM in 1989, things might have been different? Same for the .416 Ruger? But then again, the .416 Taylor was created in 1970 (?) but failed to gain widespread acceptance and only a few factory Winchesters (they dropped the ball!) were chambered for it before the Remington cartridge came onto the seen? Timing seems to play a HUGE roll in a cartridge’s success or obscurity? Just my two centavos!

 

[bruce moulds]

For kicks, giggles and just because, here is what everybody's favorite loading program QuickLoad has to say.

.416RM 23.6" barrel, 400gr Woodleigh, 10lb gun
76.5gr Varget, 2380 f/s, 58567psi, 51.78 ft-lbs recoil

.400H&H 23.6" barrel, 400gr Woodleigh, 10lb gun
75.0gr Varget, 2387 f/s, 63804psi, 51.5 ft-lbs recoil

I say pick your poison and Be Happy

note the pressure difference.
bruce.

 

[Dr Ray]

I believe the RM gets to max speed with about 77gr of varget while the H&H will do it with about 72gr. So, I think the recoil is less in the H&H. But, that's splitting hairs when firing a 40cal. The real difference is the RM is just ugly in comparison, and no one wants to find hunting glory clutching something so ugly.

Hey Pheroze - ugly!!
That’s not nice! Ugly indeed

 

[Pheroze]

Hey Pheroze - ugly!!
That’s not nice! Ugly indeed

 

[bruce moulds]

hey ray,
so you shoot an ugly cartridge in an ugly gun - not.
bruce.