What are your not-negotiables for a rifle?

[deewayne2003]

1. No muzzle brakes- I have hearing damage from guiding a careless deer hunter with Browning BAR .300Win with BOSS brake.

2. Detachable magazines - seen them lost too many times.

3. Blind magazines - just don’t like them.

4. Drop grips on hunting rifles - seems to be the latest trend but I don’t like them.

5. Weaver style rings and bases - just not a fan.

 

[Throwback]

I guess my take is slightly different. I love weapons so much I pretty much dont have anything that I wont try to work with. I certainly have preferences as many have outlined above, those are just preferences. These come into play when I am purchasing for sure.

I have rented rifles a lot in the last few years from outfitters and simply think of it as a challenge to myself to learn how to employ that weapons system effectively. This probably stems from being a former Marine but that is my approach.

I have learned I detest digital scopes though.

Depending on climate, my top preference is a wood stock, blued with a smooth action, crisp trigger and a short degree bolt throw. But hey, if all that is available for the task is a horrid synthetic stocked rifle missing its magazine, a broken safety and a digital scope, I will try my best to make it work.

Cheers

 

[coreydb]

Controlled Round Feed for dangerous game! Other than that I can be talked into just about anything. Even ugly meat sticks have a purpose.

I agree! Any gun will do as long as you will do. Everything else is subjective

 

[NIGHTHAWK]

I use a combination of what functions well and shoots accurately. This is across a wide range of makers, calibers, actions, magazine types, sight types, and additional accessories.

My preference is Left Hand now…

 

[Wiley64]

I am a simple man. I think plastic stocks are cheap and get worse with time and exposure to the elements. I like hinged floor plates, I detest the magazine craze. I also like scopes that are not too large. 3-9 or 3-15 is all you should ever need. Either leupold or any German brand. I also insist on classic cartridges instead of the latest and greatest. I like being able to by ammo at academy if need be. I also think slings should be leather and only placed on the rifle right before the hunt. No breaks for me… but I’m sold on suppressors. Guess I am all over the place.

 

[Hunter-Habib]

I try to keep a broad mind regarding all the firearms that I use. I don’t mind playing with different varieties, if they’re made well.

Nevertheless, I do have a few general preferences:

- I like wooden stocks more than synthetic ones. I prefer English, French, Turkish or Circassian walnut stocks to the porous Claro and open grained American walnut stocks (which are more likely to split/crack in heavy recoiling rifles)

- I prefer forged actions to investment cast actions. For a long time, the forged actions were perceived as being stronger than those formed by investment casting (although in recent years, I have seen quite a few impressively built investment cast actions being used in certain modern rifles).

- I really like Douglas Premium barrels. But in recent years, Pac Nor and Walter Lothar barrels have been really gaining popularity amongst custom rifle makers (and I suspect for good reason).

- The rifle should always come equipped with iron sights- Wide V backsights with an uncovered ivory bead foresight. If the rifle wears a telescopic sight, then it should be equipped with quick release mounts.

- The rifling should always be optimized for heavy-for-caliber bullets. It’s just my personal preference.

- I respect mercury recoil reducers & Limb Saver recoil pads, but for me… give me a good old fashioned India rubber recoil pad anyday.

- On rifles with hinged base plates, I prefer the magazine base plate release button to be located outside the trigger bow rather than inside (for example the Winchester Model 70 or the old BRNO ZKK600/601/602). If the button is located inside, then a small possibility always exists of the operator’s knuckle striking the button during recoil (it actually happened to me when employing a .458 Winchester Magnum BSA Majestic).

- I personally prefer to employ one bullet weight (usually the heaviest possible) for all my hunting purposes. If I am using a telescopic sight, then it will be zeroed in for the rifle’s maximum point blank range.

- I personally prefer hammer forged rifle barrels to button rifling or cut rifling, since hammer forging results in a harder barrel (really indispensable for steel jacketed FMJ or monolithic solid bullets). Barrel hardness should always be higher than 230 Vickers.

- In a double rifle, I always prefer a non automatic safety.

- In a double rifle with two triggers, I always prefer the front trigger to be articulated.

Things I avoid in a rifle ? Well:

- I disgust muzzle brakes. Those beastly things can eventually make you (and those around you) deaf. I know that they aid in managing recoil, but I personally prefer a smaller caliber rifle or a heavier weighted rifle than a large caliber one which is equipped with a muzzle brake. The muzzle flash is also a big no no for me.

- I try to avoid rifle mechanisms where the trigger sear also acts as the bolt stop (such as the old BSA CF2). After heavy use or wear (esp. in dusty conditions), the bolt can often completely come open into the operator’s hands during rapid cycling.

- I’m not particularly biased in the “Control Round Feed VS Push Feed” debate. But I generally avoid the Remington Model 700 factory extractor. Far too flimsy for my taste (esp. in Magnum length chamberings).

These are the two rifles which I use and hunt with the most.

A Churchill Gun Makers Model Deluxe in 7x57mm Mauser built in 1967 on a 1943 DWM Mauser Oberndorf Model 98 action.

A Remington Model 700 Kevlar Stock Custom in .375 Holland & Holland Magnum built in 1999 with an M16 extractor fitted to it by McBride’s Gun Works.

As you can see, the two rifles are quite different from each other in terms of styling. But both serve me extremely well to date.

 

[Alistair]

For hunting, my tastes are pretty traditional. My general parameters are below.

Things I feel strongly about:

1. Wood stocks. I've never owned a synthetic stock hunting rifle and I don't intend to. Synthetic is practical, but this is a hobby that I do for enjoyment. Pretty wood makes me happy, so I'll deal with the maintenance.

2. A sensible weight. Super heavy is silly, but I see no practical benefit to super light rifles either. Somewhere in the 9-11lb range when in 'field configuration' (i.e with scope, sling, a couple rounds) seems to be the sweet spot for small / medium bores. I'd happily go a couple lb heavier for 375 or above.

3. Top loading. I've had single feed detachable mags before, so not a hard and fast rule, but the ability to 'top off' quickly is a feature I value highly, so top loading capability is my strong preference. Detachable or floor plate I'm fairly ambivalent to, so long as it's secure, and I do have a slight preference for 5 rounds over 3.

4. No muzzle brakes or moderators. The first is obnoxious, the second cocks up the balance and is ugly. The cost / benefit simply isn't there and I do not like them. At all.

5. Slick feeding. I like a buttery smooth action, and I will deliberately take a less efficient long action round with a smoother profile to facilitate that. The .270 is especially good in this regard for smaller bores, .375H&H seems good for larger stuff.

Things I prefer, but aren't deal breakers:

1. CRF. This is a situational one. It's very important to me in a .375 upwards (non-negotiable), I do not care in the slightest for a smaller rifle.

2. The correct barrel length. Aesthetically, I think most rifles look best with a 24" barrel. Much longer than 26" looks odd (excepting maybe doubles), much less than "22 looks stubby (except perhaps on a stutzen). I'd buy the 'right gun' with a 20" barrel, but I'd never spec it that way myself.

3. Sling swivel placement. Ideally I want it on the forend for a light rifle, on the barrel for .375H&H or above. Not a deal breaker, but if I was building my ideal rifle...

4. Engraving. I like it, but I like it subtle. The British style I'm a big fan of, some of the deep cut relief stuff you see on Blasers, I do not like. At all.

Good:

Not Good:

 

[Ontario Hunter]

1) No detachable magazine for the same reason. I had one fall out of my 760 pump and it cost me a bull moose.

2) I prefer wood. Battle scars add character. If it bothers me, I will refinish the stock.

3) Definitely do not like muzzle brakes or suppressors. I shot a couple of animals long range with my PH's suppressed 270 WSM and it was a delight to shoot. Fortunately, he was carrying it not me. If I was a range junky, I might feel differently about suppressors. But for the little time I spend shooting paper it's just not necessary.

4) I prefer rifles and shotguns with some weight to them. Heavier rifle mitigates recoil. Heavier shotgun swings better. To me balance is most important and I have found very few lightweight long guns that balanced well. I carry this heavyweight old Browning humpback all day, day after day, every fall for six weeks hunting uplands. Unless the bag limit is filled, it's in my hands with sling detached. I can take it and I'm no body builder. Works for me. I miss very few birds or clays: my skeet average is 22/25 ... and I'm half blind (literally!). Loaded with three twelve gauge shells, 31" barrel, and dressed in plastic it weighs just a bit over ten pounds.
View attachment 660749
My 30-06 1903A3 weighs slightly more when fully loaded with six rounds. I can carry it all day no problem. And in rough country.
View attachment 660750
My 404J is a bruiser at over eleven pounds fully loaded with four rounds. I carried it all day for several days hunting buffalo in 2023. Yes, I notice the weight but my fragile retinas need it for recoil mitigation.
View attachment 660751
All guns are balanced perfectly at the forward half of floorplate (or just ahead of magazine loading port for A5). Balance is more important than gross weight.

5) Classic styling is not terribly important to me. Because I stalk big game up close and I'm often shooting moving targets, quick acquisition is more important than cosmetics. Monte Carlo cheekpiece is fine for getting me on the crosshairs in a hurry. Low European style comb not so much. Fit is paramount, especially for a quick shooter. My shotgun wears a slip-on recoil pad for extra LOP when shooting in shirt sleeves but it gets pulled off on extra cold days when I'm layered up. Not pretty but it works.

6) I agree about minimizing attachments. Tried a bipod for a while. Didn't work out. Throws off gun's balance and rarely practical. I do have quick detach rings and iron sights on both rifles. Good to have another option for adverse conditions or scope goes south. Again, maybe not the prettiest setup but it works. No lighted reticles. Just something to go wrong. I don't own a range finder or chronograph but contemplating buying the latter. I do reload.

7) I'm not into long range shooting, either at targets or animals. Sub MOA is overkill in my book. MOA is good enough for shooting big game out to 200 yards. Sub MOA for a dangerous game rifle is just silly.

Keep it simple. Don't overthink. Choose what works not what is trendy.

To add a few things:

8) Both my hunting rifles have 24" barrels and both balance perfectly. I suppose if one went with lightweight synthetic, it might be a good idea to go with a short barrel to retain balance. But then recoil and report would be magnified. There's no free lunch.

9) My 404 has a hinged floorplate and 03A3 is late WWII production with stamped bottom metal and fixed floorplate. Both work fine. A couple of times I tried filling the 404 box through open floorplate after loading the chamber. Definitely do NOT do this, especially with dangerous game rifles. It's a recipe for jam during cycling. I modified the extractors to snap over on a round dropped in the chamber. That's the proper way to fully load both of these CFR rifles. To unload both rifles I work the bolt vs opening the floorplate. Rounds can be pulled out with my fingers individually if the bolt is cycled slowly. Much better than picking them up off the ground after dumped through open floorplate. Hinged floorplate is handy for cleaning the magazine box but really how often does that need to be done? I think I may have cleaned my Springfield's mag box maybe twice in forty years. Didn't affect reliable operation in the least.

10) I prefer Model 70 style 3-position safety. Mostly because of its scope-friendly location, ease of operation, and positive locking the bolt when safety is engaged. Position 2 (safety engaged but bolt released for unloading) is nice but not essential.

 

[baxterb]

If it's not a Mauser, let it be a winchester.

 

[RyanPalmer]

@ontariohunter A5’s are my FAVORITE shotgun. New or old doesn’t matter to me. My wife finally tried my sweet sixteen and now I need to buy another one for myself.

 

[baxterb]

@ontariohunter A5’s are my FAVORITE shotgun. New or old doesn’t matter to me. My wife finally tried my sweet sixteen and now I need to buy another one for myself.

Likewise - I love the clanky noise they make. My 1985 magnum 20 is a pheasant and quail machine...

 

[Newboomer]

If it's not a Mauser, let it be a winchester.

Classic style. Crf. 3 position or tang safety. 20-24" bbl. caliber specific.
Decelerator recoil pad.
Leupold low power illuminated scope (1-4, 2-7). Detatchable mounts. Iron sight capable.
Absolutely no suppressors, brakes or ports.
Accuracy-2moa or better at 100m.

 

[Odinsraven]

Depends where I am hunting - UK vermin control - with the chance of a small deer - then a combi - 12 ga over 222 or similar.

Africa culling - sweet jeasus have taken it all from a 7x57 thru to a 375H&H - everything from plas stock to double rifle in 318 WR - if it will give me 1 moa and I don't usually shoot beyond 200m then I am good to go - detach mags yes on my 303 Rifles - always fun to turn up with three 10 round mags and one five-round for the photo ops! Then they realise you are kinda serious about culling but some of the Parker Hale factory barrelled 303 rifles - restocked etc are very accurate - especially with PPU ammo !

 

[MS 9x56]

No black plastic stocks. No muzzle brakes or flash suppressors. No AR’s, no pistol grips. No pistol cartridge rifles.

 

[MS 9x56]

Must have sights. Must have decent trigger. Must fit me. Must not be in a caliber I already have.

 

[Kevin Peacocke]

Perfect function
No bolt action
No muzzle brakes
No plastic stocks
Blued and walnut
Pleasing form that makes you happy to just look at it
No adornment, just plain as is

 

[Fatback]

For me, it has to be left handed.

No muzzle break.

I prefer blued and wood stocks but I do have a a couple of synthetic stocked, stainless barrel rifles. I feel they have their place in certain situations.

No detachable magazine

Prefer CRF but do have a couple of push feed rifles.

I prefer my rifles a little on the heavier side. I seem to shoot them a better.

 

[rookhawk]

Hi.

Like the title says, what are your not-negotiables when purchasing a new rifle?
Now this is obviously going to be a very personal thing and we are all going to have very different ideas on this.
My perfect rifle may be your worst nightmare!
But it's still interesting to hear other people's opinions a- and you never know, my mind might be changed.

Here a are a few of my not-negotiables...

1. NO detachable magazines. I won't buy a rifle with a detachable magazine. I especially don't trust budget rifles with plastic magazines that can wear, get lost or are unreliable.
Floorplates - or better yet, blind magazines for me.
I'll tell you a story... l hunted with a mate who had a Mossberg .308 with 10 shot magazine and we had to walk a fair way to get to our spot. Once we got there my mate somehow realised that he had somehow released his magazine on the walk and now he had a very awkward to load single-shot.
As a side note on the walk back he somehow found it again (!!!) but he never used that rifle hunting again.

2. NO wooden stocks. Once again a very personal choice and l have to add that l love the look of a nice wooden stock as much as the next person, but l absolutely hate scratching stocks, so fancy wood stocks are a no for me these days...
And unlike most people l actually don't mind the looks of a synthetic stock. I think practical has a certain beauty to it.
Having said that l believe that shotguns and quality air rifles SHOULD have a wood stock.
A nice shotgun with a synthetic stock just doesn't look right to me... so what l should've said is all my centrefire hunting rifles have synthetic stocks.

3. NO muzzle brakes. l have owned several big-bore rifles and l have personally never felt the need for a muzzle brake.
YMMV.
Sure, shooting a .458 off the bench is hard work but take your time, fold up a towel and put it between your shoulder and the rifle and hang on!
Once sighted in the hard work is done and l've never felt recoil in the field - even when l've been kissed by the scope.
Not judging other people for using a muzzle brake, they may have an injury etc... but personally for me, l don't want/need one.

4. Heavy rifles. Just sold my last heavy rifle and won't buy another. My hunting style consists of walking, and walking, and walking... yep, light rifles for me.

5. Classic styling. I prefer my rifles to have plain classic lines.

6. NO attachments. Personally - and for the type of hunting l do, l don't need flashlights, bipods or anything like that on my rifle. It just adds weight and l simply would never use them for my style of hunting.

So that's my personal not negotiables for when l buy a rifle.
l'm sure other people's are different and that's totally fine by me.

So what are your personal not-negotiable's when buying a new rifle?

Russ

Pretty good list from the OP. My agreement and amendments:

1.) Agree, no detachable magazines.
2.) Disagree, only wooden stocks. Nothing plastic gets more valuable with age. Nothing plastic is easily repairable.
3.) No muzzle brakes
4.) Only rifles of correct weight. I don't do heavy rifles, I don't do light rifles, I only do correct weight rifles and shotguns.
5.) English stocks on the shotguns, English stocks on the rifles. No montecarlos, no weatherby combs, no goofy stuff.
6.) No junk attachments.
7.) NO rifles that go down in value.
8.) No rifles that were not hand made. (call me a snob, but soulless mass manufactured junk and handmade guns are the same price)
9.) No polyurethane stocks, you cannot repair them.
10.) No through bolted stocks, they are oversized and inherently weak.
11.) No push feeds. Why pay the same price for inferior? It costs nothing more to have the best.
12.) No high rings
13.) No gigantic glass

 

[Badboymelvin]

Must feel good
Must look good
Operate flawlessly

I wont use a rifle that in my eyes is ugly or doesnt feel good in my hands

I love all makes of rifles and can adapt to any safety or bolt system easily but if i think its ugly its not gonna see the light of day

I absolutely agree
A good looking rifle (in my eyes at least) is a must.
Although all my centrefires have synthetic stocks now - and that might not appeal to many, all look good in my eyes.

Russ

 

[Badboymelvin]

Controlled Round Feed for dangerous game! Other than that I can be talked into just about anything. Even ugly meat sticks have a purpose.

I also agree.
All my .458's, .375's and my 425 Express have been CRF.

Russ